PRTD for PR card renewal

[Tinaturner]

Hello,

My pr card renewal application was referred to the local office . I received a mail for RO and additional documents. However after sending the requested documents , I received another mail stating that since I am outside canada I should apply for a travel document for pr abroad and send a copy of the travel document to the local office to continue working on the pr renewal application. The mail states that I should send the travel document before January 2016.

My questions are :

1- what will happen to my PR status if I do not apply for the travel document and send it to the local office before January 2016

2- what will happen to my pr status if my travel document is rejected and I appeal but do not go to canada for the appeal

3- last but not least, when applying for the travel document, do I have to submit the original passports that I have used in the past five years ? What if I do not have the original passports as I renewed my passport and the government takes the old passport to provide a new one . I only have photocopies of the old passport

Appreciate your advice

Regards

 

[M.R.S]

Same case here, they asked me to apply for PRTD and it was approved in 2 days as this is the standard procedure for PR outside Canada.

Read this thread

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/pr-card-renewal-rq-and-now-travel-document-requested-t314849.0.html


and this bulletin

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/bulletins/2013/ob536.asp

Hello,

My pr card renewal application was referred to the local office . I received a mail for RO and additional documents. However after sending the requested documents , I received another mail stating that since I am outside canada I should apply for a travel document for pr abroad and send a copy of the travel document to the local office to continue working on the pr renewal application. The mail states that I should send the travel document before January 2016.

My questions are :

1- what will happen to my PR status if I do not apply for the travel document and send it to the local office before January 2016

2- what will happen to my pr status if my travel document is rejected and I appeal but do not go to canada for the appeal

3- last but not least, when applying for the travel document, do I have to submit the original passports that I have used in the past five years ? What if I do not have the original passports as I renewed my passport and the government takes the old passport to provide a new one . I only have photocopies of the old passport

Appreciate your advice

Regards

 

[Tinaturner]

Hello M.R.S

Thank you SO MUCH for the links provided . I think i found the answer i was looking for , however i would to run it by you to make sure i understood correctly.

In the Bulletin you provided , it is mentioned that :

However, if a residency determination cannot be made based on the information at hand and the CIC agent is aware that the applicant is outside of Canada, the applicant should be directed to apply for a Travel Document (Permanent Resident Abroad), also referred to as a PRTD, at the nearest Canadian visa office and to forward a copy of the PRTD to the CIC office once obtained. Communications with the applicant should be sent to their last known address in Canada. As per standard procedure, the application must be set aside for the 180 day compliance period.

Finally, if the applicant does not apply for a PRTD or provide notification to the CIC office that they are in Canada within the 180 day period, the CIC agent should declare the application abandoned. A notice must be sent to the applicant by regular mail advising that the application is deemed abandoned, and explaining that a new application and fee will be necessary should the applicant wish to receive a PR card in the future.


So does this mean that after 180 days, if i do not provide the PRTD (because i simply did not apply for it) my PR renewal application will be abandoned but i will NOT lose my PR status ? and i have to apply for another PR application after meeting the residency obligation again ?

Thanks for your help

 

[M.R.S]

Hi,

Yes i believe you are right that you will not lose PR Status but keep in mind one thing that you have to apply again for PR Renewal and the 5 year window for residency obligation will be counted from the day you apply for PR Renewal again.

I am at loss to understand why you are not going to apply for PRTD. I applied for PRTD and was approved in 2 days because the RO screen in Foss matched with the details i provided to local CHC for PRTD and my PR Card Renewal was also decided same day and now my ECAS show that my PR Card application is approved and will be available for collection.

Any ways you know your circumstances very well.

Best of Luck

Hello M.R.S

Thank you SO MUCH for the links provided . I think i found the answer i was looking for , however i would to run it by you to make sure i understood correctly.

