Personal Effects - switching from temporary resident to permanent resident

[nyctomtl]

I have been in Canada as a temporary resident for a few years. When I arrived in 2012 I completed all the paperwork to temporarily import my belongings and car. Now that I am preparing to land as a permanent resident, I'm wondering how to complete the forms B4 and B4A. I'm happy to simply relist everything I temporarily imported back in 2012 on the form B4 but obviously I am not going to load it up in a truck and bring it to the border when I flagpole and land - in other words, the officer will not have the opportunity to inspect anything. Do I do nothing? Do I re-list it?

I think my car is different. I think I'll have to go through the importation procedures on that since it is currently imported on a temporary basis and not part of the RIV (temporary resident exemption).

Thoughts anyone?

 

[Quink]

I had a similar situation whereby I'd lived in Canada since 2012 and recently landed. I never filled out any forms about my goods or personal belongings, and nobody ever asked me for one. I don't own a car though, and when I arrived I only had two bags and everything I now own was acquired in Canada, so maybe your situation is different.

 

[nyctomtl]

I had a similar situation whereby I'd lived in Canada since 2012 and recently landed. I never filled out any forms about my goods or personal belongings, and nobody ever asked me for one. I don't own a car though, and when I arrived I only had two bags and everything I now own was acquired in Canada, so maybe your situation is different.

Thanks. Other than the car I think we are in the same position. Question though... When you first arrived as a temporary resident, did you temporarily import your stuff? I did and I was issued a "Temporary Admission Permit"... The thing I'm a little bit worried about is that if I don't somehow convert that to a permanent admission that I am going to get a letter someday saying either "hey you owe us duty on all that stuff since you overstayed your temporary admission" or "you need to remove all that stuff from Canada immediately". I suppose I should just bring all that paperwork for my landing meeting and I'll get it straightened out but just trying to prepare myself to make that meeting go as smoothly as possible. Thanks!

 

[spyfy]

Your situation seems to be rather special since you actually filled out paperwork when you first moved here. Based on your profile pic, I assume you are from the states and crossed the border with a car/truck full of stuff and declared that (which is of course the right thing to do).

Most people are in a different situation. I would assume my situation, which is as follows, is rather typical. Not sure if it helps in any way, though:
- When I first moved here, I arrived via air from Europe with three bags. When I did my landing formalities (with a study permit, i.e. as a temporary resident) they asked me if I have any goods to follow which wasn't the case. They didn't even ask me about the goods I had with me, but frankly apart from my laptop, there wouldn't have been anything of particular value (just clothes, some books etc)
- When I landed as a PR 2 years later, I crossed the border on foot at Rainbow Bridge with nothing but a small backpack. Before I even got to the actual landing process, as always, you are first talking to the border officer that processes the everyday business (the ones directly talking to people in their cars). I told him I'm landing as a PR, then he filled out a quick form and asked me "are you importing any goods?" to which I literally answered "Well, I have been living in Canada for 2 years, so I'm not bringing anything today". He just said "oh, OK", send me of to immigration processing and I was never asked about any goods ever again.

HOWEVER, in your case things are different for two reasons:
1. You filed some paperwork when you first came here, so they actually are aware of your goods.
2. You actually important goods of significant value, particularly your car.

If I understand the Canadian customs system right, I think you have to accept the fact that you will have to pay duties on your car and other valuable items you initially imported. The only question is how to inform them the right way. I would also say that the best thing is to just bring all that paperwork from your first move.

 

[nyctomtl]

Your situation seems to be rather special since you actually filled out paperwork when you first moved here. Based on your profile pic, I assume you are from the states and crossed the border with a car/truck full of stuff and declared that (which is of course the right thing to do).

