Singapore timeline

[Bangkokcanuck]

I am aware that January 20th until now is nowhere near 20 months, I was curious about how it's possible for someone else to get it done in 4 months and I just added in some basic info about my case on top.

Because every case is different and how much proof history etc you have and how easy it is or isn't to confirm has to be taken into account. Also as someone else said it depends on your VO and the way they operate etc...

It's definitely true that I haven't spent years and years with my wife in person. It's impossible, I'm a middle class and overtaxed Canadian, I can't just take 6 months off at a time to be with her. If I'm unemployed and broke, that's probably a large dagger in our case file as well.

Nothing is impossible and I wasn't implying you should be broke or that your relationship isn't real due to the lack of in person time, simply hoping you would see that because there is such a small amount of time together that could be considered a red flag for a VO and in turn it might take them longer to confirm in their eyes how legit you are.

I am aware that one of the big issues is that the Canadian Government doesn't want an influx of scam marriages, although plenty of them get through anyway. I would like to believe a scam marriage would involve fairly wealthy people from outside of Canada (my in-laws do "well" but are not rich). And for whatever profit a potential scammer would gain, having their father tag along for the ride would cut into the profits sharply too. And the odds of bringing in American relatives to 3 different cities for the various wedding activities would be a stretch.

you are quite right scam marriages are not good for anyone involved in the long run. I think you will find that a lot of the time scam marriages do not only involve wealthy people from outside of Canada but rather poor people from outside of Canada looking to escape poverty etc in their country and find a better life in the great white north.

So just look at what you said, you spoke of bringing your father along and relatives to 3 different cities.. don't you think that is the sort of thing they would want to check to make sure it's legit? Just because you said so in your file is not enough, so take into account some of things you've provided as part of your proof and that those things need to be confirmed and that too takes time. Also if there is a big education or age gap between you and your wife. On this part I know of what I speak as my wife is Thai and Vietnam is considered to be a step lower on third world country development chart so that as well will make sure all the things you've sent are checked our thoroughly.

Ultimately I understand that this is still fairly early in the proceedings, and I am more impatient than I am upset.

As we all were when we were stuck in this mind numbing process, I am not trying to rain on your parade just pointing out that you can't compare your case to any other cases and that there are a ton of factors that go into determining what they consider to be real or not. This takes time no way around that and as hard as it is for middle aged over taxed Canadians just hang in there and don't make it worse for yourself by putting undue stress on yourself as this process is hard enough on it's own.

Good luck.

 

[mirjahan]

hum ?? I thought your wife's file start with F ??

We never received anything (in form of letter), we only receive from email. SG typed in te wrong address for my wife, we email them and got reply with the file number start with F.

Sorry my bad . I did mistake on typo. My wife file start with F+9 digits.

 

[trungngan]

Sorry my bad . I did mistake on typo. My wife file start with F+9 digits.

Danny4450 thinks the system changed after 2011, so all the app whom apply after Jan 2011 with have file number start with F

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/aor-letter-t79484.0.html

 

[Sunshineee]

Hi All! Thank you so much for everything

For our process, we just did all things organized. Pay in advanced. Organized all the documents, read all things in details and submit it.

It's been a miracle for us...we're so blessed!

I do agreed with Cheers, I don’t think it doesn’t matters much how long have you been married and stayed together for. So it really depends on the VO in charge, you can provide all the documents (perfect and straight forward according to you) but the VO may look at it in a completely different way. No case is straightforward and in another way, every case is ---- it's the VO who decides which one is. Nothing you or I can do about it ...

Just keep praying & faith, positive thinking, get ourselves busy--- help us not being frustating n stress waiting...

I hope this all will help you..
wish you all the best!!

have a great weekend...

 

[Bangkokcanuck]

I do agreed with Cheers, I don't think it doesn't matters much how long have you been married and stayed together for.

I disagree with you actually it has to matter to some degree. The whole point of this is that the VO and CIC are trying to prove whether they think a marriage is real or not. Hard to argue that people that don't even live together at all for any length of time can offer up the same kind of proof to their VO.

Look at it this way if you are a VO and you have two files, one shows a couple that met (whether online or off I don't think it matters) dated, (whatever you want to call it) for a few months etc, got married and then lived together for say the next year... the second couple met in the same way, met at the same time and married at the same time, but after the honeymoon one flew to another country and they did not see each other for the next year.

you can say all you want about well we talked every day and we know each other so well etc..etc.. but there is no substitute for living with someone and dealing with them in real life on a daily basis. I am NOT saying that you can't or don't have a real marriage if you don't life together, only that you have to look at it from the VO's point of view... if you were in their shoes and being honest with yourself it is hard to compare the two relationships.

