Not a permanent resident, PR card expired, living outside Canada

[ROKCAN]

Hello.

I am living in South Korea.

I was in Canada until June 2010, then I came to Korea because I wanted to join the ROK Army.

After being discharged, I decided to apply to a college in Korea, because I liked living here.

But I always had the thought that I was going back to Canada after graduation.

However, my personal status was a permanent residence.

I did not know about having to live for 3 years in the past 5 and that the card has an expiration date. (well I was not paying attention when my parents talked about this)

It has been 6 years since I came to Korea, and I recently figured that I am not a permanent residence anymore.

I have a PR card, expired, and my problem is that I do not have a proper identification since my country decided to make my ID useless for some reason.

To make a new one, I need a PR passport. To make the PR passport, I need a PR card that is not expired.

I was going to renounce my PR, but I heard from someone that it can be a disadvantage when I go back to Canada.

I also heard that keeping my PR status, I can renew it when I go back to Canada without going through all the processes again.

Are any of these rumors true?

 

[steaky]

There is no such thing as PR passport. You need to use your South Korean passport to come to Canada before the ETA comes to be mandatory in September.

After coming here, maintain your residency obligation before apply for your new PR card.

 

[Hasan9999]

Hello.

I am living in South Korea.

I was in Canada until June 2010, then I came to Korea because I wanted to join the ROK Army.

After being discharged, I decided to apply to a college in Korea, because I liked living here.

But I always had the thought that I was going back to Canada after graduation.

However, my personal status was a permanent residence.

I did not know about having to live for 3 years in the past 5 and that the card has an expiration date. (well I was not paying attention when my parents talked about this)

It has been 6 years since I came to Korea, and I recently figured that I am not a permanent residence anymore.

I have a PR card, expired, and my problem is that I do not have a proper identification since my country decided to make my ID useless for some reason.

To make a new one, I need a PR passport. To make the PR passport, I need a PR card that is not expired.

I was going to renounce my PR, but I heard from someone that it can be a disadvantage when I go back to Canada.

I also heard that keeping my PR status, I can renew it when I go back to Canada without going through all the processes again.

Are any of these rumors true?

Hi there,

1. You have lost your PR status by not staying physically in Canada for 730 days out of a rolling 5 years.
2. If you are from a visa exempt country, you can come back and see the possibility of reviving your PR status on HC ground...however the possibility is very less.


You can consult with a good immigration lawyer to check what options will be suitable for you.

My PR card expired when I was also at my home country and my physical presence in Canada was also less than required number of days. Naturally I have lost my PR status. I applied again under spousal sponsorship category and it's over 3 years...still waiting!!

Hasan

 

[Hasan9999]

There is no such thing as PR passport. You need to use your South Korean passport to come to Canada before the ETA comes to be mandatory in September.

After coming here, maintain your residency obligation before apply for your new PR card.

Hi there,

Is it possible for him to come back to Canada with his visa exempt passport and fulfill residency obligation afterwards by physically staying another 730 days in Canada and then apply for his PR card renewal?

If he doesn't declare at the port of entry in Canada that his PR card already expired abroad and he couldn't fulfill his residency obligation...will that not be considered by CIC as misrepresentation?

Thank you.

Hasan

 

[canuck_in_uk]

1. You have lost your PR status by not staying physically in Canada for 730 days out of a rolling 5 years.

Incorrect. OP is still a PR, albeit one who does not meet the Residency Obligation. PR status is only lost when formally renounced by the person or revoked by CIC.

To make a new one, I need a PR passport. To make the PR passport, I need a PR card that is not expired.

I was going to renounce my PR, but I heard from someone that it can be a disadvantage when I go back to Canada.

I also heard that keeping my PR status, I can renew it when I go back to Canada without going through all the processes again.

As said above, there is no such thing as a "PR passport". There is a PR card issued by Canada and there is your passport issued by your country of nationality.

