Open work permit or something else

[davide445]

Dear all,

just made my online assessment on CIC, suggested me to apply under Open Work Permit.

This leave me with some doubt, since looking into CIC guide "Who can apply for an open work permit?" for eligibility conditions I can't find myself in any of that.

I especially wonder why the official assessment form doesn't ask me for education or work experience, considering the how much the topic it's stressed on immigration related articles.

Just want to have some suggestions considering my profile:

Work Experience:
6 years of business development/business planning in wind power, financial technology, consulting
7 years of project/program management in financial technology
1 year in public research, with international publication
3 years part time in high-tech R&D startups as investors development/business planning, received national award for innovation

Education:
ISCED 2011 Level 7 (Master or equivalent)
MSc in Physics (top marks, in Italy)
Executive MBA (top marks cum laude, in Italy)
Certificate of Advanced Studies in Risk Management (just finished, in Switzerland)

Business core competencies:
Business planning
Scenario evaluation
Capital budgeting
Technology selection
Investors development
Business presentation

Personal status:
Married, no children
Both of us are living in Italy
My wife work in arts business (ballet teacher)

Languages
English: 6 years ago I've done TOEFL iBT assessment and received 95/120 marks
German: basic knowledge
Italian obviously mother tongue

 

[Leon]

Right, you don't qualify for an open work permit. For that, your wife would have to be working in Canada on a work permit or studying on a study permit. If she wants to take a course, you could do it that way. She applies for a study permit and you apply for an open work permit based on her permit.

Otherwise, you'd need a regular work permit which means you have to get a job offer and the employer would have to advertise the job and apply for a labour market opinion to prove that they couldn't find a Canadian for the job. If they get the LMO, you can apply for a work permit. If you are on a skilled work permit, your wife can apply for an open permit based on yours.

 

[davide445]

Sure she won't apply for a study permit, I will be the first to search a entry in Canada.

So my choice is coming in Canada as tourist and look for a work, or ask for Skilled Worker Permit first and next looking for a job, or apply for job outside Canada and have a sponsorship?

What can be the most effective solution?

 

[Leon]

The most effective solution is to start your job search online. If you have no luck or you have interested parties but they want to meet you first, then you can set up interviews and go to Canada to make them.

When you arrive in Canada as a visitor, you should not tell immigration that you are planning on looking for work. You could say that you have set up a job interview and that you will go home after it is done and wait for your LMO (labour market opinion) and work permit to come through. Immigration does not want to hear that you are planning on staying as a visitor for months and aimlessly look for work. They would worry that you run out of money and work illegally. The process of getting an LMO and a work permit can take a few months.

You can not apply for a skilled work permit before getting a job.

The process for a work permit is like this:

1) You find an employer who wants to hire you.

2) The employer applies for the LMO (labour market opinion) fulfilling criteria like advertising the job in order to prove that he has tried to find Canadians qualified for the job but failed. He must also be offering market wage.

3) If the employer gets the LMO, he will send it to you and you can use it to apply for your work permit.

Another way to come to Canada would be to apply for your immigration (permanent residency) directly. In most cases, you also need a job offer for that but getting one is not always easy. The processing time is in most cases over a year and the employer would ask why he should wait that long, besides, he has no guarantee that you will come and work for him when you arrive as you will be a PR and free to take up any job.

 

[davide445]

Reading latest news appear I have a second choice: applying in May under FSW program, considering I have (more than) 1 year of experience in the NIC 1112 Financial and investment analysts.

What I don't understand: the 5000 applications cap will be calculated on the submission time? So there will be a "click race" to be the first one?

Also there are any idea if employment offer-backed applications will be favored respect simply skill-based one?

 

[scylla]

Reading latest news appear I have a second choice: applying in May under FSW program, considering I have (more than) 1 year of experience in the NIC 1112 Financial and investment analysts.

What I don't understand: the 5000 applications cap will be calculated on the submission time? So there will be a "click race" to be the first one?

Also there are any idea if employment offer-backed applications will be favored respect simply skill-based one?

