Non-accompanying spouse refusing to cooperate for medicals/pcc

[Gurleenkaur2020]

Dear all, although i had applied as a single applicant in may 2020, and in july 2021, i got married (marriage registered). Informed IRCC about marriage and non-accompanying spouse in feb 2022. We are having a troubled marriage and now, my husband is refusing to cooperate for medical/pcc, and threaten me to divorce him or file a petition first, if i want his support. I do not want to file a mutual divorce, for obvious reasons, as my husband and inlaws are involved in adultery and domestic violence, this way they are looking for a safe passage.

1. Now, if IRCC will ask for spouse medical/pcc, what documents or affidavits can be provided to convince them to proceed without my spouse details?
2. Any samples of affidavits? Please.
3. Please share solutions as i feel stuck.
PLEASE PLEASE RESPOND AND HELP

 

[YVR123]

Dear all, although i had applied as a single applicant in may 2020, and in july 2021, i got married (marriage registered). Informed IRCC about marriage and non-accompanying spouse in feb 2022. We are having a troubled marriage and now, my husband is refusing to cooperate for medical/pcc, and threaten me to divorce him or file a petition first, if i want his support. I do not want to file a mutual divorce, for obvious reasons, as my husband and inlaws are involved in adultery and domestic violence, this way they are looking for a safe passage.

1. Now, if IRCC will ask for spouse medical/pcc, what documents or affidavits can be provided to convince them to proceed without my spouse details?
2. Any samples of affidavits? Please.
3. Please share solutions as i feel stuck.
PLEASE PLEASE RESPOND AND HELP

if you want to stay married to him, you need to include his medical and pcc...etc. (even for on-accompanying)

If you want to be divorced, then you need legal divorce document so that you do not need to include him.

I do not know marriage law in your home country (and so.. it's not so obvious as you think). BTW, you should post your question in the immigration stream that you applied for. This is not family sponsorship since you are trying to immigrate alone and you are not being sponsored by a spouse who is a PR or citizen of Canada.

 

[scylla]

Dear all, although i had applied as a single applicant in may 2020, and in july 2021, i got married (marriage registered). Informed IRCC about marriage and non-accompanying spouse in feb 2022. We are having a troubled marriage and now, my husband is refusing to cooperate for medical/pcc, and threaten me to divorce him or file a petition first, if i want his support. I do not want to file a mutual divorce, for obvious reasons, as my husband and inlaws are involved in adultery and domestic violence, this way they are looking for a safe passage.

1. Now, if IRCC will ask for spouse medical/pcc, what documents or affidavits can be provided to convince them to proceed without my spouse details?
2. Any samples of affidavits? Please.
3. Please share solutions as i feel stuck.
PLEASE PLEASE RESPOND AND HELP

If you want to exclude your spouse the medical, you need to have either have started the divorce process or be legally separated (e.g. not be living together). Otherwise your spouse needs to complete the medical / PCC in order for your application to be approved.

 

[Prab2020]

@scylla and @YVR123

Hey VIP Members. I have a query and I would appreciate if you could shed some light here. I have been divorced and have a non-accompanying son with my ex-wife.

I am working with a immigration lawyer and we submitted an affidavit that I forgo my right of sponsoring my son in future and submitted the requests emails and messages I sent to my ex-wife to cooperate for medicals. However, she did not respond to any of that. We submitted the attempts and affidavit right at the start around Dec 2022. Then in March 2023 the IRCC requested medicals again. We again submitted all the documents of attempts and forgoing the right to sponsor. We received a second request for medicals in March 2024. This time we submitted affidavits from family members i.e. parents and siblings that we cannot locate the whereabouts of my ex and unable to get the medicals done. However, in April 2024 the IRCC sent a PFL with the wording below -

"Your non-accompanying dependent does not qualify for an exemption to this requirement pursuant to
paragraph 30 of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations. I have reviewed the documentation you have provided and I am not satisfied that exceptional circumstances are preventing your dependent child to undergo medical examination. Furthermore, Subsection 16(1) of the Immigration
and Refugee Protection Act states that a person who makes an application must answer truthfully all questions put to them for the purpose of the examination and must produce a visa and all relevant evidence and documents that the officer reasonably requires.

The onus is on you to submit the required documents mentioned above. Please also provide relevant
documentation supporting your claim that the mother has full custody of your child. As such you will
have 30 days from the date of this letter to comply. If you do not comply and/or if the required documents
are incomplete with this request within 30 days, your application will be assessed based on the
information currently on file and may result in the refusal of your application."

