PR residency obligation - don't know if we meet it or not

[SaraDenise]

I'm so grateful for coming upon this forum as I have already found answers to some of my previous questions. My situation, however, is quite unique and I still don't know whether or not my husband and I are considered PR.

For a complete understanding of our situation, our "story" begins:

I lived in Canada from Nov 1985 to August 1999. My parents never applied for citizenship so I was also just considered a Landed Immigrant. I decided to return to Canada in May 2009 and applied for a Travel Document under Humanitarian and Compassionate Grounds and was granted Permanent Residency right away.
My, now, husband, was also in the same situation as I (although he only lived in Canada with his family for 3 years). He joined me in Canada a month after and applied for PR.
We both got our PR cards, OHIP and SIN. We started working and living as PR and married through civil law in August 2009.
After we found out we were pregnant, we made a very difficult decision to have our baby in Portugal where we would be close to our families. We came to Portugal in Sep 2010 and our son was born Jan 2011.

With a new baby on the way (expected due date is June 2013) and seeing how extremely difficult it is to continue living in Portugal, we would like for our children to grow with the Canadian Mulitcultural lifestyle.


Our questions and doubts are many and as follows:

1- Is our PR status considered as of 1985 or the year we both physically moved to Canada (2009)?

2- As of May 2009 (date we got our PR cards) to Sep 2010 (date we left Canada), we dont meet the 730 day requirement. Does that mean we lost our PR status?

3- We were physically present for 507 days. Can we still account the days present in Canada if we were to move back to Canada ASAP to accumulate the 730 days?

4- If my husband and I are still considered PR, how can our 2 year old son travel to Canada? and how can he be covered for Health?

5- Would it be best to have our second child born in Canada? If so, will we be covered under OHIP? If it's best that he/she be born here in Portugal before we return to Canada, how could he/she travel to Canada?

6- Our main concern is that I had to mail my PR card to Service Canada due to Maternity Benefit issues regarding our firstborn and they never mailed it back to me, so if we still maintain our PR status, how can I return to Canada without my PR Card?


I apologize for all the questions. We just really have no idea of what we can actually do taking into consideration our son and our baby to be. We would like to know all the options we have and make the safest decision possible.


Hope someone can help out.

Thanks

 

[SenoritaBella]

Our questions and doubts are many and as follows:

1- Is our PR status considered as of 1985 or the year we both physically moved to Canada (2009)?
To maintain PR status, you must have lived in Canada for 730 days(2 years) out of every rolling 5 year period. So if you were to return in 2013, the officer will look at the period from 2008 - 2013 only to determine if your met residency obligations or if you will meet them by the expiration of the PR card.

2- As of May 2009 (date we got our PR cards) to Sep 2010 (date we left Canada), we dont meet the 730 day requirement. Does that mean we lost our PR status?
Not yet(they don't know this) but it's possible you may be reported for not meeting the requirement when you return. If they report you, you will be allowed entry and will have some time to appeal - hopefully you have a good explantion why.

3- We were physically present for 507 days. Can we still account the days present in Canada if we were to move back to Canada ASAP to accumulate the 730 days?
If you still have at least 223 days before the time your PR card expires, then it's possible to still meet residency obligations if you return asap. Note that you will have to stay in Canada throughout until you accumulate 730 days before you apply to renew your PR card(s).

4- If my husband and I are still considered PR, how can our 2 year old son travel to Canada? and how can he be covered for Health?
Since none of you are Canadian citizens, you have to be in Canada in order to sponsor your son for PR. You have to apply for a visitor visa for your son in order for him to travel to Canada.
Note that whichever of you is going to sponsor him MUST meet residency obligations BEFORE you attempt to sponsor the child. In Ontario, I believe the wait time is 3 months before health coverage.

5- Would it be best to have our second child born in Canada? If so, will we be covered under OHIP? If it's best that he/she be born here in Portugal before we return to Canada, how could he/she travel to Canada?
It's up to you...if Canada, bear in mind that since you've been away for an extended period of time, there may be a wait period of 3 months before your health coverage kicks in again. If this is the case and your child is born before you are eligible for coverage, you would have to pay out of pocket for delivery(could be $5000 - $10000). So you may want to look into purchasing travel/medical insurance to be on the safe side. If Portugal, the child will need a visitor visa in order to travel to Canada.

