PR unusual case

[shahiniamin]

Hello guys,
I have an abnormal issue with my PR card and wondered you may be of any help.
I landed in Canada in 2014, and after 70 days left without getting my PR card and returned to Canada again in 2016 by travel document. This time I could get my PR card through several correspondence with IRCC. The abnormal issue with my card was that the expiration date is 2021 and the landed date printed on the back of the card is 2014. This has confused me and my lawyer and many others as what this exactly means! You might say the landing date is the point for calculating the 730 days of RO and the expiration date is irrelevant! But to me it is not! I explain. Imagine that I landed in 2014 and stayed the 2 year RO (that would be 2016 and I would be safe with regards to meeting the RO), then I move back to my home country and after 4 years (year 2020), I decide to return to Canada again ( I can legally get back to Canada as the expiration date of the card is 2021), then the officer at the airport might want to check my RO status and he might end up with the fact that I have not met the 2 year RO as he counts back 5 years from 2020 which is 2015. Then the bad news is that he might conclude that I only met 1 year of the RO since he is only allowed to check the last 5 years and not further. But the truth is I have met the RO because I stayed 2 years right after I landed in 2014. It is confusing isn't it?! I think my case is an unusual one. I have seen people asking why the expiration date on the card is a couple of months more than 5 years but haven’t seen anyone claiming his/her expiration date is 7 years after the landing date! So what do you think about my case? Am I safe? Has the IRCC made a mistake? Can I give the same reasoning if I am reported? Pleaseeeeee reply.
Tnxx

 

[Bs65]

Others can comment but is not to me confusing at all given after the initial 5 years post landing the 5 years becomes a rolling 5 years reset each time someone enters the country.

So if you enter the country in say June 2020 then the 5 years preceeding that you would need to have spent at least 730 days in Canada, so back to June 2015. Anything before June 2015 would not be counted so in your case even if for example you had met RO from mid 2014 to mid 2016 only the 2015/2016 period would count towards RO

So in this example you would need to return in mid 2019 to meet the initial RO in the first 5 years since landing in 2014, claiming the 2014/2016 time spent in Canada, entering any time later say 2020 and you lose any time based on the look back 5 years from date of new entry.

However given you only spent 70 days since 2014 anyway (although this is not really clear in your post) then all this could be a mute discussion given any date you enter now you will have a challenge to meet the RO unless you return now and stay through end 2019 or 5 years from initial landing whichever is sooner, basically at least 730 days without leaving the country.

The fact the card and others can correct me expires in 2021 would be due to the fact that you applied for a new card in 2016 so valid 5 years through 2021 but this has nothing really to do with the RO it just allows you to travel. As you did not collect your initial card that would likely have been cancelled/scrapped as a non collection hence a 5 year card issued from 2016 when you applied again..

Also as for legally being allowed back and has been stated here many times PR cards expire but PR status never expires it can only be revoked or renounced

 

[Cassiano]

PR means live in Canada, You have to live in Canada
if you don't live 730 days you would loose your Residency (2016-2014 = 730 days) because you would not meet the obligations
Give thanks, they issued your PR Card, but remember when you ask for the citizenship, maybe it would be revoke,,,

 

[evdm]

Not confusing at all. As a PR, under the current laws, you have to be in Canada for 730 days every 5 years (40% of the time) until you either: become a citizen, give up your PR status, or your status is revoked. Each time you interact with IRCC or CBSA, an officer can make sure that you have met this requirement. This continues for as long as you are a PR.

As a PR you have a right to enter and Remain in Canada. Your PR card is just a travel document. Think of it like your passport. Just because the passport expires doesn't mean you're not a citizen of that country anymore. PR status was given to you so that you would call Canada home and contribute to Canadian society. In return, Canada has set the residency obligation to make sure people don't abuse the system and get status without really intending to become a part of Canadian society.

The residency obligation is (in my opinion and those of IAD tribunals) quite generous and allows for a lot of time spent outside of Canada, though it should be very easily met by those living in Canada as intended by granting PR status. If you really have to calculate down to the day whether or not you meet the requirement while continuing to remain outside of Canada for the majority of your time (with no compelling H&C reason); I think you should really evaluate whether or not you should remain a PR at this time. You can then always seek to re-apply when you do actually intend to make Canada your full-time home. That is, after all, what PR status is meant for.

