Not Fullfilling Residency Obligation For PR Renewal

[Helu]

I landed in Canada in May,2007 and returned back to my country within a month. I returned back to Canada in Nov.,2011 which means I don't fullfill the residency obligation for the PR Card Renewal.
1. Shall I apply for the PR Card renewal without fullfilling the residency obligation.
2. Is it legal to stay with the expired PR till I complete the residency obligation and then apply for the PR Renewal.

What can be the possible consequences in both the case.

Please help.....

 

[scylla]

1. No. Don't apply to renew your PR card until you have accummulated 730 days of living in Canada out of the last five years. If you apply without fulfilling the residency obligation, you'll likely receive a residency questionnaire, have to appear before a judge and risk losing your PR status.
2. Yes - it is legal to stay with an expired card.

 

[Helu]

Hi Scylla
Thank You for the reply and the information

The following information which I got from the cic website concerns me
"
Persons who became permanent residents of Canada less than five years prior to the date of
receipt of the application are governed by A28(2)(b)(i). This subsection of the Act allows new
permanent residents to qualify under the residency obligation provided that they can potentially
meet the 730-day criteria during the first five-year period immediately after their arrival in Canada.
Even if a person resides away from Canada for up to three years following the date of first arrival
in Canada, that person will retain permanent resident status as long as they still have the
possibility of complying with the 730-days-in-Canada rule. "

Please help...

 

[SenoritaBella]

@Helu, they only look at the 5 years preceeding your application for renewal. If you don't leave Canada between now and Dec 2013, you can apply to renew your PR card. They will look at 2008 to 2013(5 year period) and you will have the 730 days.

But if you apply now, they will look at 2007 to 2012 and in that 5 year period, you've only spent about 7 months in Canada and risk losing your PR status.

Had you spent more time in Canada over the last 5 years you would have been a citizen now and save yourself the hassle.

 

[robfis]

Yes, apply after you have the 5 yrs and you will be ok.
Can you please share your experience when you returned after more than 3 yrs?
Were you questioned about the long stay outside Canada?
Thanks, Robert

 

[Helu]

Thank you very much "SenoritaBella" for the information.

1. Is it not illegal to stay here with an expired card.

"Robert" I was in without any questions.

 

[SenoritaBella]

No, it is not illegal to stay in Canada with an expired card. You still have a copy of your confirmation of permanent residence(COPR) and you are still a PR. The card just enables you to re-enter Canada by commercial carrier(plane, bus, etc).

 

[Helu]

Thanks for the Help.

Yes I have all the Papers with me including " confirmation of permanent residence(COPR)".



1. I mailed to one of the immigration consultants whom I know thru my friend. This is the answer which I got from him.

" You cannot stay here with an expired PR card. The risk is serious because if your card is not renewed, immigration will know that and you could get arrested for illegally staying in Canada. That could result into deportation. Best case scenario; apply for renewal. Let them reject your application and when it is rejected you contact me without delay of even a day. ".

2. This answer from the immigration lawyer is a big worry for me. Please help me how far this is true



3. Now my Friends are suggesting me to consult an immigration consultant. Is it worth to do so at this stage.

 

[Leon]

" You cannot stay here with an expired PR card. The risk is serious because if your card is not renewed, immigration will know that and you could get arrested for illegally staying in Canada. That could result into deportation. Best case scenario; apply for renewal. Let them reject your application and when it is rejected you contact me without delay of even a day. ".

This is total and utter BS. This so called consultant has no idea what they are doing or worse, they know but are trying to mess up your case so you will have to hire them for the next year while you fight to keep your PR because you have applied too early. There is NOTHING in the immigration rules that states you must have a valid PR card to live in Canada. I dare you to find it anywhere on the CIC page. There are PR's who live in Canada who never had a PR card. They did not start using them until 2002 and you only need one to travel. You can even call the CIC call centre. Do not give them your name, just ask the general question of what happens if I did not notice that my PR card expired and I did not renew it. You know what they will tell you. Nothing happens.

There are loads of people who do not apply for their PR card as soon as they expire. They may not even know that it is expired as they haven't noticed. Nothing happens to them. You should never talk to this consultant again and do not discuss your case with your friend again. They are not being helpful to you at all. If you want to hire a real lawyer, talk to the ones that run this forum for example.

