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PR Valid for 5 Years and Returning to Canada before the last two years ends

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,241
8,861
I have a similar question what happens if you are technically not meeting PR obligation requirement but PR card is still valid.
I give example, my card expires Dec 2025 but I became PR July 2020. Spent ~60 days in Canada between 2020 and 2023 then moved to Canada permanently in July 2023 (have rental home, car is imported, DL etc.), so I have only 60 days buffer for next two years. But if there is a family emergency I maybe out of CAnada for ~3 months to help my father, if I return I will be out of PR obligation but PR card will still be valid. Will CBSA check my obligation and start removal proceedings? Or will it only be checked whenever I apply for new PR card in Sept-October 2025, I will be back meeting PR obligation in that case.

I know this is not a good plan and I hope I don't have to use up by buffer of 60 days but just want to understand what happens in that case...I will try my best ot avoid it
Your approach is basically the correct one, try to keep your buffer, if it comes to it (emergency happens), try to return while still in compliance, if you go out of compliance, try to keep it the non-compliance small, and be prepared to stay in Canada until back in compliance.

While no-one can guarantee, they overall do not try to 'catch someone out' for relatively small non-compliance. No, I can't put a number on 'relatively small.' But with relatively high probability we can probable say that even if examined, with clear evidence you are residing in Canada (which your travel record alone mostly shows) and some plausible reason why you had to leave (the family emergency), no, they probably would not start removal proceedings. They might warn you, they might not, they might put a note on your file (pushing examinations to other officers if you then leave and stay abroad for much longer).

BUT: on a gut basis your bigger risk is perhaps to your livelihood if your work requires you to travel so frequently. At some point, you may (and probably will) end up without a valid PR card for some period of time, which might be longer if you have to re-apply when you are only just in compliance (call it 'cutting it close.') Does not having a valid PR card cause employment and travel problems? Does your family emergency come at a time when you don't yet have the pR card rnewed?

Or you get a note to file that causes you to be re-examined frequently, and then one day you get a CBSA officer who decides they don't like the pattern (even if the overall non-compliance isn't that large) and you end up having to appeal, etc.

Or - and this is perhaps the more common problematic scenario here - another emergency or family issue comes up after that, you're abroad without a PR card (and possibly can't travel back via land border), this time the family issue keeps you out of Canada even longer, and next you're much more seriously out of compliance and finding it hard to get back (causing employment issues in Canada, etc). The risk of issues on examination goes up with the degree of non-compliance.

I don't mean to 'catastrophize' this by coming up with endless scenarios, one worse than the next. I doubt you'll have such problems, precisely because you're taking it seriously now, and paying attention to it. Overall I think you're probably in good shape unless something very problematic comes up. Your buffer is decent but it's not that much for the ~two years remaining before you've got that solid 730 recent days.
 

montrealworker

Star Member
Sep 25, 2022
105
5
My friend couldn't manage the time and stayed 12 months only during the 5 years period while working in USA but his wife is canadian and they think to move back to canada not sure how they will manage :/
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,241
8,861
My friend couldn't manage the time and stayed 12 months only during the 5 years period while working in USA but his wife is canadian and they think to move back to canada not sure how they will manage :/
For spouse of a citizen, there is at least the back-up of being sponsored once again. Others should be more cautious.
 
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missedTheGCBus

Star Member
Sep 8, 2022
104
15
Your approach is basically the correct one, try to keep your buffer, if it comes to it (emergency happens), try to return while still in compliance, if you go out of compliance, try to keep it the non-compliance small, and be prepared to stay in Canada until back in compliance.

While no-one can guarantee, they overall do not try to 'catch someone out' for relatively small non-compliance. No, I can't put a number on 'relatively small.' But with relatively high probability we can probable say that even if examined, with clear evidence you are residing in Canada (which your travel record alone mostly shows) and some plausible reason why you had to leave (the family emergency), no, they probably would not start removal proceedings. They might warn you, they might not, they might put a note on your file (pushing examinations to other officers if you then leave and stay abroad for much longer).

BUT: on a gut basis your bigger risk is perhaps to your livelihood if your work requires you to travel so frequently. At some point, you may (and probably will) end up without a valid PR card for some period of time, which might be longer if you have to re-apply when you are only just in compliance (call it 'cutting it close.') Does not having a valid PR card cause employment and travel problems? Does your family emergency come at a time when you don't yet have the pR card rnewed?

Or you get a note to file that causes you to be re-examined frequently, and then one day you get a CBSA officer who decides they don't like the pattern (even if the overall non-compliance isn't that large) and you end up having to appeal, etc.