6- Our main concern is that I had to mail my PR card to Service Canada due to Maternity Benefit issues regarding our firstborn and they never mailed it back to me, so if we still maintain our PR status, how can I return to Canada without my PR Card?
Ask service canada to mail it to you. Be sure to explain that you need it to travel. If that doesn't work, you could consider travelling to the US instead, get a rental car and drive across the border to Canada. You need to have your Confirmation of Permanent Residence(COPR) document with you though. It's still possible to be reported for not meeting residence obligations.


I apologize for all the questions. We just really have no idea of what we can actually do taking into consideration our son and our baby to be. We would like to know all the options we have and make the safest decision possible.


Hope someone can help out.

Thanks

 

[Leon]

1- Is our PR status considered as of 1985 or the year we both physically moved to Canada (2009)?

When you applied for your travel document, they gave you an exception for not meeting the residency requirements. That doesn't mean they gave you a brand new PR. You still need to complete your 730 days in 5 years.

2- As of May 2009 (date we got our PR cards) to Sep 2010 (date we left Canada), we dont meet the 730 day requirement. Does that mean we lost our PR status?

You are still PR until somebody decides that you aren't but immigration would not be very happy if they heard that they exempted you from meeting the residency requirements in 2009 and then you left again after only a year. However, you can still go back and stay for another 223 days and then you will meet the requirements.


3- We were physically present for 507 days. Can we still account the days present in Canada if we were to move back to Canada ASAP to accumulate the 730 days?

Yes, because you weren't gone more than 3 years, your days you spent from 2009 to 2010 will count towards your 730 days.

4- If my husband and I are still considered PR, how can our 2 year old son travel to Canada? and how can he be covered for Health?

Because you do not meet the residency requirements for the past 5 years, you should not risk sponsoring your son now. However, if he is Portugese, he is visa exempt. Bring him to Canada with you and if anybody asks, you are planning to sponsor him for PR. However, do not apply to sponsor him until you have your 730 days. He will not get health care until he is a PR.

5- Would it be best to have our second child born in Canada? If so, will we be covered under OHIP? If it's best that he/she be born here in Portugal before we return to Canada, how could he/she travel to Canada?

Yes, have your second child born in Canada. You have a 3 month waiting period to be covered under OHIP which is why you might not want to go to Ontario. If you go to AB to settle there, you get instant coverage. Your baby will be a citizen and will be covered under health care right away.

6- Our main concern is that I had to mail my PR card to Service Canada due to Maternity Benefit issues regarding our firstborn and they never mailed it back to me, so if we still maintain our PR status, how can I return to Canada without my PR Card?

You have a visa exempt passport and you still have some PR paperwork I assume. It should not be a problem. Just make sure you return as soon as you can and definitely before Sep. 2013 because if you leave it later, you will have been outside Canada for more than 3 years and that would mean you will not reach 730 days in Canada in 5 years until 2 years after you arrive.

 

[SaraDenise]

First hand, THANK you SenoritaBella and Leon for all your responses! It helps a great deal to finally make a decision.

I still, however, have other questions regarding your answers:

- What's the best thing to say at Immigration at the airport if we are asked anything about our reason for being out of Canada for such a long period of time?

- I still have my OHIP card and it only expires in 2014. Is it possible that I won't be covered and need to apply for a new one? Is there any way that I can find out before moving back to Canada so I can gather all the necessary information before purchasing Health Insurance?

- Is it best to travel with a round-trip ticket rather than a one-way ticket? We are Visa exempt but it's always a risk to travel with a one-way ticket if we have nothing that shows that we are able to stay linger than a 6mth period.
If we can travel with a one-way ticket, I need some kind of paperwork to prove that I am still a PR. What can I show to prove that given the fact that I dont have my PR Card with me? The only documents I have are the Travel Document in my expired passport and the receipt for the PR Card which also ha my PR/Client ID number?

- What is a COPR document?

 

[Leon]

- What's the best thing to say at Immigration at the airport if we are asked anything about our reason for being out of Canada for such a long period of time?

Family problems, taking care of your sick mom for example.

- I still have my OHIP card and it only expires in 2014. Is it possible that I won't be covered and need to apply for a new one? Is there any way that I can find out before moving back to Canada so I can gather all the necessary information before purchasing Health Insurance?

