PR card and citizenship question.

[karthicktalk]

Hi - Thanks everyone for continuous helpful responses.

Question:

How is canadian citizenship days counted?

a.) If one gets a PR for 5 years, if the person stays 3 years straight in that 5 years, can he/she apply for citizenship?
b.) If one gets a PR for 5 years, meets residency obligation(fulfills only 2 years) in that 5 years, renews again, gets another 5 years, stays 1 year, then can he/she apply for citizenship?

Thanks in advance.

 

[zardoz]

Hi - Thanks everyone for continuous helpful responses.

Question:

How is canadian citizenship days counted?

a.) If one gets a PR for 5 years, if the person stays 3 years straight in that 5 years, can he/she apply for citizenship?
b.) If one gets a PR for 5 years, meets residency obligation(fulfills only 2 years) in that 5 years, renews again, gets another 5 years, stays 1 year, then can he/she apply for citizenship?

Thanks in advance.

There is no "getting another 5 years". It's a rolling 5 years period. On any day, you must be able to count back 1825 days and have 730 of those days complying with the residency obligation requirements. Of those same 1825 days, you must have been physically present in Canada for at least 1095 of them to be eligible for a citizenship application. There are other calculations for pre-PR physical presence.

 

[dpenabill]

Further note: only days present in Canada WITHIN THE PRECEDING FIVE YEARS count in any of the calculations; when calculating days that count toward compliance with the PR Residency Obligation; and when calculating days that count for citizenship (and whether or not the applicant was a PR or it was pre-PR, only days within the preceding FIVE years get counted).

One exception: days which have not happened (future days) also count toward PR RO compliance UNTIL (and only until) the fifth year anniversary of the day the PR landed and became a PR.

Practical guidelines (just some arithmetic applied):
-- any absence for three consecutive years plus a day will necessarily mean a breach of the PR RO
-- an absence of two consecutive years plus a day will, in effect, require starting over in counting days toward citizenship

 

[luic]

-- an absence of two consecutive years plus a day will, in effect, require starting over in counting days toward citizenship

@Depnabill:

Could you please clarify by example as how starting over the counting works in this scenario? Does it mean to be present for three years all over again and previous presence would not count when x absence is 2 years + 1 day?

 

[dpenabill]

Could you please clarify by example as how starting over the counting works in this scenario? Does it mean to be present for three years all over again and previous presence would not count when x absence is 2 years + 1 day?

Caveat: I did not factor in how February 29 in a leap year is calculated, so technically I may be a day or so off.

My observation, that "an absence of two consecutive years plus a day will, in effect, require starting over in counting days toward citizenship," really is merely simple arithmetic.

The total eligibility period is 1825 days (subject to leap year days). To meet the presence requirement for citizenship, a PR needs to be present at least 1095 of those days. Subtract 731 (two years plus a day) from 1825 and that leaves only 1094 days. That is, that leaves the PR short, as in NOT eligible for citizenship.

Once the PR is abroad two consecutive years, plus at least a day (or two), there will be a minimum 731 days of absence within the preceding five years until, at the soonest, the third year anniversary of the return to Canada.

That is: a PR who is abroad two years and a day (subject to the effect any February 29 in leap years will have) will continue to have absences which total 731 days (at a minimum, assuming no other or further absences) within the preceding five years for at least the next three years after returning to Canada.

Said conversely, a PR who is abroad two years and a day (subject to the effect any February 29 in leap years will have) will not be able to reach a total of 1095 days present in Canada, within the preceding five years, for at least the next three years after returning to Canada (and then only if there are no further absences).

Calendar based example: PR exits Canada January 31, 2017 and does not return to Canada until February 2, 2019 (thus, absent two years plus a day, remembering January 31, 2017 is a day present, not a day absent; and similarly, February 2, 2019 is a day present, not absent). The PR would then have to remain in Canada continuously until February 1, 2022 to meet the 1095 days in Canada within five years requirement.

