Residency Obligations & Renouncing PR Status

[TReimann]

Yes, like @zardoz says, once you renounce your PR you are effectively entering Canada as if it were your first time again, but it might be your only way.

Unfortunately it's the consequence of not maintaining your PR through your residency, or becoming a citizen of Canada (and yes, I'm well acquainted with German rules on dual citizenship).

Well, it comes down to the question of whether or not

Once you renounce your PR status, all your previous time spent in Canada or as a PR will be completely irrelevant to any new application. You will be applying for PR from scratch, same as any other foreign national.

You have no H&C reasons to keep your Canadian PR status, so your only possible way to keep your PR status is to enter via a USA land border, hope you aren't reported for Residency Obligation violation, and then stay inside Canada for 2 straight years without leaving for any reason. If you can't commit to do this, then there is practically no chance for you to keep your current PR status.

Renouncing your PR status is the only way you'll be able to get an eTA approved and fly to Canada directly. As mentioned once you renounce, you'll need to re-apply from scratch under an economic immigration stream if you ever want to re-apply. None of your PR/citizen family in Canada can sponsor you. If you don't qualify under an economic immigration stream (based on your education, work experience, age, etc etc), then realistically you will never be able to live in Canada as a PR again.

Interesting, and very helpful once again. I wish I had known about this website earlier... the information I manged to get here in less than 8 hours, is far more useful than anything I was able to obtain in 8 weeks from IRCC directly.

A couple of questions regarding your points on keeping my PR status...

If I enter Canada via a USA land border as a short term visitor (i.e. 2-3 weeks to visit family), how could I be reported for Residency Obligation violation if I'm visiting as a foreign visitor, on a foreign passport? If I have a return flight going back from the US, I don't see how that could be considered a violation. My understanding is that the eTA is only required for public travel (i.e. airlines and busses). Prior to the eTA enforcement, I never had issues travelling to Canada as a visitor via my German passport.

You mentioned that keeping my PR status would require me to stay inside Canada for a straight 2 years without leaving for any reason. Does this also include short term leaves out of the country? The reason I'm asking is because according to the online information, a person retains their PR status, if they have been physically present in Canada for a minimum of 730 days within the five (5) years. It doesn't state anywhere that those 730 days must be consecutive. Also, what would this mean in terms of working in the country over the 2-year period? Would I be legally entitled to work during those 2 years (I still have a valid SIN number), or would I need to re-apply for PR status first? If my intention is to return to Canada, I could obtain a work VISA or sponsorship from my current employer, who is also based in Canada. Obviously I would prefer not to do that if it's not necessary.

As for qualifying under one of the economic immigration streams, it's a bit difficult to predict. I have a skilled profession, and worked in Canada for several years in the same/similar field prior to my relocation to the UK. I also have a Canadian post-secondary degree, and immediate family who still lives and works in the country professionally. What I don't have going for me anymore is age. I also have a wife and child, who are both European, which also seems to deduct points. It's really a shame that there are no better options available for someone like myself, who has worked and paid their taxes in Canada for the majority of their adult life.

 

[TReimann]

One thing that was never clarified in this post, what citizenship does your wife hold? You said you both like to travel to Canada yearly to visit family and friends. Is she by any chance Canadian? If she is, then we are playing an entirely different ball game here.

I actually just mentioned this in my last reply. Unfortunately my wife is a European national (same as me), and to make it worse, she does not have any kind of PR status, nor has she ever lived in Canada.

 

[TReimann]

I actually just mentioned this in my last reply. Unfortunately my wife is a European national (same as me), and to make it worse, she does not have any kind of PR status, nor has she ever lived in Canada.

Also, as I noted in that reply, it sounds like re-applying for PR status could be very dicey for us, hence why it may be a better option not to renounce all together at this point... I have a skilled profession, Canadian education and I still have Canadian Citizen family members living in Ontario, but i'm certainly not the youngest anymore, and I would be moving back with a wife and child. It seems that the latter two are no looked on too favourably if re-applying for PR from scratch.

 

[Rob_TO]

If I enter Canada via a USA land border as a short term visitor (i.e. 2-3 weeks to visit family), how could I be reported for Residency Obligation violation if I'm visiting as a foreign visitor, on a foreign passport? If I have a return flight going back from the US, I don't see how that could be considered a violation. My understanding is that the eTA is only required for public travel (i.e. airlines and busses). Prior to the eTA enforcement, I never had issues travelling to Canada as a visitor via my German passport.

It depends entirely on the CBSA officer you happen to get. If when scanning your passport they see you're a PR, or if they simply ask if you're a PR to which you must answer honestly, you can be sent for secondary inspection. They can easily learn you don't meet the RO, and report you.

Lots of this is entirely luck, who you talk to, and what questions they happen to ask.

You mentioned that keeping my PR status would require me to stay inside Canada for a straight 2 years without leaving for any reason. Does this also include short term leaves out of the country? The reason I'm asking is because according to the online information, a person retains their PR status, if they have been physically present in Canada for a minimum of 730 days within the five (5) years. It doesn't state anywhere that those 730 days must be consecutive.