In the Bulletin you provided , it is mentioned that :

However, if a residency determination cannot be made based on the information at hand and the CIC agent is aware that the applicant is outside of Canada, the applicant should be directed to apply for a Travel Document (Permanent Resident Abroad), also referred to as a PRTD, at the nearest Canadian visa office and to forward a copy of the PRTD to the CIC office once obtained. Communications with the applicant should be sent to their last known address in Canada. As per standard procedure, the application must be set aside for the 180 day compliance period.

Finally, if the applicant does not apply for a PRTD or provide notification to the CIC office that they are in Canada within the 180 day period, the CIC agent should declare the application abandoned. A notice must be sent to the applicant by regular mail advising that the application is deemed abandoned, and explaining that a new application and fee will be necessary should the applicant wish to receive a PR card in the future.


So does this mean that after 180 days, if i do not provide the PRTD (because i simply did not apply for it) my PR renewal application will be abandoned but i will NOT lose my PR status ? and i have to apply for another PR application after meeting the residency obligation again ?

Thanks for your help

 

[Tinaturner]

Hi M.R.S

Glad you got your PRTD in two days. I wish I could do the same but

I do not meet the residency obligations and if I submit my original passport along with the PRTD application it shall be clear that I do not meet the residency obligation that I claimed I meet in the pr application , so most probably my PRTD shall be rejected and I shall lose my pr status .

I really want a second chance to go live in canada and in the first 5 years window I did not have the money to go and simply rent a place and wait for I dunno how long to find a job, however now I saved enough to help me survive for at least two years.

Any advice ?

 

[Lammawitch]

Hi M.R.S

Glad you got your PRTD in two days. I wish I could do the same but

I do not meet the residency obligations and if I submit my original passport along with the PRTD application it shall be clear that I do not meet the residency obligation that I claimed I meet in the pr application , so most probably my PRTD shall be rejected and I shall lose my pr status .

I really want a second chance to go live in canada and in the first 5 years window I did not have the money to go and simply rent a place and wait for I dunno how long to find a job, however now I saved enough to help me survive for at least two years.

Any advice ?

I really hope I have misunderstood the phrase I have highlighted.

If I do understand correctly, you are saying you lied/misrepresented on your PR card renewal application. If so, withdraw that application.

 

[M.R.S]

I do not meet the residency obligations and if I submit my original passport along with the PRTD application it shall be clear that I do not meet the residency obligation that I claimed I meet in the pr application , so most probably my PRTD shall be rejected and I shall lose my pr status .

I really want a second chance to go live in canada and in the first 5 years window I did not have the money to go and simply rent a place and wait for I dunno how long to find a job, however now I saved enough to help me survive for at least two years.
Any advice ?

If you do not meet RO and you are outside Canada then it doesn't matter whether you have PR status or not.

If I do understand correctly, you are saying you lied/misrepresented on your PR card renewal application. If so, withdraw that application.

Lammawitch has given you the best advice.

 

[Tinaturner]

Well it does matter if my pr status will remain valid or not because I plan to return to canada

 

[zardoz]

Well it does matter if my pr status will remain valid or not because I plan to return to canada

So, you lied (misrepresentation) when you completed your PR card renewal application, CIC has doubts about the truth of your application and as a direct result, sent the application for secondary review. They are now insisting on an extensive check of your compliance with the residency obligation requirements via the PRTD mechanism... Busted!!

I would suspect that your profile has been flagged with this and that the risk of being reported at the POE has increased. Without a PRTD, you will have to cross the border with the USA and they may be waiting for you...

 

[Tinaturner]

If my application is abandoned, and then I decide to cross from usa , would I also be reported ? Am flagged ? Or the application I sent it flagged ?

If the application is abandoned and I do not lose my pr status can I still cross from usa ?

 

[Msafiri]

If my application is abandoned, and then I decide to cross from usa , would I also be reported ? Am flagged ? Or the application I sent it flagged ?

If the application is abandoned and I do not lose my pr status can I still cross from usa ?

