PR card expiring soon and we want to move to canada

[DVR]

Dear Members,

Hope my message finds you all well.

I am writing this to you get some guidance/help.

I am an existing PR card holder of Canada. When I did my landing in 2008, I did not find any job due to recession and hence I returned to UAE where I had my old job. As my job was going well here, we virtually dropped the idea of settling in Canada. Unfortunately, couple of months ago I lost my job here in UAE and hence I am rethinking to going back to Canada. I found that my PR card is getting expired in September 2013.

I have not met the 730 days requirement of staying in Canada. In fact, we just stayed there for initial 25 days and came back to UAE. Can anybody please answer the below questions?

1. If I still go to Canada, will there be any problem at the airport? I mean the immigration officer at the airport will allow entering? I read in the forum that officer may report it and we have to explain the case in a month. If we are not able to convince then, will they deport us or is there any penalty which we can pay and stay there for next 2 years to fulfill the requirement?

2. If I am allowed to enter then is it better to relocate once with entire family or I can go alone first, find home, schools etc. and then come back again and take the family together. My point here is that can I do multiple entries before September 2013?

3. Last one, as initially we had dropped the idea, I never did the PR application for my younger daughter (2.5 years) born here in UAE. So now she does not have PR card where rest of the family has it. How do I apply for her PR? If I apply then will the entire family's PR will be in jeopardy? is there any way to arrange any other visa for her and rest of the family has their PR and we all travel together and enter canada? we are kind of prepared to stay non stop 730+ days.

Appreciate your kind advice here to help me to take the right decision.

Many thanks in advance.

Regards,
DVR

 

[Leon]

1. It is possible that the immigration officer gives you trouble, wants to know if you meet the requirements and wants to report you for not meeting the requirements. If they report you, you have a month to appeal for your PR. If you lose your appeal, you will lose your PR and be asked to leave. There is no penalty you can pay to keep your PR. The only way to keep your PR if you get reported is to win the appeal. The only way to win the appeal would be to show that you had humane and compassionate grounds for not being able to meet the residency obligation. That would be medical problems of your own or your family, taking care of a seriously ill relative or something along those lines. Having a good job somewhere else would not win you any points there. If you get in without being reported, you stay for 730 days straight and then your PR is in good standing again and you can apply to renew your PR card.

2. If you go, it's better that all of you go at the same time. Otherwise, you risk that you could get in without a problem the first time and then when you all go together later, you might get reported.

3. A non-PR child is your biggest problem. Children in this situation are usually not given a visit visa because immigration feels that your intention is not for the child to visit but to stay permanently. It is possible that you can get a special visa called a TRP for your child to take to Canada in order to sponsor. However, you can not sponsor your child while you yourself don't meet the residency requirements because if you get into Canada without being reported and then apply to sponsor your child, you will bring immigrations attention to the fact that you don't meet the requirements yourself. Another problem would be that if you are denied a TRP for the child, there is no other visa possible for the child in which case you would have to split up your family with some going to Canada to try to reclaim the PR and some staying with the child outside Canada.

 

[DVR]

Dear Leon,

as expected you have cleared my doubts well.

to solve the non-PR child issue, what is the way out?

1. Is it to get TRP only? what is the probability of getting TRP for my daughter? she is just aged 2.5 years only.

I think if she get the TRP upto 3 years and we all stay 3 years together, then I can stay alone till I get my PR done and rest of the family may come back. in this case, at least I will have valid PR and our split time will less.

2. what if one of the organization sponsors me and family by giving me job? do you think this will solve the issue.

appreciate your take here.

thanks again.

 

[Leon]

Dear Leon,

as expected you have cleared my doubts well.

to solve the non-PR child issue, what is the way out?

1. Is it to get TRP only? what is the probability of getting TRP for my daughter? she is just aged 2.5 years only.

I think if she get the TRP upto 3 years and we all stay 3 years together, then I can stay alone till I get my PR done and rest of the family may come back. in this case, at least I will have valid PR and our split time will less.

2. what if one of the organization sponsors me and family by giving me job? do you think this will solve the issue.

appreciate your take here.

thanks again.

