Ray of Hope - 90th Draw

[Polarbear1]

With all this discussion on degrees n diplomas..suddenly it struck me! I HAVE A DIPLOMA I COMPLETELY FORGOT ABOUT....wonder if it will be the keyI have a DOEACC O Level and a diploma in computer applications, ERDCI, Government of India ( both one year courses done alongside graduation). Could it improve my score? Pl advise.

 

[Aukhan]

Hi everyone i just need to get some information..... I am in the pool with 435 since December.... These points are with my Bachelors Degree in Engineering..... Know i just want to know that if i also get wes for my post graduate diploma that is of 18 months tenure..... will it help me to increase my crs or not thanks....

 

[abnzyr18]

With all this discussion on degrees n diplomas..suddenly it struck me! I HAVE A DIPLOMA I COMPLETELY FORGOT ABOUT....wonder if it will be the keyI have a DOEACC O Level and a diploma in computer applications, ERDCI, Government of India ( both one year courses done alongside graduation). Could it improve my score? Pl advise.

If WES/IQAS determines it to be a recognised one, then yes it could.

 

[abnzyr18]

Hi everyone i just need to get some information..... I am in the pool with 435 since December.... These points are with my Bachelors Degree in Engineering..... Know i just want to know that if i also get wes for my post graduate diploma that is of 18 months tenure..... will it help me to increase my crs or not thanks....

You need to get it evaluated from WES/IQAS. If they say it is valid and recognised then you can claim points for "Two or more degrees" option in CRS calculator.

 

[nt13]

After reading some of the posters comments on two or more degrees points, It seems they are very unclear or misinformed about it. Any one with Two post secondary credentials, one of them 3 years or more long will be awarded points for two or more certificates, diplomas or degrees points if the credentials are assessed as Canadian equivalent by one of the authorized organizations such as WES, IQAS etc. Your second degree does not need to be completed after Bachelors.

Lets look at the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (SOR/2002-227).

Education (25 points)

• 78 (1) Points shall be awarded, to a maximum of 25, for a skilled worker’s Canadian educational credential or equivalency assessment submitted in support of an application, as follows:
  • (a) 5 points for a secondary school credential;
  • (b) 15 points for a one-year post-secondary program credential;
  • (c) 19 points for a two-year post-secondary program credential;
  • (d) 21 points for a post-secondary program credential of three years or longer;
  • (e) 22 points for two or more post-secondary program credentials, one of which must be a credential issued on completion of a post-secondary program of three years or longer;
  • (f) 23 points for a university-level credential at the master’s level or at the level of an entry-to-practice professional degree for an occupation listed in the National Occupational Classification matrix at Skill Level A for which licensing by a provincial regulatory body is required; and
  • (g) 25 points for a university-level credential at the doctoral level.
• Marginal note:More than one educational credential
  (2) For the purposes of subsection (1), points
  • (a) except as set out in paragraph (1)(e), shall not be awarded cumulatively on the basis of more than one educational credential; and
  • (b) shall be awarded on the basis of the Canadian educational credentials or equivalency assessments submitted in support of an application for a permanent resident visa that result in the highest number of points.

http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/page-18.html#docCont

Those who are saying second degree must be after bachelors should read above. 78(1)(e) clearly says two or more post-secondary program credentials. Basically you can claim points for all post secondary credentials which are assessed as Canadian equivalent by one of the designated organizations such as WES, IQAS etc. One of the credentials must be assessed as 3 years or long degree , diploma or certificate and other one can be assessed as minimum one year long program BEFORE or AFTER the 3 year long Degree. If you are still confused then more clarifications are here-

Two or more post-secondary credentials (three-year or longer post-secondary credential required)
Points: 22

Designated organizations assessment outcomes
A three-year or longer post-secondary credential in combination with any of the post secondary educational credentials listed below. This excludes secondary school credentials.

Post-secondary educational credentials could also include post-baccalaureate or post-graduate credentials as follows:

• 
  
  
  • Post-bachelor’s certificate
  • Post-undergraduate certificateFootnotei
  • Post-bachelor’s diploma
  • Post-undergraduate diplomaFootnotei
  • Graduate certificate
  • Graduate certificate with a focus in [area of concentration]Footnotei
  • Postgraduate certificate
  • Postgraduate diploma
  • Graduate diploma with a focus in [area of concentration]Footnotei
  • Graduate diplomaFootnotei
  • Two-year postgraduate diploma, specializing in [name of discipline]
  • Two-year bachelor’s degree after a degree with a focus in [area of concentration]Footnotei
  • One-year postgraduate certificate in [name of discipline]
  • One-year of graduate study with a focus in [area of concentration]Footnotei
  • Study toward a master’s degree

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/operational-bulletins-manuals/permanent-residence/economic-classes/federal-skilled-workers/selection-criteria-education-equivalency-assessment-outcomes-education-points.html

All confusions should be clreared by the sentence marked in Blue color above. It says Post-secondary educational credentials could also include post-baccalaureate or post-graduate credentials. They said "Could Also" which means other sections such as "One year program", "Two year programs" also counts.