We submitted all the history around our divorce and how hostile the other party has been towards me in an explanation letter and we submitted proof of more attempts with no response from my ex. We also submitted more affidavits from other family members who are in Canada. However, Today we have received another letter from the IRCC requesting the custody document that states spouse has full custody. However, I don't have the custody document as the mother is considered a natual custodian till the child is 7 years in Pakistan. Therefore, there's no custody document and it is impossible to provide custody document within 7 days. I would have to apply for the custody if I want it and such cases take 3-5 years. Please see the IRCC letter below.

"We have begun processing your application for permanent residence, and in order to make a decision we
require the following information/documents:

Client Information: Please provide custody documents issued by a relevant authority that clearly
states Spouse has full custody. This must be received at this office by: 2024/06/04

Please note that the requested information/documents must be received within 7 days from the date of
this correspondence. Please upload these documents to your MyCIC account.

If we do not receive the information/documents within 7 days, your application will be assessed based on
the information we have on file, meaning your application could be refused as incomplete."


Now we are planning to submit another explanation letter (That there's no custody document) along with a legal opinion letter from a lawyer that mother is considered a natural custodian and even if I apply for the custody I won't be able to get it.

Please share your feedback on my situation guys. Thanks so much.

 

[armoured]

Now we are planning to submit another explanation letter (That there's no custody document) along with a legal opinion letter from a lawyer that mother is considered a natural custodian and even if I apply for the custody I won't be able to get it.

With proviso that I know nothing of Pakistani law, what you propose is, I believe , the correct approach. You haven't stated, but I suggest you need the opinion letter to be from a qualified Pakistani lawyer who can put together a short letter with the correct references to law/case law that states the mother has custody under PK law and no such custody document is possible.

The Canadian lawyer would know how to provide this together with a letter putting this in understandable terms (from Canadian family/admin law perspective).

 

[YVR123]

@scylla and @YVR123

Hey VIP Members. I have a query and I would appreciate if you could shed some light here. I have been divorced and have a non-accompanying son with my ex-wife.

I am working with a immigration lawyer and we submitted an affidavit that I forgo my right of sponsoring my son in future and submitted the requests emails and messages I sent to my ex-wife to cooperate for medicals. However, she did not respond to any of that. We submitted the attempts and affidavit right at the start around Dec 2022. Then in March 2023 the IRCC requested medicals again. We again submitted all the documents of attempts and forgoing the right to sponsor. We received a second request for medicals in March 2024. This time we submitted affidavits from family members i.e. parents and siblings that we cannot locate the whereabouts of my ex and unable to get the medicals done. However, in April 2024 the IRCC sent a PFL with the wording below -

"Your non-accompanying dependent does not qualify for an exemption to this requirement pursuant to
paragraph 30 of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations. I have reviewed the documentation you have provided and I am not satisfied that exceptional circumstances are preventing your dependent child to undergo medical examination. Furthermore, Subsection 16(1) of the Immigration
and Refugee Protection Act states that a person who makes an application must answer truthfully all questions put to them for the purpose of the examination and must produce a visa and all relevant evidence and documents that the officer reasonably requires.

The onus is on you to submit the required documents mentioned above. Please also provide relevant
documentation supporting your claim that the mother has full custody of your child. As such you will
have 30 days from the date of this letter to comply. If you do not comply and/or if the required documents
are incomplete with this request within 30 days, your application will be assessed based on the
information currently on file and may result in the refusal of your application."

We submitted all the history around our divorce and how hostile the other party has been towards me in an explanation letter and we submitted proof of more attempts with no response from my ex. We also submitted more affidavits from other family members who are in Canada. However, Today we have received another letter from the IRCC requesting the custody document that states spouse has full custody. However, I don't have the custody document as the mother is considered a natual custodian till the child is 7 years in Pakistan. Therefore, there's no custody document and it is impossible to provide custody document within 7 days. I would have to apply for the custody if I want it and such cases take 3-5 years. Please see the IRCC letter below.

"We have begun processing your application for permanent residence, and in order to make a decision we
require the following information/documents:

Client Information: Please provide custody documents issued by a relevant authority that clearly
states Spouse has full custody. This must be received at this office by: 2024/06/04

Please note that the requested information/documents must be received within 7 days from the date of
this correspondence. Please upload these documents to your MyCIC account.

If we do not receive the information/documents within 7 days, your application will be assessed based on
the information we have on file, meaning your application could be refused as incomplete."


Now we are planning to submit another explanation letter (That there's no custody document) along with a legal opinion letter from a lawyer that mother is considered a natural custodian and even if I apply for the custody I won't be able to get it.

Please share your feedback on my situation guys. Thanks so much.