Being reported in theory has no direct correlation with an abandoned PRC renewal application. It comes down to who you find at the border and if they decide to report you or if they can't be bothered with the paperwork, feel sorry for you, accept your absence reasons and give you a break etc. As alluded to by zardoz there may be a flag on your file so you get referred to Secondary Inspection for detailed questioning. Every time you show up at the border and are not in compliance with the RO then you are plying roulette! Your only hope is to withdraw the PRC renewal so at least the issue of misrepresentation ceases...if it goes all the way to an inadmissibility hearing before the courts you may have a hard time ever returning to Canada.

 

[Tinaturner]

Hello Msafiri

Thank you for the explanation . You have mentioned :

Your only hope is to withdraw the PRC renewal so at least the issue of misrepresentation ceases

However i tried to withdraw my application but was asked to apply to a PRTD as i am outside Canada, so basically my withdrawal request was not accepted .

Now my only hope is that my application would be considered abandoned if i do not the PRTD, but the question is :

1- if my application is abandoned , would i lose my PR status ? and i do not lose my PR status and my PR application was abandoned, would there still be a flag on my application and am at risk of being reported at the borders ?

if i should up at the borders , would the officer inform me that i have been reported ? or would he simply deny me entrance ?

Last but not least , you mentioned "inadmissibility" how would i know if this is what will happen to my file if i do not submit the PRTD and my application is abandoned ?

Regards

 

[Msafiri]

1. You don't have to apply for a PRTD if you don't want to (even CIC can't force you though they can state or write that you should)...if you don't then CIC will close the file off once the deadline to submit has passed. However you need to get to the border somehow so if you ignore CIC then your only option if not visitor visa exempt to Canada is to enter via the US which requires you to have a US visa and then be admitted into the US. So in an indirect way CIC can seemingly make life difficult for you...actually the PR brings it upon themselves by being in breach of the RO.
2. No one knows about a flag or lack of flag at the border. Show up and see what happens.
3. If you get reported (meaning you are inadmissible) then there will be paperwork and appeal process but you must be allowed to enter Canada if you make it to a POE (the law ensures you this right)

If its any consolation you are not the first or last PR to be in this situation so endless worry won't make a difference. You just have to return to Canada and deal with the situation. You may easily pass the border ok.

As a side issue I just don't get why getting a paltry 730 days over a 5 year cycle (40% time requirement) seems to be such a problem for so many PRs and why they bother with PR status if they no longer wish to live in Canada. The SR regime is mimicking the Citizenship RQ mess/delays only this time the applicants usually can't travel so the pain is much closer to home. Maybe CIC should consider a PR Card validity linked to the number of physical presence days declared in the PR Card renewal but the simple step for them is just to put applicants in a non-routine path and deal with it as and when resources allow. I see an increase in PR Card renewal fees being required soon if SR applications are to be processed in a more timely manner.

 

[Lammawitch]

1. You don't have to apply for a PRTD if you don't want to (even CIC can't force you though they can state or write that you should)...if you don't then CIC will close the file off once the deadline to submit has passed. However you need to get to the border somehow so if you ignore CIC then your only option if not visitor visa exempt to Canada is to enter via the US which requires you to have a US visa and then be admitted into the US. So in an indirect way CIC can seemingly make life difficult for you...actually the PR brings it upon themselves by being in breach of the RO.
2. No one knows about a flag or lack of flag at the border. Show up and see what happens.
3. If you get reported (meaning you are inadmissible) then there will be paperwork and appeal process but you must be allowed to enter Canada if you make it to a POE (the law ensures you this right)

If its any consolation you are not the first or last PR to be in this situation so endless worry won't make a difference. You just have to return to Canada and deal with the situation. You may easily pass the border ok.

As a side issue I just don't get why getting a paltry 730 days over a 5 year cycle (40% time requirement) seems to be such a problem for so many PRs and why they bother with PR status if they no longer wish to live in Canada.

+1.