If you are still confused then I am sorry no one in the whole Universe can make you understand.

Good Luck!

Well explained! But this has brought out 2 important points that even I had not focussed on / or I am rather confused now as to what I have declared in my EE profile is right or not.

1. The Footnotes specifically speak about the designated organisations which are allowed to provide ECA outcomes to most of the degrees listed therein. Which in most of the cases is ICES or IQAS, and WES isn't reflecting.
2. How to read your ECA assessment as mentioned in
https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/immigrate-canada/express-entry/become-candidate/eligibility/education-assessed/read-report.html

Now in my case, I my CRS jumped from 402 to 434 after I got my Long Distance Certificate course evaluated. My query for some valuable inputs (to help understand if I have got it right or not) is as below:

1. I got my second certificate (Long Distance Program in Management) evaluated by WES, which is where I got my engineering degree evaluated from. Will this be correct? Or is ICES or IQAS the right designated authority to get it evaluated?

2. My Evaluation report reads: " Completion of Executive Management Program offered by a graduate school of business". Nowhere does that mention the length of the program or anything like "Post Bachelor's ......" or "One Year Post Graduate Certificate in .....", etc. like the options provided in the link above.

I have selected "2 or more degrees / certificates" option and provided the ECA # for both in my EE profile as I believe I have done everything right. Can someone just help reinforce / provide more clarity, if the choices are correct given above information.... as I do not wish to be presenting any incorrect information.

TIA!

 

[nt13]

Same here..im on 440..but my bday is coming on aug1st which would decrease my points by 5..i am not going to retake ielts..waiting the cut-off to drop to 439 by june..all the best to you too!

For all those here who are worrying on their birthdays making them lose 5 points, just to tell you I had first created my EE profile way back in end of 2015. The scores were predominantly high those times. Due to age, I kept losing 5 points every birthday in last 2 years (which was anyways in the 410-420 range despite high CLBs). Only recently after creating EE profile in Jan.18 with 402, did I realise that my second degree (which was a long distance program and not approved earlier - I had checked that way back in end of 2016 for my institute), was now being assessed and approved.

Got that done and now on a CRS 434. And know what, I will lose another 5 in this July, much ahead of everyone with 440s here and still fearing losing 5.

Just be patient for a while, your time is round the corner!!!

Good luck.

 

[Reddiered07]

For all those here who are worrying on their birthdays making them lose 5 points, just to tell you I had first created my EE profile way back in end of 2015. The scores were predominantly high those times. Due to age, I kept losing 5 points every birthday in last 2 years (which was anyways in the 410-420 range despite high CLBs). Only recently after creating EE profile in Jan.18 with 402, did I realise that my second degree (which was a long distance program and not approved earlier - I had checked that way back in end of 2016 for my institute), was now being assessed and approved.

Got that done and now on a CRS 434. And know what, I will lose another 5 in this July, much ahead of everyone with 440s here and still fearing losing 5.

Just be patient for a while, your time is round the corner!!!

Good luck.

Thanks a lot for the encouragement..let's hope that the draw size increases to 3750 or 4000 from next draw onwards which would give a ray of hope for people like us sitting in mid 430's and above

 

[ishq74]

Well explained! But this has brought out 2 important points that even I had not focussed on / or I am rather confused now as to what I have declared in my EE profile is right or not.

1. The Footnotes specifically speak about the designated organisations which are allowed to provide ECA outcomes to most of the degrees listed therein. Which in most of the cases is ICES or IQAS, and WES isn't reflecting.
2. How to read your ECA assessment as mentioned in
https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/immigrate-canada/express-entry/become-candidate/eligibility/education-assessed/read-report.html

Now in my case, I my CRS jumped from 402 to 434 after I got my Long Distance Certificate course evaluated. My query for some valuable inputs (to help understand if I have got it right or not) is as below:

1. I got my second certificate (Long Distance Program in Management) evaluated by WES, which is where I got my engineering degree evaluated from. Will this be correct? Or is ICES or IQAS the right designated authority to get it evaluated?

2. My Evaluation report reads: " Completion of Executive Management Program offered by a graduate school of business". Nowhere does that mention the length of the program or anything like "Post Bachelor's ......" or "One Year Post Graduate Certificate in .....", etc. like the options provided in the link above.

I have selected "2 or more degrees / certificates" option and provided the ECA # for both in my EE profile as I believe I have done everything right. Can someone just help reinforce / provide more clarity, if the choices are correct given above information.... as I do not wish to be presenting any incorrect information.