The overall cap is 5,000. The cap for NOC 1112 is 300. And yes - it will be a race to mail the applications in first (you can't apply online). After the first 300 applications have been accepted the rest will be autmatically returned without being processed.

Have you completed the IELTS English test yet? This is mandatory for all applicants under the FSW program and your application will be refused if you don't include the results of this test along with your initial application. If you haven't done the test yet, I don't think there's any way you will be able to put your application together in time to make the cap. (Just my opinion obviously.)

 

[davide445]

No I haven't done the IELTS test yet, and that was also my concern.
I have done 6 years ago TOEFL test scored above CLB 7 requested level, but as I understood this is both not accepted and also too old to be still valid.

Also this "death race" it's a bit weird, I'm thinking how a immigrant officer can evaluate an application of a skilled, experienced professional that prefer to fulfill a request without being able to be sponsored for a job. Anyway using the online assessment my score is 76.

My final concern is: I can search online for a job, but I've been told employers value better professional that already are in Canada.
I think anyway will be a waste of time come in Canada without scheduled work meetings.

From potential employers point of view will be anyway valuable I have already applied for FSW just to demonstrate my commitment?
Or will be better just to schedule in advance a trip so to use it also for commitment validation (and also for more tactic reasons)?

 

[scylla]

No I haven't done the IELTS test yet, and that was also my concern.
I have done 6 years ago TOEFL test scored above CLB 7 requested level, but as I understood this is both not accepted and also too old to be still valid.

Correct - too old and not accepted. You would need to take IELTS now.

Also this "death race" it's a bit weird, I'm thinking how a immigrant officer can evaluate an application of a skilled, experienced professional that prefer to fulfill a request without being able to be sponsored for a job.

I don't understand what you are saying / asking here.

 

[davide445]

I don't understand what you are saying / asking here.

Just asking if can worth anyway the effort to submit my application now (I also doubt will be able to do it, but), or just the fact I haven't an arrangement employment will put me at the end of the row.

Also about my second question: looking for a work, from potential employers point of view will be valuable if I have already applied for FSW, just to demonstrate my commitment?
Or will be better/equivalent to schedule a trip in Canada before searching online, so to use it also for commitment validation?

 

[Leon]

Also this "death race" it's a bit weird, I'm thinking how a immigrant officer can evaluate an application of a skilled, experienced professional that prefer to fulfill a request without being able to be sponsored for a job. Anyway using the online assessment my score is 76.

They used to allow people to apply without a job offer and they did that for years and the result was a clogged immigration system where the processing time to get permanent residency was 6-7 years in some countries and where people who were not needed in Canada were clogging up the system preventing the needed from getting through and where people would arrive in Canada after having gotten their immigration and finding that they couldn't get a job in their field.

My final concern is: I can search online for a job, but I've been told employers value better professional that already are in Canada.

Most employers would like to hire people that do not cause them to have to do any paperwork like apply for an LMO. Being in Canada if you still need a work permit wouldn't help much because the employer has to do the paperwork and wait for months until you can start working.

 

[davide445]

They used to allow people to apply without a job offer and they did that for years and the result was a clogged immigration system where the processing time to get permanent residency was 6-7 years in some countries and where people who were not needed in Canada were clogging up the system preventing the needed from getting through and where people would arrive in Canada after having gotten their immigration and finding that they couldn't get a job in their field.

Most employers would like to hire people that do not cause them to have to do any paperwork like apply for an LMO. Being in Canada if you still need a work permit wouldn't help much because the employer has to do the paperwork and wait for months until you can start working.

Yes I understood the idea, just correct.

But in fact I see a problem: employee will never hire me since I'm not in Canada, and they will also not hire me if I haven't a work permit, but I need to have a work to have the work permit.

A person I know have had education in Canada and was able to find a work in that way, but think really I don't need to proceed further in education, having already two levels of postgraduate specialization. So that cannot be my path.

So ... how foreign workers manage to find a work normally? A temporary work will smooth the process?

