PR status

[SMIC]

Hello,
I would appreciate it if anyone could give me some advice please. In 2008 we were in England, we applied for PR as my husband had a job offer in Alberta under PNP. At the time our daughter was 18, she went through the process with us for medicals ect as per requirements as a family, even though we knew she would not becoming to Canada for a while due to starting university.We landed January 2009 and our daughter landed April 2009 coming out for just a holiday.

Since 2009 to present she has been to Canada every year for a holiday approximately 95 days in total,She has finished university and has been in a job for 18 months, but would now like the opportunity to come and live in Canada, we (parents) are now Canadian citizens.
We are aware that she does not meet PR requirements of 2 years, is there anything that we can do?
Many thanks

 

[spyfy]

It seems that
- an application on humanitarian and compassionate grounds isn't an option since it is clear from your daughter's travel history that she voluntarily chose to stay in England and only visited every now and then.
- renouncing her PR status and then applying for family sponsorship is not an option since your daughter is 26 by now (if I got the numbers right), i.e. she is over 19.
- applying for a Permanent Resident Travel Document to travel to Canada is not an option since your daughter definitely doesn't fulfill the residency requirement

This leaves the following options:
- Not recommended: Your daughter catches a plane on her visa-exempt passport before eTA becomes mandatory (i.e. before mid-March), brings her Confirmation of Permanent Residence and gets very very (very!) lucky at the passport control in Canada, i.e. nobody asks too many questions and she is let in. After that she must not leave Canada until she has two years of residency within the last five years. It is very unlikely this will work (from what I read in this forum) and if it doesn't work, she has to go through many months of paperwork, possible removal orders and so forth. Another problem actually is that even if she gets in without problems, she probably doesn't have a Social Insurance Number yet and to apply for one she needs a valid PR card (the CoPR can only be used in the first year after the original landing)
- Your daughter renounces her current PR status and afterwards applies through the "independent route", i.e. economic classes, or just applies for a study permit or work permit etc.

One question: You are writing that your daughter has been visiting you every year since, but how did she enter Canada in 2015 which is more than 5 years after she was granted Permanent Residence. Her PR card must have been expired by then?

 

[SMIC]

Hello,
Many thanks for your information. Every time that she came out she was asked why she had PR by border, she explained the reasons why. In 2015 she had no problems coming over, no questions nothing.
Unfortunately when we applied for PR in 2008 there was not an option to exclude her from the process, we did look into it at the time. Thank you

 

[Leon]

If she can get into Canada again one more time without being reported for not meeting the RO (residency obligation), she could stay for 2 years straight in order to revive her PR status. She should in that case not leave nor apply for anything from immigration. She is allowed to work etc. because she is still a PR. After staying two years, she meets the RO again and can apply to renew her PR card.

She should look like she's coming for a vacation again and get her stuff she wants to take with her boxed up and mailed to your address. No need to alert immigration that she is moving looking like she's arriving with all her worldly possessions.

 

[scylla]

Hello,
Many thanks for your information. Every time that she came out she was asked why she had PR by border, she explained the reasons why. In 2015 she had no problems coming over, no questions nothing.
Unfortunately when we applied for PR in 2008 there was not an option to exclude her from the process, we did look into it at the time. Thank you

Although this really doesn't matter at this point.. There was in fact a process for excluding her in 2008. You would have flagged her as "non-accompanying" in your application (rather than "accompanying"). She would still had to have passed the medical, etc. - but would not have been issued a PR visa.

 

[SMIC]

Hello,
Thank you for your responses.
I have another few points that I would like to mention,my daughter never received her PR card, she still has her landing papers, would that cause a problem if she came after March?
Also she is in a common law relationship, would she be able to sponsor her boyfriend eventually?

Regarding PR we did look into her name not being on there and we were told by immigration it had to be on the paperwork, regardless if she was coming or not. We abided by all of the regulations at the time of applying.

Many thanks four your relies

 

[scylla]

In order to sponsor her common law partner, she must meet the residency obligation. This means she would have to return to Canada and remain in Canada for two years straight to meet the residency obligation before she would be able to sponsor her boyfriend. If she plans to enter Canada by land from the US after March then the fact she doesn't have a PR card shouldn't make that big a difference. There's a chance she may be reported for failing to meet RO and there's a chance she won't. Flying after March of course won't work unless she first gives up her PR status officially and then applies for ETA to enter Canada as a tourist.

Yes - per my earlier comment, it was mandatory to include your daughter in your application. However you could have flagged her as "non-accompanying" (vs. "accompanying") in your application which would have meant that she would not have been granted PR status along with you. But like I said earlier - that's not really material at this point.

 

[Rob_TO]

Hello,
Thank you for your responses.
I have another few points that I would like to mention,my daughter never received her PR card, she still has her landing papers, would that cause a problem if she came after March?
Also she is in a common law relationship, would she be able to sponsor her boyfriend eventually?

Regarding PR we did look into her name not being on there and we were told by immigration it had to be on the paperwork, regardless if she was coming or not. We abided by all of the regulations at the time of applying.

Many thanks four your relies

She should try to arrive before the eTA travel system becomes mandatory on March 15. As mentioned, if she can enter without being reported for not meeting Residency Obligation then she should stay inside Canada for 2 straight years so she can fulfill the residency obligation and renew her PR card.