 

[shahiniamin]

Amin Shahini:
Thanks for the reply.
I think you are right and they scrapped the initial PR card and gave me a new one in 2016, but the point is
1.shoudn't they have issued the PR card that expired in 2019?
2. If I go ro Canada this year, can I assume that I am safe without being reported?

 

[evdm]

Amin Shahini:
Thanks for the reply.
I think you are right and they scrapped the initial PR card and gave me a new one in 2016, but the point is
1.shoudn't they have issued the PR card that expired in 2019?
2. If I go ro Canada this year, can I assume that I am safe without being reported?

1. no, when a PR Card is issued it will be issued for 1 or 5 years from that date. Your card is not your status. It's like a passport, a travel document. Your PR Card dates have absolutely nothing to do with your Residency Obligation.
2. What day did you land and how many days have you been in Canada since you landed up until today?

 

[shahiniamin]

I landed 29 June 2014 and stayed about 120 days up to now.

 

[meyakanor]

As others have mentioned, please IGNORE the expiration date of the PR card.

Let's say you come back to Canada on June 29 2021, then the ONLY period that matters goes from June 30 2016 to June 29 2021 (you need to have 731 days within this period ONLY).

Any day you spent between June 29 2014 to June 29 2016 would NOT matter and would NOT be counted.

And a PR has a right to enter the country, so long their status has not yet been revoked.

So long your status has not been revoked, you can come back to Canada on, say, 2040, and they would have to let you in.

At that point, it is also very likely that they would report you to initiate PR revocation though.

 

[evdm]

You have already failed to meet your residency obligation.

Let's say you were to get on a plane to Canada today, between now and June 28, 2019 there are 487 days. If you add up the days you've been in Canada since June 29, 2014 your total number of days in the relevant period would be 607. So you are well short of the 730 days needed.

You can travel to Canada, and as a PR you will be let in, but you seriously risk being reported.

 

[shahiniamin]

Bad news... last questions...sorry!
1.How do they check my RO? do they check it for everyone?
2. Or can I be hopeful that I might pass unnoticed as I plan to enter Canada 3 years before the expiration date?
3. If I pass without being reported, can I apply for spousal sponsorship? Or if I do so will they notice the violation of RO and revoke my PR?

 

[scylla]

Bad news... last questions...sorry!
1.How do they check my RO? do they check it for everyone?
2. Or can I be hopeful that I might pass unnoticed as I plan to enter Canada 3 years before the expiration date?
3. If I pass without being reported, can I apply for spousal sponsorship? Or if I do so will they notice the violation of RO and revoke my PR?

1. It's random. Some are caught and some aren't.
2. Yes - it's possible you'll be able to enter without issue.
3. No - absolutely not. You cannot apply to sponsor your spouse until you meet the residency requirement. If you try earlier, they will refuse the sponsorship application and begin steps to revoke your PR status.

 

[shahiniamin]

I see...So she might be able to join me by applying for visitor visa. Possible?

 

[steaky]

I see...So she might be able to join me by applying for visitor visa. Possible?

If visa is approved. No guarantees.

 

[evdm]

1. It's random. Some are caught and some aren't.
2. Yes - it's possible you'll be able to enter without issue.
3. No - absolutely not. You cannot apply to sponsor your spouse until you meet the residency requirement. If you try earlier, they will refuse the sponsorship application and begin steps to revoke your PR status.

I'd probably add on to point 2, it's possible, but you should plan on staying in Canada until you can safely meet the residency obligation, and then some. So plan on being in Canada for well over 2 years without leaving at all, not even to the US for a day if you want to play it safe.

 

[scylla]

I see...So she might be able to join me by applying for visitor visa. Possible?

You should be prepared for the significant possibility a TRV will be refused. CIC may suspect she has plans on remaining in Canada long term given her spouse is Canadian. So it's possible you may have to be separated for a couple of years in order to save your PR status.