Not to mention the type and amount of proof a couple living together can provide would likely be more and more substantial than a couple living in different countries. Again it does not mean you can't have proof or that it wouldn't be accepted as many people are approved when living apart, but you have to look at the VO's POV and understand why such a case might sometimes take longer to research and approve.

The key remains to put together best application you can and be prepared to defend to the death...

 

[Cheers]

How do I know what is a VO's POV - to each his own. How do you define a person's psychology, to me a marriage can be very happy living apart (during the application processing) and can be very unhappy living together and vice versa. This is a complex matter, hard to rule with one or two variables.

Now, my underlying assumption in all my posts is we are talking about outland application. For a couple living together for a year and then sponsoring the spouse (assuming the other, husband or wife is a Canadian citizen or immigrant) should be, according to me, significantly low. If I plan to settle in Canada, why would I wait for 1 year to get started with the process - when I know that I have to be in Canada to sponsor my spouse. Now if I am applying for immigration, I'd have to apply for both. The only option we are left with, when a person meet someone, dated for sometime and got married and is now living apart from each other and hence applying for spousal sponsorship.

I don't know, but may be Canuck is very much on the point. I just don't see the option myself. The other possibility could be for people who are self employed.... well thats a different ball game, they can do whatever they want, cause they don't depend on others as much as the ones who are not self-employed to earn a living.

 

[baobaowaiting]

Thanks everyone for the support and encouragement.

It was a stroke of luck that my Michigan relatives were already vacationing in Vietnam at the time of my marriage. I included their full names, and American addresses in our application. I included pictures of them at the various venues for our 3 receptions as well.

I am older than my wife, I am a 1979, and she is a 1986. But I don't think that it should stand out too much as an age gap like this is not terribly uncommon in Toronto.

We were able to get our marriage license in Vietnam stamped quickly due to a family emergency back home in Toronto, and my mother's relatives were able to lobby on my behalf to get it done quicker than usual (I believe it usually takes at least 6 weeks instead of just under 4).

Regardless, I miss my wife so much every day, lucky for us we can still communicate via webcam and affordable long distance phone calls via Startec.

 

[Bangkokcanuck]

How do I know what is a VO's POV - to each his own. How do you define a person's psychology, to me a marriage can be very happy living apart (during the application processing) and can be very unhappy living together and vice versa. This is a complex matter, hard to rule with one or two variables.

You are still missing the point. Not sure how to get you to understand what I am saying. Of course a marriage apart can be happy and one together can be unhappy, but we are not talking about that. We are talking about a gov't employee that needs to ticks the boxes in their job, those tick boxes must be applied.

Look at it this way, if the VO as part of their job description has to confirm or deny A, B, C and D. Due to the human nature of what is being checked there is no hard and fast rule of yes or no for everything, so then personal perspectives come into play also human nature, as like it or not the VO's at the end of the day are human and their experience in doing the job makes them take note of things that YOU or I might consider to mean nothing.

Assume the above checklist is as follows (simply for example purposes)

A.- Length of time knowing each other before marrying.
B.- Age/Education differences between partners
C.- Total time physically together since being married
D.- Knowledge of marriage of both partner's friends/family

So if a VO asks you to prove your marriage is real and you knew each 6 weeks before you married, there is 15 years difference you have a University degree and your partner doesn't, you've lived apart for the year since being married and one of the families has never met the spouse only heard about them and seen pictures. It is very possible that the marriage in question is real and as legit as any other, but from the VO point of view it takes LONGER to prove that. That is the crux of the matter so many people complain about why is my file still inactive after 6 months and this or that person was approved after 4 months. They fail to take into account the time factor to find the proof of their claims in their application.

Also just to clear up one error you made in your post you do NOT have to be living in Canada as a Canadian citizen to sponsor your spouse outbound. I have lived abroad for almost four years now and sponsored my wife from Thailand.

The bottom line to all of this which I am getting tired of explaining is when my application was approved in four months I had all sorts of people post and say I'm happy for you and PM me and say I'm happy for you BUT... how come my application is taking so long. I try to explain to them they have to use a critical eye when looking at their app and understand that even if they are 100% real due to some things in their application it might take LONGER TO PROVE IT. does not mean they are lying or won't be approved just that certain things take longer.

I think you will agree the number of cases of fraud that have happened over the years involving a couple that is married and living together for years is very very low compared to quickie marriages with the couples then living apart it doesn't take a genius to see that pattern and hence the VO works harder, hence longer to make sure they have satisfied their burden of proof.