You must live in Ontario for at least 6 months a year to keep your OHIP so you will have lost it by now. Your next question may now be if OHIP knows that you are gone, well, maybe they do or maybe they don't but if you go back and start using your old OHIP as if nothing happened and they find out, they could backcharge you for the services you receive and that could be more expensive for you than actually paying out of pocket because doctors/hospitals may be billing OHIP a higher amount than they would charge from you if you came in and paid cash.

- Is it best to travel with a round-trip ticket rather than a one-way ticket? We are Visa exempt but it's always a risk to travel with a one-way ticket if we have nothing that shows that we are able to stay linger than a 6mth period.
If we can travel with a one-way ticket, I need some kind of paperwork to prove that I am still a PR. What can I show to prove that given the fact that I dont have my PR Card with me? The only documents I have are the Travel Document in my expired passport and the receipt for the PR Card which also ha my PR/Client ID number?

Immigration should let you in if there is evidence that you are a PR and you seem to have that evidence. However, getting a return ticket may not be more expensive than getting a single ticket. Look into that. Of course you could also get a more expensive return ticket that you can cancel again for a refund and just cancel it once you are in.


- What is a COPR document?

Confirmation of Permanent Residence. It is a document you get when you land as a PR. If you don't have a PR card, those papers are good proof that you are a PR.

 

[SaraDenise]

I don't seem to have a COPR document. The only thing I have is what I have already mentioned.
As for the OHIP card, even after my 10yr absence, before I moved back the 1st time, it was still working. I had to renew it though because it was still the red and white card. Hopefully, I have that luck again. We don't have the money to pay for health insurance for our whole family and to have a baby there seems very costly.

Would it be wise to write Service Canada a letter asking why my PR Card was never returned? It seems to be safer to travel with a PR Card then just to have the documents I have with me (because I'm afraid it doesn't prove very much) and to re-enter Canada with a round-trip ticket I might be asked many questions as to why we are traveling to Canada, why does my husband have a PR Card and my child and I don't, etc. and I wouldn't know what to say...

 

[Leon]

As for the OHIP card, even after my 10yr absence, before I moved back the 1st time, it was still working. I had to renew it though because it was still the red and white card. Hopefully, I have that luck again. We don't have the money to pay for health insurance for our whole family and to have a baby there seems very costly.

You mean you were lucky that you were not caught by OHIP. Having a baby when your OHIP really should have been canceled because you were gone for almost 3 years is risky because if you do it and they catch you this time, you will be paying the bill yourself. No insurance will cover you for child birth. The best way would be to not settle in Ontario, go somewhere else where you will get first day health care if you are moving from overseas.

Would it be wise to write Service Canada a letter asking why my PR Card was never returned? It seems to be safer to travel with a PR Card then just to have the documents I have with me (because I'm afraid it doesn't prove very much) and to re-enter Canada with a round-trip ticket I might be asked many questions as to why we are traveling to Canada, why does my husband have a PR Card and my child and I don't, etc. and I wouldn't know what to say...

Yes, write them a letter and demand your PR card back.

 

[madhut5]

PR residency obligation - don't know if we meet it or not

Dear Mr.Leon,

I need your advice: our family landed to Canada in 2006, Myself and my son both are Canadian citizen now but I am worried about my husband as he could not finish his residency obligation for Canada - as he was pursuing PhD ( electrical engineering from India, and now he is in India, he has completed his PhD work and wants to come back to Canada but his PR card is expired)
However his physical presence in Canada was about 500 days, In response to the H&C grounds of renewal application ( we got one letter from CIC stating we need to fill up another form and they asked all the history of OHIP since first card was issued and also tax history, bank Credit card info, statements and all those things….)
But we already applied on H&C grounds and we have already stated that since he was persuing the PhD, he was unable to meet the residency obligation.
I am his wife and I am Canadian citizen well settled in Canada now with my son, will they allow my husband and grant the Travel document or not (if not then what is the way : re-sponsoring him?). worried, please response ASAP.

Best Regards,

MHT

 

[Leon]

I am his wife and I am Canadian citizen well settled in Canada now with my son, will they allow my husband and grant the Travel document or not (if not then what is the way : re-sponsoring him?). worried, please response ASAP.

If they refuse him a travel document, you should just sponsor him for PR again.

 

[madhut5]

Thanks Mr. Leon ....I really appreciate your quick response, thanks!!!!!