Upon coming to Canada, she should do whatever she did when coming on vacation all those other times. However she may be reported for not meeting RO (it depends on CBSA officer she happens to encounter), and if that happens she's still allowed into Canada but may soon after have her PR status revoked.

If she can make it into Canada without being reported, she will need to wait for 2 years before she can apply to sponsor her common-law partner for PR. If she tries to sponsor him while not meeting the RO, most likely CIC will instead revoke her PR status. Her common-law partner should try to come to Canada also during this time, since it may be tough to apply as common-law if you've not been living together for 2 years.

Also if she leaves anytime during the initial 2 years back in Canada, she would then require a PR Travel Doc to return since it will not longer be possible to fly on just visa-exempt passport under new eTA system. And once she applies for a PR Travel Doc, again her RO will be an issue and will most likely end up with her PR status being revoked.

Once her PR status is gone, you can't sponsor her anymore since she is no longer a dependent. She or her common-law partner would need to qualify independent for PR in some other economic stream.

 

[SMIC]

Again, many thanks to all your responses, thank you so very much for taking the time!

Question regarding common law -Would my daughters boyfriend be able to come out as a visitor for 6 months, then apply for extension of stay?
I am so new to this and dont have a clue! Thank you

 

[Rob_TO]

Question regarding common law -Would my daughters boyfriend be able to come out as a visitor for 6 months, then apply for extension of stay?

Sure, for people with visa-exempt passports that is usually a pretty easy process. Just need to convince CBSA when entering Canada you are only visiting, and not "moving" or "living" in Canada.

Also as a visitor, he will not be able to work.

 

[spyfy]

If she can get into Canada again one more time without being reported for not meeting the RO (residency obligation), she could stay for 2 years straight in order to revive her PR status. She should in that case not leave nor apply for anything from immigration. She is allowed to work etc. because she is still a PR. After staying two years, she meets the RO again and can apply to renew her PR card.

It is incorrect that she can work in Canada if she makes it across the border. To work in Canada, you need a social insurance number. Every employer has to ask for one. If I understand it right, she doesn't have a social insurance number yet. The only document she can use to apply for a social insurance number is with a valid PR card. She can't use her CoPR anymore because it is older than one year. In fact, this is exactly the reason, why an older CoPR is not accepted by Service Canada. Details see here:
http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/sin/apply/proof.shtml
And she won't be able to apply for a PR card until she stayed in Canada for 2 years. So if she wants to work, she is in a dead end right now.

 

[Leon]

It is incorrect that she can work in Canada if she makes it across the border. To work in Canada, you need a social insurance number. Every employer has to ask for one. If I understand it right, she doesn't have a social insurance number yet. The only document she can use to apply for a social insurance number is with a valid PR card. She can't use her CoPR anymore because it is older than one year. In fact, this is exactly the reason, why an older CoPR is not accepted by Service Canada. Details see here:
http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/sin/apply/proof.shtml
And she won't be able to apply for a PR card until she stayed in Canada for 2 years. So if she wants to work, she is in a dead end right now.

The link you gave does not specify that the PR card must be valid.

 

[SMIC]

Hello to all for your responses,I would like to take the time to thank you, it is the experiences and knowledge of folks like you, that are very valuable to us all on this forum and we should all appreciate that!

Over the last few days I decided to contact an immigration lawyer as well about PR status for my daughter, to be told that I could appeal on H and C grounds and that would need to pay $1000 retainer and a further $2000 on completion. So I did some research and in no way shape or form did I read that she meets that criteria, so I am unclear why he would give me that information maybe $$$.
Would it be worth paying a consultation fee for another lawyer.to be told maybe the same thing!
Thank in advance for your replies

 

[6327farag]

Just get on a plane and come as a visitor i have done so 4 times and never been questioned about PR. I am in a similar situation to your daughter came over in 2003 AGED 15 left 2007 and haven't met RO since. Book a return flight say your entering as a visitor and all should be fine i have just done this 3 weeks ago and in Canada currently without questions being asked. I do however have a SIN and able to work. Do not get a lawyer involved it serves no purpose as there is no grounds for H&C.

I am unable to stay as I have to return to my current residence as im now married with a child witch makes simply coming back a bit more complicated.

Question from myself is What will happen when i apply for an ESTA once it becomes compulsory in march? I have a visa exempt passport if that makes any difference

 

[PMM]

HI

Just get on a plane and come as a visitor i have done so 4 times and never been questioned about PR. I am in a similar situation to your daughter came over in 2003 AGED 15 left 2007 and haven't met RO since. Book a return flight say your entering as a visitor and all should be fine i have just done this 3 weeks ago and in Canada currently without questions being asked. I do however have a SIN and able to work. Do not get a lawyer involved it serves no purpose as there is no grounds for H&C.

I am unable to stay as I have to return to my current residence as im now married with a child witch makes simply coming back a bit more complicated.

Question from myself is What will happen when i apply for an ESTA once it becomes compulsory in march? I have a visa exempt passport if that makes any difference

1, When the ETA comes in March/15 neither a Pr nor a Citizen will be issued an ETA, so a PR would have to apply for PRTD as with the eTA or PRTD the airline won't board you. Only work around is fly to US and use a land border.