 

[zardoz]

@Depnabill:

Could you please clarify by example as how starting over the counting works in this scenario? Does it mean to be present for three years all over again and previous presence would not count when x absence is 2 years + 1 day?

It's all because of continuously rolling window of 5 years. As each new day comes in at the front, an old day drops off the back. If the dropping off day happens to be a qualifying day, you end up not increasing the overall amount of qualifying days.

 

[luic]

Calendar based example: PR exits Canada January 31, 2017 and does not return to Canada until February 2, 2019 (thus, absent two years plus a day, remembering January 31, 2017 is a day present, not a day absent; and similarly, February 2, 2019 is a day present, not absent). The PR would then have to remain in Canada continuously until February 1, 2022 to meet the 1095 days in Canada within five years requirement.

@Depnabill:
Will the Calendar based example be the same i.e PR has to remain untill Feb 1, 2022, had the PR been preset in Canada for three years before his exit on January 31, 2017?

 

[karthicktalk]

Thanks, it seems the responses are complicated in simple terms, one has to spend a continuous 3 years in the last 5 years period, in order to be eligible for citizenship requirement, right?

 

[luic]

Thanks, it seems the responses are complicated in simple terms, one has to spend a continuous 3 years in the last 5 years period, in order to be eligible for citizenship requirement, right?

I do not think so. One has to stay 1095 in any rolling 5 years to qualify, that is my understanding..the 3 years need not be continuous so long as they fall in 5 years

 

[dpenabill]

@Depnabill:
Will the Calendar based example be the same i.e PR has to remain untill Feb 1, 2022, had the PR been preset in Canada for three years before his exit on January 31, 2017?

There is no requirement that time in Canada be consecutive, but of course a stay in Canada without leaving is the FASTEST way to reach the 1095 days within five years minimum.

And of course that makes the calculation simple.

When there are absences, the best way to assess hypothetical scenarios is to plug them into the presence calculator.

That said, if a PR has been abroad for two years plus a day (or three days) . . . make it 733 or more consecutive days to be sure leap years are covered . . . no calculation is necessary to recognize the PR will need to start over adding days toward meeting the citizenship requirement.

Not sure what about this you are having difficulty with. The arithmetic is simple. After an absence of 732 days there is no getting to the minimum 1095 days present, within the eligibility period of five years, until 1095 days (three years) after returning to Canada. Again, just arithmetic. Once there is an absence of 731 consecutive days, there is a total of at least 731 days to subtract, leaving the total in Canada less than 1095, until the days absent begin falling out of the calculation as they become more than five years past. (Any absences after returning will, obviously, extend how long it will take.)

If as of today you have been outside Canada for two years plus a day (or three days), that is, if as of March 6, 2018 you have been outside Canada since, say, March 1, 2016, there is no way to be present in Canada for 1095 days within the preceding five years until March 7, 2021. NO MATTER HOW LONG YOU WERE IN CANADA PRIOR TO MARCH 1, 2016.

Plug it into the presence calculator if you doubt it.

 

[luic]

@Depnabill
This now cannot be more clearer. THXXX

 

[Bahamaboy]

Yes I'm kinda stomp also because. ..if saying I wanted to travel to visit my old home say for a week...just me...will I have to wait few years to go down or can I once I've receive my pr card in the mail I can just fly down for the visit (Feb 28)PR approved

 

[karthicktalk]

If say, if someone doesn't meet residency obligation (due to H & C reason), stays in canada for straight 3 years, can he/she eligible to apply citizenship?

Also, for above case, if that person's PR card expires in 2 years, should that person renew his/her card first then apply for citizenship or can he/she apply citizenship directly at the end of 3 years?

 

[canuck78]

Yes I'm kinda stomp also because. ..if saying I wanted to travel to visit my old home say for a week...just me...will I have to wait few years to go down or can I once I've receive my pr card in the mail I can just fly down for the visit (Feb 28)PR approved

Yes you can go on vacation once you have your PR card. Technically you could go before and then get a prod to get home. The may complicate your life though. Easier to wait for the PR card if it is not an emergency.