Read OP 10, http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/op/index.asp especially this part on page 7:

Even if a person had resided away from Canada for many years, but returned to Canada and
resided there for a minimum of 730 days during the last five years, that person would comply with
the residency obligation and remain a permanent resident. An officer is not permitted to consider
just any five-year period in the applicant’s past, but must always assess the most recent five-year
period preceding the receipt of the application

Also read ENF 27, http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/enf/index.asp page 12:

While the PR card is not a mandatory document within Canada, it is necessary should a
permanent resident travel outside Canada using a commercial transportation company.

 

[Helu]

Thank You Very much "Leon"

You have really relieved from this big tension.
This immigration consultant is really a crook. Here is the information what he gave me before I came to Canada.
"
If you are unable to complete the requirement, they will not renew your PR card and ask you to complete the required number of days. They may hold on to your application until the requirement is met. But it doesn't mean that they'll ask you to leave Canada. You still have your landing document which shows you have landed. The number of days of stay for PR card includes every single day that you have lived there. Sometimes, they might ask for proof of stay so you must have all your passports on which you have travelled to Canada plus some record of travelling to Canada, in/out both.
"

On the basis of this information I decided to come here. But what is writting now is contrary.

 

[Leon]

Thank You Very much "Leon"

You have really relieved from this big tension.
This immigration consultant is really a crook. Here is the information what he gave me before I came to Canada.
"
If you are unable to complete the requirement, they will not renew your PR card and ask you to complete the required number of days. They may hold on to your application until the requirement is met. But it doesn't mean that they'll ask you to leave Canada. You still have your landing document which shows you have landed. The number of days of stay for PR card includes every single day that you have lived there. Sometimes, they might ask for proof of stay so you must have all your passports on which you have travelled to Canada plus some record of travelling to Canada, in/out both.
"

On the basis of this information I decided to come here. But what is writting now is contrary.

What he says that is really closer to the truth except when you do not meet the requirements, you can not count on them to hold your application until you meet the requirements. They would call you for an interview and ask you to clarify if you meet the requirements or have some mitigating circumstances why you don't and if you don't, they could revoke your PR and ask you to leave. This is why you should not apply now.

The number of days stay for PR card include every day since you became a PR within the last 5 years. if you have been a PR for more than 5 years, only the last 5 years count. Therefore, if you stayed outside too long, some of those days will gradually move outside the 5 year window and therefore if you wait to apply, they will not count against you any more.

It is true that they sometimes ask for proof. You should keep a log of your travels that matches all your passport stamps. If you have some other proof of living in Canada, utility bills, lease, receipts, bank records etc. you can bring that too when you go to pick up your card.

 

[csic_student]

Thanks for the Help.

Yes I have all the Papers with me including " confirmation of permanent residence(COPR)".



1. I mailed to one of the immigration consultants whom I know thru my friend. This is the answer which I got from him.

" You cannot stay here with an expired PR card. The risk is serious because if your card is not renewed, immigration will know that and you could get arrested for illegally staying in Canada. That could result into deportation. Best case scenario; apply for renewal. Let them reject your application and when it is rejected you contact me without delay of even a day. ".

2. This answer from the immigration lawyer is a big worry for me. Please help me how far this is true



3. Now my Friends are suggesting me to consult an immigration consultant. Is it worth to do so at this stage.

THIS IS IMMIGRATION CONSULTANT NEEDS HELP! I THINK WHAT HE IS TRYING TO DO IS SCARE TACTICS...

Apply for the PR card after you have lived here for 730 days or more. PR card is just a travel document allows the PRs to come back to Canada.. If your PR card is expired, you have to have a new one before you leave Canada and want to come back. When you apply for a new PR, the CIC officer looks back 5 years and wants to make sure that you are meeting the resindency obligation as per the Act.

 

[Helu]

Thank You all for being generous and replying the questions. This forum is a great help for everyone who is New and need help.

I have few more Queries.

1. I have a driving Lincence which I use as Photo Id.
2. Sometimes they ask for a second piece of Photo Id. Can I use an expired PR as second one.
I have health card but that is without a photo.

 

[csic_student]

Your health card is a valid piece of Id as long as it is accompanied with a photo Id like dl or Provincial id....

 

[SenoritaBella]

No, an expired card can't serve as photo ID. You can apply for a government-issued photo ID card - 8 provinces currently offer them for a small fee.