 

[Leon]

But in fact I see a problem: employee will never hire me since I'm not in Canada, and they will also not hire me if I haven't a work permit, but I need to have a work to have the work permit.

A person I know have had education in Canada and was able to find a work in that way, but think really I don't need to proceed further in education, having already two levels of postgraduate specialization. So that cannot be my path.

So ... how foreign workers manage to find a work normally? A temporary work will smooth the process?

Many people come to Canada on a work permit every year and somehow all of them have managed to find an employer and get a work permit even though they weren't in Canada. Some of them were lucky and may have answered an ad they saw posted by an agency in their own country and others have been actively looking for work in Canada online, contacting many employers and getting many rejections before they found one who was willing to apply for the LMO and help them get a work permit. Once you have a skilled work permit, you only have to work for a year and then you can apply for your immigration without a problem (Canadian experience class).

If you are not willing to try, there is also nothing wrong with staying in Europe.

 

[davide445]

Many people come to Canada on a work permit every year and somehow all of them have managed to find an employer and get a work permit even though they weren't in Canada. Some of them were lucky and may have answered an ad they saw posted by an agency in their own country and others have been actively looking for work in Canada online, contacting many employers and getting many rejections before they found one who was willing to apply for the LMO and help them get a work permit. Once you have a skilled work permit, you only have to work for a year and then you can apply for your immigration without a problem (Canadian experience class).

If you are not willing to try, there is also nothing wrong with staying in Europe.

Absolutely not, I can stay in EU, except it's from 2005 when I was in New Zealand I'm evaluating the perfect place to relocate.
I needed time to find and create my specialization in business, now I'm ready to exploit it, with different perspectives as in EU.

After crossing industrial focus on real and not only financial assets, expanding renewable energy market, high tech startups intensity, economic growth, transparency in business, immigrants acceptance, English speaking, beautiful nature, international city, safety for children, quality of education, distance from EU, availability of professional ballet schools ... I can't find a better place than Canada and I think especially Ontario. I was already there and in Quebec.

My concern was I can't understood the value proposition of a foreign worker in that settings. I'ts a lot of work for a employee to hire someone from outside Canada. I need to care about my positioning, otherwise I'm wasting my and potential employers time sending not competitive CVs.

What are employers searching from a specialized foreign professional? Lower costs? More commitment? Different working experience? Contacts with foreign markets? Why don't go for near USA based professionals?

 

[Leon]

When employers in Canada think about hiring a foreign worker, it is probably because they have a hard time finding Canadian workers. If there were plenty of Canadians available with the same skills, they would not be able to get the LMO anyway. One side aspect could be lower cost as well. Recruiting from the US means paying more because salaries for professionals there tend to be higher.

Although it is a bit of paperwork to get that work permit, it's not like other countries don't have the same rules. I don't know of any 1st world country that allows an employer to bring in foreign employees at will when skilled people are available. If it were allowed, you would have a lot of unemployed locals while people from other countries underbid them for the jobs.

 

[davide445]

When employers in Canada think about hiring a foreign worker, it is probably because they have a hard time finding Canadian workers. If there were plenty of Canadians available with the same skills, they would not be able to get the LMO anyway. One side aspect could be lower cost as well. Recruiting from the US means paying more because salaries for professionals there tend to be higher.

Although it is a bit of paperwork to get that work permit, it's not like other countries don't have the same rules. I don't know of any 1st world country that allows an employer to bring in foreign employees at will when skilled people are available. If it were allowed, you would have a lot of unemployed locals while people from other countries underbid them for the jobs.

I was reading this Friday, Apr. 19 2013 The Globe and Mail article http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/foreign-workers-a-boon-for-employers-for-canada-not-so-much/article11433730/ about temporary workers, appear TFW program can create trouble for low-skilled jobs.
Reading the infographic appear also high-skills jobs are just some thousand, so really few in fact.

Since I don't want and I'm not able anyway to compete with local skilled workers, there is some way to know what jobs are in shortage, so to
1. apply only for them and not wasting my and others time proposing myself for local fitted jobs
2. know how much and where are these jobs