TIA!

Lol again same old interpretation! You do not need Post bachelors or Post graduate, you just need a certificate, diploma or degrees which is done Post secondary and assessed as Canadian equivalent minimum one year long credential by one of the designated organizations. Yes World Education Services (famously known as WES) is an authorized organization. Your credential must be matched with one of the listed credentials mentioned in the link you have shared. You may argue that no where is written that it must be at least one year long. Answer to this question is- when we fill out education history section in EE profile, for the level of the credential we only get options below-

• secondary
• one year certificate
• two year certificate
• bachelors or 3 or more year certificate
• master
• PhD

Now tell me which option you would select if your ECA does not specify the length or it says One semester? You may say you would choose based on your actual transcript but this will not work unless ECA report support it. Also your educational institute must be recognized by ECA report to claim points. You may contact with WES and ask them to mention about the length of the program.

 

[Maverick28]

Maverick...
Do we need something specific to be written in ECA by WES to qualify for two degrees after 10th....like will it work if they write "Secondary school diploma" or do they have to write as "2 year diploma" or it does not matter...please suggest

If it mentions "Secondary School Diploma" then you can't claim points for 2 or more degrees. Usually they mention "Secondary School Diploma and Diploma 2 years" or just "Diploma 2 years". If that is the case, you can claim points for 2 or more degrees.

 

[Maverick28]

I do not know how the system works in practice. As Nomad wrote, the system calculates points for us.

However, based on the info from official website it looks like that in her case, she will get 13 (all Clb7) or 25 points (all clb 9) for combination of language and education depending on the IELTS score and not 25 or 50 as it would be the case with two degrees (skill transferability).

In the education section, points awarded would be 119 or 128 depending on personal status.

Nomad please share your personal situation and tell us how the system calculated points for you in both sections.

Not sure how you deduced this...

I think you are getting confused with this line in the CRS Table:
Two or more post-secondary program credentials AND at least one of these credentials was issued on completion of a post-secondary program of three years or longer

It says Post Secondary, not Post Graduate... post secondary here means after secondary school.... No matter when you did your diploma, if your ECA says its post secondary, then that is what it is. The equivalency in ECA is what matters and not the original program.

 

[Maverick28]

Hello here is my score, copied from my EE profile.
CRS - Human Capital - Level of Education 119
CRS - Human Capital - First Official Language Proficiency 125
CRS - Skill Transferability - Education 50
CRS - Skill Transferability - Foreign Work Experience 50

@Ovcar looks like they got 50 points here..

 

[dodogirl]

@Ovcar looks like they got 50 points here..

That is based taking into consideration the IELTS score.

 

[Maverick28]

Well explained! But this has brought out 2 important points that even I had not focussed on / or I am rather confused now as to what I have declared in my EE profile is right or not.

1. The Footnotes specifically speak about the designated organisations which are allowed to provide ECA outcomes to most of the degrees listed therein. Which in most of the cases is ICES or IQAS, and WES isn't reflecting.
2. How to read your ECA assessment as mentioned in
https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/immigrate-canada/express-entry/become-candidate/eligibility/education-assessed/read-report.html

Now in my case, I my CRS jumped from 402 to 434 after I got my Long Distance Certificate course evaluated. My query for some valuable inputs (to help understand if I have got it right or not) is as below:

1. I got my second certificate (Long Distance Program in Management) evaluated by WES, which is where I got my engineering degree evaluated from. Will this be correct? Or is ICES or IQAS the right designated authority to get it evaluated?

2. My Evaluation report reads: " Completion of Executive Management Program offered by a graduate school of business". Nowhere does that mention the length of the program or anything like "Post Bachelor's ......" or "One Year Post Graduate Certificate in .....", etc. like the options provided in the link above.

I have selected "2 or more degrees / certificates" option and provided the ECA # for both in my EE profile as I believe I have done everything right. Can someone just help reinforce / provide more clarity, if the choices are correct given above information.... as I do not wish to be presenting any incorrect information.

TIA!

You don't get this option of "two or more degrees" in EE profile. You just select the correct equivalency of each degree and the system calculates the points based on the information you provided.

 

[Maverick28]

That is based taking into consideration the IELTS score.

Yeah I know.. CLB 7-8 gives 25 and CLB 9-10 gives 50...

Ovcar was saying that this will not be the case. It will be 13 with CLB7-8 and 25 with CLB9-10.

I am just trying to get rid of the confusion here. Saw the same confusion in the other thread too. So trying to explain how the system works, in case someone does not know.

 

[dodogirl]

You don't get this option of "two or more degrees" in EE profile. You just select the correct equivalency of each degree and the system calculates the points based on the information you provided.

That is correct. The equivalency should be as per the ECA report for the certificates assessed.