Most people are in a different situation. I would assume my situation, which is as follows, is rather typical. Not sure if it helps in any way, though:
- When I first moved here, I arrived via air from Europe with three bags. When I did my landing formalities (with a study permit, i.e. as a temporary resident) they asked me if I have any goods to follow which wasn't the case. They didn't even ask me about the goods I had with me, but frankly apart from my laptop, there wouldn't have been anything of particular value (just clothes, some books etc)
- When I landed as a PR 2 years later, I crossed the border on foot at Rainbow Bridge with nothing but a small backpack. Before I even got to the actual landing process, as always, you are first talking to the border officer that processes the everyday business (the ones directly talking to people in their cars). I told him I'm landing as a PR, then he filled out a quick form and asked me "are you importing any goods?" to which I literally answered "Well, I have been living in Canada for 2 years, so I'm not bringing anything today". He just said "oh, OK", send me of to immigration processing and I was never asked about any goods ever again.

HOWEVER, in your case things are different for two reasons:
1. You filed some paperwork when you first came here, so they actually are aware of your goods.
2. You actually important goods of significant value, particularly your car.

If I understand the Canadian customs system right, I think you have to accept the fact that you will have to pay duties on your car and other valuable items you initially imported. The only question is how to inform them the right way. I would also say that the best thing is to just bring all that paperwork from your first move.

Thanks. I hadn't even considered owing taxes because I thought I would be entitled to the Settlers Exemption. I suppose if they tell me I do owe taxes then I'll just load my stuff up and drive it back to the US and then bring it back into Canada when I land. In fact that is actually what will be happening with my car as I will need to export it from the US and import it into Canada when I land (or list it as goods to follow). The weird thing about everything other than my car is I could just say I threw it away (I've been here for 4 years under two work permits). That last statement is not too far from reality.... I didn't bring in anything of value in 2012 and whatever value it had then has certainly diminished to close to zero (clothes, furniture, etc.).

 

[spyfy]

Back when I landed, I quickly read into the whole topic regarding customs (but then dropped it since I didn't really have a lot of stuff).
The rules for the "Settlers Exemption" are quite complicated, particularly if you switch from temporary to permanent resident.
In my list of links from back then, I found this link. However, reading one isolated legal source doesn't always help much.
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/dm-md/d2/d2-2-1-eng.html

In any case, I think it is a good idea to call CBSA (see link below). This might be better than just asking at the border since in some cases changing your mind about some particular goods at the border might not work or would be complicated, e.g. if you say "OK, I will import my car later" they might say "no you have to import it now" or things like that.
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/contact/bis-sif-eng.html

Also, since I don't own a car I know nothing about car imports. It's just that car import is a recurring topic in this forum and by skimming through those threads I get the feeling that it's a very cumbersome process. But I would have to refer to others for help.

My general experience with customs officers is that the better prepared you appear, the easier and the more lenient they are. If you give them a paperslip with coffee stains they already are a bit annoyed. If you give them a printout of a fancy Excel spreadsheet, they get very excited.

And in the end you should do what you think is the most reasonable thing. For instance if they ask about clothes, just as you suggested, I would say "by now I only own clothes that I bought in Canada". That might not be 100% correct, but it's very close to the truth and I don't think it's in any way unethical to do that to avoid filling out a form for two pairs of socks and a chair to pay $2 in taxes. When it comes to customs, it's the expensive things they care about.

 

[AshesNdust]

Just wanted to add my experience on this. I worked in Canada for 2 years before I got PR. When I first areived, I just had a suit with clothes. After a few months I decided I wanted to move to Canada. So, I flew home, got rid of my apartment and put all my stuff into storage.

Fast forward two years later, I apply and was granted PR. When I went to do my landing, I filled out the B4 form for goods to follow since I was't moving my stuff yet, but plan to in the future. So, during my landing, I mention my goods and show the officer my forms. He just looked at them and said he didn't need them since I don't have anything with me. I then asked him if they needed to be stamped or anything and he said no. He said that as long as I did it within a year of my landing, then I am fine.

Hopefully this is accurate info from the officer, but it seems like different people are told different things.