If you really want to keep your PR status, you can't step foot outside Canada for any reason or duration during these 2 years.

Usually the 2 years doesn't have to be continuous, however you are in violation of the RO already. So if you left Canada while in violation of the RO, upon returning you'd just put yourself at risk to be reported again and wasting this whole effort.

During these 2 years you also can't have any contact with IRCC, which means you can't sponsor your wife or child for PR. They would need to stay in Canada as visitors only for many years, meaning unable to work and most likely no access to healthcare.

Overall the process of staying in Canada 2 years and being unable to travel or sponsor your family, may be incredibly difficult.

Also, what would this mean in terms of working in the country over the 2-year period? Would I be legally entitled to work during those 2 years (I still have a valid SIN number), or would I need to re-apply for PR status first? If my intention is to return to Canada, I could obtain a work VISA or sponsorship from my current employer, who is also based in Canada. Obviously I would prefer not to do that if it's not necessary.

If you enter Canada as a PR, then as long as you have a SIN you can legally work. You don't need a valid PR card to work.

If you renounce PR status, your employer would need to go through complex LMIA process to hire you. This is not guaranteed, as they would need to prove a Canadian/PR could not be hired for the role instead.

 

[Alurra71]

Ah, I see.

If you enter Canada via a US land border you are still entering as a PR regardless of what passport you hold. You are legally a PR until you have had it revoked or have relinquished it.

To keep your PR status (if you are not reported for failure to meet RO at the border) yes, it would require you to stay for a full 2 years to come back into compliance without leaving. If you leave, just once, you then again are at risk of being reported for breach of RO when you try to again enter. Since you are currently well outside of your RO then you would need to remain inside Canada for the full 730 days. Even if you stay long enough to renew your PR remember that this is a requirement for every rolling 5 years. If you renew, then leave at say 850 days and remain somewhere else for 121 days, you are now again in breach of your RO because you only have 729 days inside Canada in the last 5 years. You would be legally allowed to work during that time because you have a SIN.

The biggest hurdle I can see for you here is that your wife and child would likely not be able to remain with you for the entire 2 years. Since they require, at minimum an ETA to travel to Canada and you are in no position to sponsor them for PR.

Best of luck to you in whatever you choose to do!

 

[TReimann]

Ah, I see.

If you enter Canada via a US land border you are still entering as a PR regardless of what passport you hold. You are legally a PR until you have had it revoked or have relinquished it.

To keep your PR status (if you are not reported for failure to meet RO at the border) yes, it would require you to stay for a full 2 years to come back into compliance without leaving. If you leave, just once, you then again are at risk of being reported for breach of RO when you try to again enter. Since you are currently well outside of your RO then you would need to remain inside Canada for the full 730 days. Even if you stay long enough to renew your PR remember that this is a requirement for every rolling 5 years. If you renew, then leave at say 850 days and remain somewhere else for 121 days, you are now again in breach of your RO because you only have 729 days inside Canada in the last 5 years. You would be legally allowed to work during that time because you have a SIN.

The biggest hurdle I can see for you here is that your wife and child would likely not be able to remain with you for the entire 2 years. Since they require, at minimum an ETA to travel to Canada and you are in no position to sponsor them for PR.

Best of luck to you in whatever you choose to do!

Thanks for that. I didn't realise that travelling to Canada as a "short-term" visitor via a US land border is also a violation if I'm using a foreign passport... even if I still have a PR status. I guess it does make sense though, it just doesn't seem to be explicitly stated anywhere.

As for my family, this may not be such a big hurdle. My wife already has an eTA, which allows her to travel to Canada as a visitor, and my son is still less than a year old. We have a property in Europe, so my wife and child could travel between both countries over the 2 year period. If my PR status is renewed after the two years, do you know how long after that it would take until I would be in a position to sponsor them for PR.

 

[TReimann]

It depends entirely on the CBSA officer you happen to get. If when scanning your passport they see you're a PR, or if they simply ask if you're a PR to which you must answer honestly, you can be sent for secondary inspection. They can easily learn you don't meet the RO, and report you.

Lots of this is entirely luck, who you talk to, and what questions they happen to ask.



If you really want to keep your PR status, you can't step foot outside Canada for any reason or duration during these 2 years.

Usually the 2 years doesn't have to be continuous, however you are in violation of the RO already. So if you left Canada while in violation of the RO, upon returning you'd just put yourself at risk to be reported again and wasting this whole effort.

During these 2 years you also can't have any contact with IRCC, which means you can't sponsor your wife or child for PR. They would need to stay in Canada as visitors only for many years, meaning unable to work and most likely no access to healthcare.

Overall the process of staying in Canada 2 years and being unable to travel or sponsor your family, may be incredibly difficult.



If you enter Canada as a PR, then as long as you have a SIN you can legally work. You don't need a valid PR card to work.

If you renounce PR status, your employer would need to go through complex LMIA process to hire you. This is not guaranteed, as they would need to prove a Canadian/PR could not be hired for the role instead.