1. I do not know what is the chance to get a TRP. The process is that first you apply for a TRV for your child based on that you are a PR family and want to bring your child to Canada to sponsor her. If you are refused which is likely, you apply for a TRP based on that you need to take your child to Canada for Humanitarian reasons to sponsor her because it would be great hardship on you and your family to be apart during the processing time. I do not know for how long TRP's are issued or if immigration at this point starts looking into if you meet the residency requirements or not. If they do, your PR could be in jeopardy.

If you get the TRP, you and your family can go to Canada together. Hope that you will not be reported on entry but you can not apply to sponsor your daughter right away because then you risk your PR again because they will see that you do not meet the residency requirements.

If the TRP is granted for less than 2 years, the best way would probably be that you stay in Canada together until the TRP expires and then your wife leaves with your daughter in order to avoid overstaying. You (and possibly your other children) can stay until you have your two years and then apply to renew your PR card based on having stayed 2 years out of the past 5.

Your wife would at this time be outside Canada with an expired PR card without meeting the residency requirements. She can either apply for a travel document or renounce her PR. You can sponsor her for PR again at the same time you sponsor your daughter. You can not return to join them even with a fresh PR card because when you sponsor, you must be residing in Canada. You can quickly visit them but you must return to Canada again because if immigration finds that you are no longer in Canada, they will cancel the sponsorship.

If the TRP were to be granted for 2 years or more, you can wait until you have your two years in Canada and then apply to extend the TRP and sponsor your child at the same time.

If you can not get the TRP, you would need to go to Canada alone (or with some of your other children) and stay for 2 years straight to save your PR while your wife waits with your daughter outside Canada. After the two years, you could apply for your PR card to be renewed and apply to sponsor your daughter and clarify for the rest of your family that they have lost their PR so you can sponsor them again too.

Remember to keep your boarding cards to prove when you entered Canada and collect some proof of staying in Canada like pay slips, apartment lease, bank records, utility bills etc. That is just in case that you will be asked to prove your days once you have your 2 years.

2. Having a job offer will not help you avoid the residency obligation. If you feel that it would be better for you to forget your PR and apply for a work permit or apply for a PR again with a job offer, that is your choice. In order to get a work permit, you need to prove strong ties to your country and that you will return home after your work in Canada is done because you need to prove that you are not a risk to overstay. If you go for PR with a job offer directly, you need to renounce your current PR first but there is no problem to apply again if you qualify.

 

[DVR]

Dear Leon,

Thanks for such a detailed response. Really appreciate it. So now I going to try the below. Kindly advise if I have understood the same correctly and correct me if I am going wrong anywhere.

1. I am going to call up/visit the local Canadian embassy to apply for my daughters TRV.
2. If I get TRV fine. other wise I will be trying to apply for TRP and travel together. Let's hope for the best

thanks again for clarifying all my doubts.

 

[Leon]

Dear Leon,

Thanks for such a detailed response. Really appreciate it. So now I going to try the below. Kindly advise if I have understood the same correctly and correct me if I am going wrong anywhere.

1. I am going to call up/visit the local Canadian embassy to apply for my daughters TRV.
2. If I get TRV fine. other wise I will be trying to apply for TRP and travel together. Let's hope for the best

thanks again for clarifying all my doubts.

Yes, 1. and 2. are the first steps you have to take.

 

[Msafiri]

Dear Leon,

Thanks for such a detailed response. Really appreciate it. So now I going to try the below. Kindly advise if I have understood the same correctly and correct me if I am going wrong anywhere.

1. I am going to call up/visit the local Canadian embassy to apply for my daughters TRV.
2. If I get TRV fine. other wise I will be trying to apply for TRP and travel together. Let's hope for the best

thanks again for clarifying all my doubts.

IMHO applying for a TRV/TRP will most likely raise a detailed review of your Residence Obligation (RO). Any Visa Officer doing their job would see as a red flag a 2.5 year old child of a Canadian PR that has never been sponsored and question why this was not resolved. Once they start digging then it can get ugly. You have weak reasons for your extensive absence at any appeal if the Visa Office decides to report you/ flag you on FOSS/GCMS and CIC try to get your PR revoked. The courts consistently find absences from Canada for employment purposes (non Canadian employer) not valid - thousands of PRs live and work in Canada even in 'survival' jobs why shouldn't you do the same to maintain PR?