My wife and I used to laugh when we talked about CIC deciding if our marriage/life was real or not. We have known each other for six years, two before we married, two more before our son was born and now two and change since then. Does it make sense that we spent the last six years of our lives together and had kids simply to scam the CIC out of a PR card? That does not make our relationship any more real than yours or anyone elses, BUT for the VO it does make it easier for them to check their boxes during their investigation stage and hence many times a simple case is done more quickly.

I give up trying to explain this anymore as I think it's so obvious and the amount of time that it is taking some people to be approved based on their circumstances bears this out IMHO.

I wish you all good luck and hope your waiting is over soon.

 

[sovo]

IMO it depends on the VO examining the application. Sure they do have checklist to follow or to aid them in their decision, however, different VOs have different thought process and different experiences. They make decisions bases on what they were trained to do plus from experience. For example, age difference may be considered a red flag, but if a VO is aware of the social norm of that certain culture, it may not be a red flag to one VO while it is to another who is not aware of it. Another example but a little off topic is the custom officers. Why do the person in front of you gets process faster than you while you get hammered with questions. Again there are many factors that are involved, but to say that VOs don't affect processing time is kind of hard to believe.

Sure they have checklists, but they do have the ability to decide based on training and experiences if certain red flags are really a red flag. Those who are less experienced may interpret it differently from others.

 

[Bangkokcanuck]

but to say that VOs don't affect processing time is kind of hard to believe.

Who said that?

 

[sovo]

Who said that?

Just my thoughts

 

[Cheers]

You are still missing the point. Not sure how to get you to understand what I am saying. Of course a marriage apart can be happy and one together can be unhappy, but we are not talking about that. We are talking about a gov't employee that needs to ticks the boxes in their job, those tick boxes must be applied.

Look at it this way, if the VO as part of their job description has to confirm or deny A, B, C and D. Due to the human nature of what is being checked there is no hard and fast rule of yes or no for everything, so then personal perspectives come into play also human nature, as like it or not the VO's at the end of the day are human and their experience in doing the job makes them take note of things that YOU or I might consider to mean nothing.

Assume the above checklist is as follows (simply for example purposes)

A.- Length of time knowing each other before marrying.
B.- Age/Education differences between partners
C.- Total time physically together since being married
D.- Knowledge of marriage of both partner's friends/family

So if a VO asks you to prove your marriage is real and you knew each 6 weeks before you married, there is 15 years difference you have a University degree and your partner doesn't, you've lived apart for the year since being married and one of the families has never met the spouse only heard about them and seen pictures. It is very possible that the marriage in question is real and as legit as any other, but from the VO point of view it takes LONGER to prove that. That is the crux of the matter so many people complain about why is my file still inactive after 6 months and this or that person was approved after 4 months. They fail to take into account the time factor to find the proof of their claims in their application.

Also just to clear up one error you made in your post you do NOT have to be living in Canada as a Canadian citizen to sponsor your spouse outbound. I have lived abroad for almost four years now and sponsored my wife from Thailand.

The bottom line to all of this which I am getting tired of explaining is when my application was approved in four months I had all sorts of people post and say I'm happy for you and PM me and say I'm happy for you BUT... how come my application is taking so long. I try to explain to them they have to use a critical eye when looking at their app and understand that even if they are 100% real due to some things in their application it might take LONGER TO PROVE IT. does not mean they are lying or won't be approved just that certain things take longer.

I think you will agree the number of cases of fraud that have happened over the years involving a couple that is married and living together for years is very very low compared to quickie marriages with the couples then living apart it doesn't take a genius to see that pattern and hence the VO works harder, hence longer to make sure they have satisfied their burden of proof.

My wife and I used to laugh when we talked about CIC deciding if our marriage/life was real or not. We have known each other for six years, two before we married, two more before our son was born and now two and change since then. Does it make sense that we spent the last six years of our lives together and had kids simply to scam the CIC out of a PR card? That does not make our relationship any more real than yours or anyone elses, BUT for the VO it does make it easier for them to check their boxes during their investigation stage and hence many times a simple case is done more quickly.

I give up trying to explain this anymore as I think it's so obvious and the amount of time that it is taking some people to be approved based on their circumstances bears this out IMHO.

I wish you all good luck and hope your waiting is over soon.

Hey Canuck,
You are right, my mistake on the citizen part..but the immigrant has to be in Canada(I think) to sponsor their spouse.