Or - and this is perhaps the more common problematic scenario here - another emergency or family issue comes up after that, you're abroad without a PR card (and possibly can't travel back via land border), this time the family issue keeps you out of Canada even longer, and next you're much more seriously out of compliance and finding it hard to get back (causing employment issues in Canada, etc). The risk of issues on examination goes up with the degree of non-compliance.

I don't mean to 'catastrophize' this by coming up with endless scenarios, one worse than the next. I doubt you'll have such problems, precisely because you're taking it seriously now, and paying attention to it. Overall I think you're probably in good shape unless something very problematic comes up. Your buffer is decent but it's not that much for the ~two years remaining before you've got that solid 730 recent days.

Thank you this is useful. I was kind of hoping to get some forgiveness if I am slightly out of RO by say ~30 days, but definitely my objective is to avoid it completely. Only recent events have convinced me that ~60 days is really not enough buffer as parents get older :(

And yes the scenarios for being out of RO with an expired PR card of course are even worse, justgot to hope things go smoothly andsome buffer is maintained. I will only violate it for legitimate H&C reasons but then as you mentioned my current job requires me to commute once/twice a week so it willbecome a problem unless I maintain a buffer...
 
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montrealworker

Star Member
Sep 25, 2022
105
5
One important question, if you return and you have 2 months on your PR card , you didnt meet your PR obligation what happens to you at the boarder?
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,241
8,861
One important question, if you return and you have 2 months on your PR card , you didnt meet your PR obligation what happens to you at the boarder?
You COULD be formally reported, which (subject to appeal) can result in losing PR status.

Perhaps more likely: just as above, they see you mostly live in Canada and either don't check in detail or, if the non-compliance is not significant, are lenient and let you though.

Note: formally this is the same as being out of compliance without a valid card. But they're human beings and perhaps a wee bit more likely to see a valid card and not look into it in detail. (Unless there's a flag put on by someone on a previous, in which case it literally flags it as something to look into).

A reminder: 'lenience' as stated here is not forgiveness. They just haven't bothered to do anything about it. Doesn't apply to next time.

Closest thing to 'forgiveness' is a formal H&C decision, which mostly (in this context) is going to come from being abroad and applying for a PRTD while out of compliance, with good reasons, and getting an H&C encoded prtd (visa). Then the PR can apply for a new card and travel, mostly without worry.

But of course: they had to go through that PRTD application process which can be long and nerve-racking.
 

faipakistan

Star Member
Jul 21, 2020
66
16
i have a question. i am canadian citizen and my wife is PR card holder.

My wife has 6 months left to complete 1095 days. she has moved with me to USA. So i need to know does she need to come back and complete her 6 months or can she apply based on the reason that her spouse has moved to USA.

any help or advise will be really appreciated.
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
95,834
22,109
Toronto
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
28-05-2010
AOR Received.
19-08-2010
File Transfer...
28-06-2010
Passport Req..
01-10-2010
VISA ISSUED...
05-10-2010
LANDED..........
05-10-2010
i have a question. i am canadian citizen and my wife is PR card holder.

My wife has 6 months left to complete 1095 days. she has moved with me to USA. So i need to know does she need to come back and complete her 6 months or can she apply based on the reason that her spouse has moved to USA.

any help or advise will be really appreciated.
Can you clarify if you are asking about renewing her PR card or applying for citizenship? The reference to the 1095 day requirement is a bit confusing.
 

faipakistan

Star Member
Jul 21, 2020
66
16
Can you clarify if you are asking about renewing her PR card or applying for citizenship? The reference to the 1095 day requirement is a bit confusing.
applying for canadian citizenship ... i was told earlier by someone that if spouse gets job out of canada and wife moves (not gov job), she can still apply for citizenship ... however now when i try to find the same information on cic website, i cant find it so i am bit confused now.
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
95,834
22,109
Toronto
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
28-05-2010
AOR Received.
19-08-2010
File Transfer...
28-06-2010
Passport Req..
01-10-2010
VISA ISSUED...
05-10-2010
LANDED..........
05-10-2010
applying for canadian citizenship ... i was told earlier by someone that if spouse gets job out of canada and wife moves (not gov job), she can still apply for citizenship ... however now when i try to find the same information on cic website, i cant find it so i am bit confused now.
This is incorrect.

This rule only applies to the residency obligation for renewing her PR card.

For citizenship, she needs to physically reside in Canada to count days towards the 1095 residency obligation. So she would need to return to Canada and complete the remaining required residency days within Canada to qualify for citizenship.
 

faipakistan

Star Member
Jul 21, 2020
66
16
This is incorrect.

This rule only applies to the residency obligation for renewing her PR card.

For citizenship, she needs to physically reside in Canada to count days towards the 1095 residency obligation. So she would need to return to Canada and complete the remaining required residency days within Canada to qualify for citizenship.
thanks alot.