In your shoes I would travel to Canada on my own, get a job and sit tight for 2 years to get the RO back on track. This means you are separated from your family but you did bring this on yourself by remaining outside Canada in breach of the RO until the UAE went sour. Once your RO is good then sponsor all your family.

Alternatively take a big risk and go the TRV/TRP route and hope the VO doesn't sweat it.

 

[DVR]

Dear Msafiri,

Thanks for your kind guidance here.
Really appreciate your suggestion that I should go first alone and sit tight for 2 years to get the RO back on track.

But here also, there is a risk that at port of entry Immigration officer may report that I have not met RO then I will have problem too right?

What are the chances of me getting reported for Insufficient RO? If generally nobody checks at Toronto airport then I can take this chance.

Please help.

Regards,

 

[Hasher]

DVR

Chances are pretty much they will know you do not have 730 days but 50/50 chance they would report. I suggest, if you can sit tight alone for two years then no harm taking this chance. Max. you will be returned (monetary: impact of ticket and living there). But if you won't go at all then you missed the chance. In both cases either you go or not you can still apply again for immigration if you still meet the criteria.

best of luck

 

[Msafiri]

Dear Msafiri,

Thanks for your kind guidance here.
Really appreciate your suggestion that I should go first alone and sit tight for 2 years to get the RO back on track.

But here also, there is a risk that at port of entry Immigration officer may report that I have not met RO then I will have problem too right?

What are the chances of me getting reported for Insufficient RO? If generally nobody checks at Toronto airport then I can take this chance.

Please help.

Regards,

As per Hasher this is a risk you have to take. You should consider yourself lucky to still have a valid PR Card. No one can quantify your chance of success at the port of entry but the odds are in your favour with a valid PR Card. If the CBSA agent reports you then at least you tried...if he doesn't then you are in Canada and the chance to correct your breach.

Several PRs in your situation report travelling back to Canada and entering via an airport with an e-gate system such as Vancouver thus avoiding interacting with CBSA agents...hopefully it works if you do this.

 

[DVR]

Dear Msafiri and Hasher,

Thanks for your kind guidance. eGate seems to be a great idea where we need not face any immigratio officer. Btw, can you please suggest how do get the eGate card?

regards,

 

[Hasher]

DVR

I just asked a friend who came back from Australia and used the Vancouver e-Gate, it is true that process is pretty simple but once you pass the e-gate you find two CBSA officer standing looking into your card (copy of immigiration card)asking where you are coming from and how many days you were out of Canada(this what he experienced)?, if your answer is to their satisfaction then go ahead otherwise they will send you inside a big hall.

I am not scaring you but want to give you a full picture. Still my opinion is you must travel.

regards

 

[ryan007]

DVR,
I think your case is quiet complicated. My advise is to consult a lawyer. All the best.
Cheers

 

[an74]

DVR any update about your case. Do you had any experience?

 

[DVR]

Dear Members,

Wishing you all very happy holidays in advance and I thank all of you for advising and guiding me since last 2 years.

I would like to bring to your attention that all the problems have been sorted out for me. I could enter the Canada while PR was about to expire and I did not meet my residency obligation. IO asked me questions and I answered honestly that I am coming back here for good. They did not report me. I finished my 2 years and PR renewed. meantime I sponsored my daughter as well even before renewing my PR. Her Sponsorship is also granted and she is landed as well. Now I m waiting for her PR cards. That's all. Please find below the Key Lessons learned.

1. Please have full faith in CIC. They do thorough investigation of each case and If you are true then you do not have to worry. just have patience.
2. As suggested by Leon and Msfari many times, if you are not reported at airport then simply keep quite and stay in Canada for 2 years and then you are good.
3. Never ever fall in the trap of such lawyers who claim that they can do some special push to the case and expedite the case. Its not possible at all according to my understanding. CIC takes its own sweet time.

Thanks again all of you and god bless you all.

Best Regards,
DVR