If you can get back to Canada and enter without being reported by CBSA for failing to meet the Residency Obligation, you will need to remain in Canada for 2 years. After that, you will once again meet the RO and will be able to apply to renew your PR card.

 

[Hasan9999]

Incorrect. OP is still a PR, albeit one who does not meet the Residency Obligation. PR status is only lost when formally renounced by the person or revoked by CIC.

Yes that's correct no doubt but those who were not from visa exempt country need travel document to go back to Canada and that time question of renouncing the PR arises...in my case I have lost the status at the Canadian HC of my country. But when someone enters with the visa exempt passport if disclosed that the RO was not complied, then what happens? If nothing disclosed? Is not that misrepresentation if found later!!

Hasan

 

[Rob_TO]

But when someone enters with the visa exempt passport if disclosed that the RO was not complied, then what happens? If nothing disclosed? Is not that misrepresentation if found later!!

No it's not misrepresentation. You don't need to voluntarily offer info to CBSA such as how long you've been outside Canada and that you don't meet the RO. However if CBSA asks, then you need to answer truthfully. So some people get lucky and aren't asked too many questions by CBSA, are allowed into Canada without being reported, stay 2 years, and successfully apply for PR renewal.

I also heard that keeping my PR status, I can renew it when I go back to Canada without going through all the processes again.

You basically have 2 options:
1. Apply for a PR Travel Doc from Korea, and try to claim some H&C reasons that you don't meet the RO. If they accept your reasons, you get the PR TD and keep PR status, return to Canada, and can immediately renew your PR card.
However since it doesn't seem like you have any H&C reasons, most likely this would end up with PR TD being denied and your PR status revoked.

2. Return to Canada using just your visa-exempt passport. If you do this before SEpt 29 you can most likely fly here directly, but after when eTA is in full effect you would need to travel to USA and then drive into Canada.
At the border/airport, CBSA may or may not report you for not meeting RO. If they do report you, it will lead to your PR status being revoked or you can go through a lengthy appeal which will still probably end with it being revoked since you don't have any real H&C reasons.
If you aren't reported, then if you live in Canada and don't leave at all for 2 years, you can get back into compliance with the RO and renew your PR card. However you may find it difficult living here for 2 years without a valid PR card.

 

[Hasan9999]

No it's not misrepresentation. You don't need to voluntarily offer info to CBSA such as how long you've been outside Canada and that you don't meet the RO. However if CBSA asks, then you need to answer truthfully. So some people get lucky and aren't asked too many questions by CBSA, are allowed into Canada without being reported, stay 2 years, and successfully apply for PR renewal.

So basically there are two different types of treatment, if you are visa exempt you can revive your PR status by complying RO once you enter not declaring the fact that you couldn't comply earlier while staying abroad....for non visa exempt, you go to local Canadian HC and check with them if you can revive under H&C ground...which obviously a refusal! Isn't it a policy loophole?

 

[canuck_in_uk]

So basically there are two different types of treatment, if you are visa exempt you can revive your PR status by complying RO once you enter not declaring the fact that you couldn't comply earlier while staying abroad....for non visa exempt, you go to local Canadian HC and check with them if you can revive under H&C ground...which obviously a refusal! Isn't it a policy loophole?

Non visa-exempt people can fly to the US and enter Canada via a land border. Many, many people have done this when they didn't meet the RO.

 

[ROKCAN]

There is no such thing as PR passport. You need to use your South Korean passport to come to Canada before the ETA comes to be mandatory in September.

After coming here, maintain your residency obligation before apply for your new PR card.

well it might be because South Korea do not allow dual citizenship..
I went to the government office to make a new passport, and I got an answer that there are two types of different passports: PM and PR
I do not exactly what the difference is, but that is what I heard.

 

[ROKCAN]

No it's not misrepresentation. You don't need to voluntarily offer info to CBSA such as how long you've been outside Canada and that you don't meet the RO. However if CBSA asks, then you need to answer truthfully. So some people get lucky and aren't asked too many questions by CBSA, are allowed into Canada without being reported, stay 2 years, and successfully apply for PR renewal.