Now, see I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong or questioning why yours or someone else's file takes less time than the others. I completely understand that this is very much case-specific and the VO dealing with your file. However, one point that I would have hard time to rationalize is why a VO would take longer without even opening and doing a background check on a file he/she finds suspicious. Leaving a file without doing anything is not going to solve or change anything other than causing someone to suffer from living apart.

It is and always will be a mystery to me. And I'd not try to see a VO's POV cause I ain't one.

 

[Bangkokcanuck]

Hey Canuck,
You are right, my mistake on the citizen part..but the immigrant has to be in Canada(I think) to sponsor their spouse.

I believe you are quite right, if a PR yourself you must reside in Canada during the sponsorship process.

Now, see I am not trying to prove anyone right or wrong or questioning why yours or someone else's file takes less time than the others. I completely understand that this is very much case-specific and the VO dealing with your file. However, one point that I would have hard time to rationalize is why a VO would take longer without even opening and doing a background check on a file he/she finds suspicious. Leaving a file without doing anything is not going to solve or change anything other than causing someone to suffer from living apart.

Agreed, but how do we know that a VO didn't even look at a file? Nobody here knows one way or the other what goes on behind closed doors. As said in another thread I believe I was led to believe that they did a triage of sorts on the files and any that had what their office considers to be red flags were put in a deeper look pile and those that appeared to be straight forward on the surface were put on another track. Which makes perfect sense to me.

Look at it this way if a file comes in the office and files are done FIFO to completion a file that is taking forever to confirm interview etc
could very well be holding up many files behind it in queue that would have been basic rubber stamps in their simplicity. So if the triage theory is correct it does in fact make perfect sense, it would mean ALL files are looked at and assessed up receipt and the times for processing do make sense. They just don't seem fair to those waiting.

I thought my wife and I had a rock solid simple as they come case, it appears SG agreed we were done in four months, but my wife just spoke to a friend of her's that had her file done in only three months... so go figure something in that file was even easier to have done... just the way it is.

It is and always will be a mystery to me. And I'd not try to see a VO's POV cause I ain't one.

But if you tried to see their POV it might reduce your stress level or that of others that assume one size fits all...

Anyway interesting thread to be sure, time to get back to real life.. take care.

 

[Cheers]

[quote Agreed, but how do we know that a VO didn't even look at a file?]

It shoudn't have taken as much as what they have so far, however I must be wrong as Singapore treats the countries listed under (their jurisdiction) as (perhaps) full of people who don't have the rights/need to live a conjugal life like some of the fortunate countries. People talk about high percent of marriage scams (in countries covered in Singapore) without actually having a stats in hand. Now it is a different subject matter, but it hurts. As a Canadian Citizen I feel aweful about this, however not sure how many would agree with me on this. Just a personal perspective.

[quote Look at it this way if a file comes in the office and files are done FIFO to completion a file that is taking forever to confirm interview etc
could very well be holding up many files behind it in queue that would have been basic rubber stamps in their simplicity. So if the triage theory is correct it does in fact make perfect sense, it would mean ALL files are looked at and assessed up receipt and the times for processing do make sense. They just don't seem fair to those waiting. ]

When you are not sure about anything you look for an answer, however if it doesn't hurt you bad, I doubt how hard you try. This is an office who doubt people's honesty by making them wondering.......what if. It takes them (may be for 30-40% of the cases) 10-15 months (???, don't know) to ask for an interview (cause they have a processing time of 21 months, they can go do WHATEVER) no wonder we evolve as human not so long ago. As a tax payer, I see my money (and of course of million others) goes into something totally "IGNORANT".

Like you said this is an interesting thread!!

 

[arunkumar_c]

I am not blaming anyone or finding fault with anyone.

We can make out reasons for why some ppl got their visas faster than the others. But no one knows. It could be as simple as some one dropped all the files to the floor and they lost the original order in which the files were stacked and they couldnt be bothered to re-stack it the way it is supposed to be.

But i cannot buy into the reason for why some files are just sitting in a stack collecting dust, labelled "complicated" and nothing being done on it for 21 months. The incubation period doesnt make that case genuine or any less genuine. A sensible way to deal with complicated case is to let the applicant know that they are not happy with what has been presented, and ask for more proof, more face to face interview or something ... and not let the person waste 21 (may be in 2 months this might jump to 24 months) months of his life time.

I have come to accept that the immigration process for family sponsorship is not the best, sometimes even bordering unfair, but what can we do, just play by the rules and accept the system, and hopefully one day, the VO is happy enough and let our families be united again, or be happy with what canada has offered us thus far and migrate to another country.