Things are getting complicated..LEON

[missmiss]

Okay, so how does one revoke their PR once they are already in the country, but do not meet the residency obligations? My brother was away for some time, and he is really below the residency requirement days. Somehow, he was able to come back into Canada like many on this forum, and no one asked him anything at at POE. Now he is determined to live here, and is committed. IS this OKAY? Is this legal to do so? Can someone report him and get him into trouble? If so, how?

I got RQ'd and I will have to state that he did not live in Canada all this time. I am not sure if the officers use this info against him, and how they would do so.... but am told it is possible to harm him this way. All this has got him seriously considering just revoking his PR before things get complicated.... what do you think? PLEASE HELP!

 

[newtone]

Dont worry you are over killing yourself thinking about things that are really not complicated. There are lots of loop holes in the immigration system which make it easier for people to meet PR requirements and get citizenship without having to physically be present in Canada. So dont worry about this issue its very minor atleast he is physically in Canada no one can do anything

 

[Leon]

If immigration were to find out that he is in Canada and doesn't meet the residency requirements, they could call him in for an interview and he could be in trouble. I do not know if they would take it seriously if somebody were to report him but if he were to apply to renew his PR card at this point or apply to sponsor a relative, they would know.

As his PR has not been revoked, he is still a PR and it is perfectly legal for him to live and work in Canada.

 

[newtone]

The only time I can see them doing this is if he were to commit a crime like murder otherwise the Canadian government neither has the time, money or resources to run around policing immigrants. As a matter of fact if they even propose to do something like this I could easily see a class action law suit against the government. The media will have a field day with front page reports like "Police State" or "Nazi Canada" or "Wild Wild Canada".

Most importantly he is here and does not have to worry about anything

 

[Leon]

newtone, if he committed murder, he would be deported based on criminality. If he doesn't commit any crimes, it's very unlikely that he will get caught for not meeting the RO after he already slipped in, except if immigration happens to find out about him by chance. This would happen if he applies to renew his PR card before he meets the requirements or if he applies to sponsor a relative. In her case, it may also happen because she applied for citizenship and got an RQ and the RQ asks her to write where her family has been living for the past few years including her brother. She asked if she were to write that her brother has been living outside Canada for more than 3 years before recently returning, would immigration become aware that he doesn't meet the requirements and would he have a problem. My reply to that was that it could happen.

Immigration is currently oblivious to the fact that her brother is living in Canada without meeting the RO. She is about to tell them. What they do with that info if anything is another story.

 

[missmiss]

Ok so I am in a pretty bad position obviously, it all rests in my hands! I can't lie, so either I tell the truth which will look SO bad for him when I say he was out for 3 years and here only a few months including now.... it's like pretty bad. ... OR I just don't answer RQ. I'd like to know what would happen in both cases. If I say the truth, they will be on his case asap, or will they wait until he applies for PR/citizenship to "catch" him?
If I don't answer RQ, will that put me in a really bad position? Will they stay after me until I answer? How bad can it be?

 

[Leon]

If I say the truth, they will be on his case asap, or will they wait until he applies for PR/citizenship to "catch" him?

If I don't answer RQ, will that put me in a really bad position? Will they stay after me until I answer? How bad can it be?

If you tell the truth, I do not think anybody can tell you what would happen because this is not such a common situation. I have not seen anybody post about such a situation before or what happened afterwards.

If you don't answer the RQ, your citizenship application will eventually be considered abandoned. You can read about this here: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/bulletins/2013/ob476B.asp

There would be no consequences for you if your application would be considered abandoned and you would be free to apply again at a later date, see http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-93-246/page-8.html#docCont 11. (10) at the bottom of the page.

 

[missmiss]

Yes, i see that it is an interesting scenario, it is not so common, and no one ever thinks of these situations. It's a good heads up for people whom decide to come back with out meeting the RO...... sure there are loopholes in the system.... but at the same time, you just never know how they can find you out! No one thinks of the RQ.... totally unexpected, so perhaps it is a good idea to include this in the equation when people are considering to "take the risk". My point is, it does not necessarily stop at POE. Once in, one is faced with other challenges too. In any case, like I said before it is unusual to me - even if it is protocol - that they should ask one person for details of others. Unless they are 100% only using this info to judge MY case - which we don't know and won't know for sure - it is honestly not fair, and I doubt even lawful, to inquire to this extent. For me to have to write the EXACT dates of ins and outs of other family members when they are not dependent on me, or my immediate family like spouse etc... what is that?!

 

[Hasher]

I assume you are only asked to reply where your family members are "in Canada or outside Canada".

Your reply should be in Canada - that's it.

They are not asking his residency calculation or for how many days he was in or out of Canada - unless you want to.

 

[missmiss]

the exact question is:

"where have your family members lived since your arrival in Canada"

"Name / DOB / Relationship / To / From / Country"

It is kind of hard to say simply Canada, when it is not the case !!

 

[Hasher]

Now again, did they asked about your brother and sister as Family or your Husband and childeren as your family.

If it is about your brother then you just reply:
Name: XYZ
DOB: XXXXXX
Relationship: Brother
To: XXXXX
From: XXXX
Country: XXXX (whereever he was actually)

Now with above information there is very rare possibility they will chase your brother anyway unless as Leon said "he applies to renew his PR card before they meets the requirements or if he applies to sponsor a relative"

However, if you provide CIC with his PR card copy, his telephone number and other IDs than it is a good possibility they might come after him. But I know one case of my colleague his ex-wife even provided all these proof after divorce to CIC but so far he has not been contacted by CIC, its about an year now.

I think CIC would not take the chance to go after him, becoz if he by some means prove you wrong then you and CIC both in trouble. Therefore, CIC only go after those who misrepresent by themselve or send something by their own signature, and such cases are not in hundreds infact in thousands pending with CIC. Again, there is possibility that based on your information your brother might get in trouble but is a very rare posiibility.

 

[SenoritaBella]

It is obviously not an easy decision if you take into account the what ifs as pertains to your brother. You both made choices and it is not fair that yours or his choices should impact one another. However, you have been asked questions which you need to be truthful about for your own sake and peace of mind.

I would fill out the forms truthfully and let the chips fall where they may. Your brother managed to get in so his best chance is to begin establishing strong ties to Canada such as a job, apartment/house, school, friends, volunteer work, member of organizations, etc. This way, even if CIC were to come after him for not meeting residency obligations, a lawyer can argue he is taking steps to become established and be a contributing member of society. The rest of the stuff, you really can not control.

 

[Msafiri]

I'd go with Hasher on this on the premise that you are not your brother's keeper. If you go with providing the details I'd again go with that this is predominantly used to identify your ties to Canada not to track down PRs included therein and if they meet the RO.

Inadmissibility on RO failure is often applicant driven - busted at the POE, applied for TD, PR Card or Sponsorship while not meeting the RO. This forum is full of such examples where people who tried to play the 'PR is a special visitor status not for me to reside in Canada' game and have had this backfire on them. The only time CBSA/CIC will likely come after you other than in this scenario is where there is serious criminality e.g narcotics etc or intelligence pertaining to say fraudulent/ misrepresentation during PR acquisition - for some reason refugee cases and family sponsorship feature high on this.

CIC don't have the time or resource to chase up your family...they can't even keep a presence across some significant geographical parts of Canada with multiple local offices being closed!