You basically have 2 options:
1. Apply for a PR Travel Doc from Korea, and try to claim some H&C reasons that you don't meet the RO. If they accept your reasons, you get the PR TD and keep PR status, return to Canada, and can immediately renew your PR card.
However since it doesn't seem like you have any H&C reasons, most likely this would end up with PR TD being denied and your PR status revoked.

2. Return to Canada using just your visa-exempt passport. If you do this before SEpt 29 you can most likely fly here directly, but after when eTA is in full effect you would need to travel to USA and then drive into Canada.
At the border/airport, CBSA may or may not report you for not meeting RO. If they do report you, it will lead to your PR status being revoked or you can go through a lengthy appeal which will still probably end with it being revoked since you don't have any real H&C reasons.
If you aren't reported, then if you live in Canada and don't leave at all for 2 years, you can get back into compliance with the RO and renew your PR card. However you may find it difficult living here for 2 years without a valid PR card.

Thanks for the detailed help.
I am in a condition where I cannot go anywhere and cannot make a valid passport because the ID card that I had been using is not accepted by the government anymore (for PR and Citizens abroad)
and I am a full time employee / student..
I guess my only option is the first one. If I try it, and my reasons are not accepted, is my PR status automatically revoked? Is it the same as renouncing my PR status myself?
Would it be a penalty if I apply for PR later?
Also, what do you mean by H&C reasons? Is it health and condition? Sorry that I am not used to the term.

 

[Rob_TO]

Thanks for the detailed help.
I am in a condition where I cannot go anywhere and cannot make a valid passport because the ID card that I had been using is not accepted by the government anymore (for PR and Citizens abroad)

You are not a Canadian citizen, so you can not get a Canadian passport . Korea not accepting dual citizenship is irrelevant to you. They don't even need to know if you are a PR of Canada, because PR is not citizenship.

You need to work out how to get a new Korean passport with the Korean government, this is an issue independent of your Canadian PR. Then with a Korean passport, you can attempt to fly to Canada, or to apply for a PR Travel Document.

I guess my only option is the first one. If I try it, and my reasons are not accepted, is my PR status automatically revoked? Is it the same as renouncing my PR status myself?
Would it be a penalty if I apply for PR later?
Also, what do you mean by H&C reasons? Is it health and condition? Sorry that I am not used to the term.

Having a PR Travel Document rejected, will start process to revoke your PR status. If you do nothing then it's the same as renouncing it.
Or you can decide to appeal it, but the chances for winning this is small since you don't really have any H&C reasons. H&C reasons are things like medical reasons of you or a family member that prevented you from returning to Canada, or showing severe hardship if your PR status was revoked.

None of this should have any real impact if you qualify for and apply for PR again in the future.

 

[ROKCAN]

You are not a Canadian citizen, so you can not get a Canadian passport . Korea not accepting dual citizenship is irrelevant to you. They don't even need to know if you are a PR of Canada, because PR is not citizenship.

You need to work out how to get a new Korean passport with the Korean government, this is an issue independent of your Canadian PR. Then with a Korean passport, you can attempt to fly to Canada, or to apply for a PR Travel Document.

Well idk if this is only in Korea or sth but the Korean Government gives different passports to people who are permanent residents of another country. I needed a PR card that is not outdated to get this passport. My resident registration in Korea had been obliterated, so even if I get a Korean Passport that is not for PRs, I wouldn't be able to get a proper identification that I can use in Korea.

Having a PR Travel Document rejected, will start process to revoke your PR status. If you do nothing then it's the same as renouncing it.
Or you can decide to appeal it, but the chances for winning this is small since you don't really have any H&C reasons. H&C reasons are things like medical reasons of you or a family member that prevented you from returning to Canada, or showing severe hardship if your PR status was revoked.

None of this should have any real impact if you qualify for and apply for PR again in the future.

I will have to apply for a PR Travel Document, whether its rejected or not. I don't think I have any other choices. Thanks a lot for your kind help.