 

[nyctomtl]

Thanks. I called CBSA as Spyfy suggested. Easy to get through, very nice guy. He said for me to bring all the paperwork from when I entered as a temporary resident and explain what is happening. He made it sound like there will be no issues at all. Almost made me feel like I'm making things more complicated than they need to be. I'm getting the feeling (from this phone call with CBSA and other posts) that there is almost no scrutiny of the belongings of newly-landed PRs. Hope that is the case. Plan to land on Tuesday February 16th with nothing but paperwork and my car (which I will list as goods to follow since I don't yet have clean title for it).

The CBSA guy even suggested I just make an appointment at an Inland office which is a little more used to temporary residents becoming permanent residents. I tried to call the number (888-242-2100) but couldn't get through to a human.

 

[spyfy]

Thanks. I called CBSA as Spyfy suggested. Easy to get through, very nice guy. He said for me to bring all the paperwork from when I entered as a temporary resident and explain what is happening. He made it sound like there will be no issues at all. Almost made me feel like I'm making things more complicated than they need to be. I'm getting the feeling (from this phone call with CBSA and other posts) that there is almost no scrutiny of the belongings of newly-landed PRs. Hope that is the case. Plan to land on Tuesday February 16th with nothing but paperwork and my car (which I will list as goods to follow since I don't yet have clean title for it).

The CBSA guy even suggested I just make an appointment at an Inland office which is a little more used to temporary residents becoming permanent residents. I tried to call the number (888-242-2100) but couldn't get through to a human.

Good to hear that you had an informative phone call! Regarding the inland landing: That is definitely an option, but I heard that appointments have to be made 4-8 weeks in advance to do the landing whereas you could go to the border tomorrow. But if you aren't in a hurry, that works too, of course.

 

[keesio]

I have been in Canada as a temporary resident for a few years. When I arrived in 2012 I completed all the paperwork to temporarily import my belongings and car. Now that I am preparing to land as a permanent resident, I'm wondering how to complete the forms B4 and B4A. I'm happy to simply relist everything I temporarily imported back in 2012 on the form B4 but obviously I am not going to load it up in a truck and bring it to the border when I flagpole and land - in other words, the officer will not have the opportunity to inspect anything. Do I do nothing? Do I re-list it?

I think my car is different. I think I'll have to go through the importation procedures on that since it is currently imported on a temporary basis and not part of the RIV (temporary resident exemption).

Thoughts anyone?

I came to Canada in 2001 on a work permit. Had my list of goods presented to CBSA then. Lived/worked in Canada on work permits (renewed every year) until 2009 when I became a PR. I landed in Pearson. I did not need a B4 since all my stuff was already in Canada so I had nothing new to declare. I just landed and that was it.

 

[nyctomtl]

I came to Canada in 2001 on a work permit. Had my list of goods presented to CBSA then. Lived/worked in Canada on work permits (renewed every year) until 2009 when I became a PR. I landed in Pearson. I did not need a B4 since all my stuff was already in Canada so I had nothing new to declare. I just landed and that was it.

Landed today... No problems.... I listed on Form B4 (in very general terms) the items I had brought into Canada as a temporary resident four years ago. The officer was fine with everything. Pretty sure he would have been fine if I had listed nothing on Form B4 and mentioned that I brought everything into Canada four years ago when I entered as as temporary resident. He stamped the forms without even really reviewing the items. Couldn't have been easier.

 

[spyfy]

Landed today... No problems.... I listed on Form B4 (in very general terms) the items I had brought into Canada as a temporary resident four years ago. The officer was fine with everything. Pretty sure he would have been fine if I had listed nothing on Form B4 and mentioned that I brought everything into Canada four years ago when I entered as as temporary resident. He stamped the forms without even really reviewing the items. Couldn't have been easier.

Nice. I'm glad that worked out so well! It's always better to be overprepared.

 

[lkrm96]

REALLY need help on this subject! I applied inland (through family spousal sponsorship) in January 2018... I am now having my meeting friday to confirm my permanent residency. I have some things here, but i really still want to go home (to the united states) to get the rest of my things. i dont really know everything that i have so i am not able to make a complete and accurate list yet of the things that i will be getting later.. what do i do in this situation. i am afraid that i will get screwed over and not be able to bring my things without paying a duty.....