Thanks! As I just replied to another posting, I didn't realise that travelling to Canada as a "short-term" visitor via a US land border is also a violation if I'm using a foreign passport... even if I still have PR status. I guess it does make sense though, it just doesn't seem to be explicitly stated anywhere.

Regarding sponsorship for my family... you mentioned that they would need to stay in Canada as visitors for many years. If my PR status is reinstated after the two years, do you know how long after that it would take until I would be in a position to sponsor them for PR? My assumption would be that I should be able to sponsor them once my full PR status is reinstated (so shortly after the two year period).

 

[Rob_TO]

Thanks! As I just replied to another posting, I didn't realise that travelling to Canada as a "short-term" visitor via a US land border is also a violation if I'm using a foreign passport... even if I still have PR status. I guess it does make sense though, it just doesn't seem to be explicitly stated anywhere.

It's not a violation, as long as you aren't overtly deceiving or lying to CBSA. If you simply enter on a foreign passport, are never asked about your PR status, and are simply waved in, then that is fine.

Regarding sponsorship for my family... you mentioned that they would need to stay in Canada as visitors for many years. If my PR status is reinstated after the two years, do you know how long after that it would take until I would be in a position to sponsor them for PR? My assumption would be that I should be able to sponsor them once my full PR status is reinstated (so shortly after the two year period).

Basically as soon as you hit the 2 year mark to come back into compliance with the RO, you would then be able to submit an app to sponsor your family for PR, as well as submitting an app to renew your PR card.

 

[TReimann]

It's not a violation, as long as you aren't overtly deceiving or lying to CBSA. If you simply enter on a foreign passport, are never asked about your PR status, and are simply waved in, then that is fine.



Basically as soon as you hit the 2 year mark to come back into compliance with the RO, you would then be able to submit an app to sponsor your family for PR, as well as submitting an app to renew your PR card.

Thank you!

 

[zardoz]

Instead of "violation", think of it as "not being in compliance with".
Every and any time that you interact with either CBSA or IRCC, your compliance can be checked and if you are found wanting, you may be reported for that, potentially leading to PR status revocation. It's not criminal but administrative.

 

[Yose]

Why didnt anyone mention here that he will probably have a high score in CRS despite his age bec of his Canadian education and work experience?

Wouldnt that work to his advantage?

 

[dpenabill]

I didn't realise that travelling to Canada as a "short-term" visitor via a US land border is also a violation if I'm using a foreign passport... even if I still have a PR status. I guess it does make sense though, it just doesn't seem to be explicitly stated anywhere.

@Rob_TO sufficiently stated a response.


A Longer Explanation:

A PR can travel to Canada as a short-term visitor. Purpose and duration of travel does not affect the PR's status. (Canadians living abroad commonly visit Canada.

However, a PR cannot enter Canada with the immigration status of a "visitor" because a PR is a Canadian, and only non-Canadians (Foreign Nationals) are eligible for temporary status, such as visitor status. (Reminder: Under Canadian law, Canadian PRs are Canadians, NOT FNs.)

Regardless of the documentation a Canadian PR presents to CBSA officers at a PoE, if the PR is waived into Canada without further examination or report regarding PR Residency Obligation compliance, the PR enters Canada with the status of a PR. Again, even if the PR is simply waived through the PoE after presenting a foreign passport.

It is of course misrepresentation and a crime for a PR to deceive border officers. So it is one thing to casually present a foreign passport, and get waived into Canada, which is OK (which may seem like being allowed entry as a FN visitor but the PR's status is still that of a PR not a FN visitor), BUT quite another to deliberately conceal information from the border officer let alone to overtly give false information to a border officer.

In any event, both the statutory provisions and IRCC information about eligibility to travel to Canada clearly do explicitly state these things, albeit perhaps not in terms of a FAQ type answer. For example, the online information about visitor status clearly states this is ONLY for Foreign Nationals; the IRRP defines FNs to be persons who are NOT a Canadian, explicitly specifying Canadian citizens and Canadian PRs.

 

[SdV1980]

What a helpful post - just wanted to say thank you for the contributions.

I would like to ask whether, if one decides to rescind Pr status and reapply, if these applications could be logged together or if they need to be processed sequentially. Eg could I apply for express entry and when invited to apply submit both the application to rescind and the new application? Perhaps with a letter explaining my reasons for not having met the residency obligation the first time around. My reasons are not H&C related unfortunately.
Thank you once again for the very useful information.

 

[scylla]

What a helpful post - just wanted to say thank you for the contributions.

I would like to ask whether, if one decides to rescind Pr status and reapply, if these applications could be logged together or if they need to be processed sequentially. Eg could I apply for express entry and when invited to apply submit both the application to rescind and the new application? Perhaps with a letter explaining my reasons for not having met the residency obligation the first time around. My reasons are not H&C related unfortunately.
Thank you once again for the very useful information.

You need to rescind first. At the time you are selected through Express Entry (i.e. receive ITA), you must qualify to apply. Existing PRs don't qualify.