I agree that getting a lawyer involve to response to the PFL and confirm of the natural custodian in Pakistan.
From the information you provided, I think that's missing and was assumed that IRCC knows of this default. But this is not automatic in other countries. (missing custody document with no direct explanation may be the cause of PFL.)
Since you have already provide that you are unable to reach the child and the mother.

 

[Prab2020]

Thank you so much, guys. This is superhelpful. I will try to get these documents and submit.

 

[armoured]

Thank you so much, guys. This is superhelpful. I will try to get these documents and submit.

To confirm though - was this the approach that your lawyer had suggested?

 

[Prab2020]

My Canadian immigration lawyer suggested to explain that it is not possible to get a custody document for two reasons 1) I don't know the where abouts of my ex-wife and son. 2) A mother is considered a natural custodian and to site direct references to the Pakistani Law 3) Resubmit the legal opinion of Pakistani Lawyer where they don't recommend applying for custody because I will never get it and it could take up to 3-5 years for custody case to conclude with negative result in my favour.

In response to the first PFL received, we did submit a legal opinion letter from a Pakistani lawyer that stated "The mother is the natural custodian till the age of 7 and it is with cited law reference - However, Visa officer sent another PFL requesting an "Official Custody Document stating ex-wife has full custody from relevant authorities i.e. court".

So now, I am planning to resubmit the legal opinion from the lawyer along with my explanation letter which will focus on explaining why there's no official custody document and why have I not applied for one.

@armoured What is your opinion. What are my chances of getting approved for PR after I re-submit the legal opinion from Pakistani Lawyer again and further explaining that why I haven't applied for my son's custody?

 

[canuck78]

My Canadian immigration lawyer suggested to explain that it is not possible to get a custody document for two reasons 1) I don't know the where abouts of my ex-wife and son. 2) A mother is considered a natural custodian and to site direct references to the Pakistani Law 3) Resubmit the legal opinion of Pakistani Lawyer where they don't recommend applying for custody because I will never get it and it could take up to 3-5 years for custody case to conclude with negative result in my favour.

In response to the first PFL received, we did submit a legal opinion letter from a Pakistani lawyer that stated "The mother is the natural custodian till the age of 7 and it is with cited law reference - However, Visa officer sent another PFL requesting an "Official Custody Document stating ex-wife has full custody from relevant authorities i.e. court".

So now, I am planning to resubmit the legal opinion from the lawyer along with my explanation letter which will focus on explaining why there's no official custody document and why have I not applied for one.

@armoured What is your opinion. What are my chances of getting approved for PR after I re-submit the legal opinion from Pakistani Lawyer again and further explaining that why I haven't applied for my son's custody?

IRCC is very reluctant not to include children in PR applications. This is partially because people then attempt to sponsor their children when they get older and discover it isn’t possible.

 

[Prab2020]

@canuck78 But if I surrender my right to sponsor will they accept and remove my non accompanying child from the application? Are there any chances of getting approved?

 

[armoured]

My Canadian immigration lawyer suggested to explain that it is not possible to get a custody document for two reasons 1) I don't know the where abouts of my ex-wife and son. 2) A mother is considered a natural custodian and to site direct references to the Pakistani Law 3) Resubmit the legal opinion of Pakistani Lawyer where they don't recommend applying for custody because I will never get it and it could take up to 3-5 years for custody case to conclude with negative result in my favour.

In response to the first PFL received, we did submit a legal opinion letter from a Pakistani lawyer that stated "The mother is the natural custodian till the age of 7 and it is with cited law reference - However, Visa officer sent another PFL requesting an "Official Custody Document stating ex-wife has full custody from relevant authorities i.e. court".

So now, I am planning to resubmit the legal opinion from the lawyer along with my explanation letter which will focus on explaining why there's no official custody document and why have I not applied for one.

@armoured What is your opinion. What are my chances of getting approved for PR after I re-submit the legal opinion from Pakistani Lawyer again and further explaining that why I haven't applied for my son's custody?

My only comment is this: what is this stuff about applying for custody? No-one has asked you to apply for custody, they have asked you to show that you do not have custody (and either 'give up' future ability to sponsor OR at least get the child to take the medicals etc). Talk of trying to custody implies you want custody, or think you have a chance of getting it.

Which, fair enough, IF that's the case. If it's not, it is 100% in contradiction of the case you are making here of swearing off the child and refusing any future ability to sponsor the child.

Make up your mind.

This may sound like a minor point, but I'm certain there's an IRCC lawyer who will think this is weird (on your part) and implies you're going to claim in future that you were coerced or something.

Claims that you want or are even considering a legal case to GET custody undermine your application.

This is IMHO and I could be wrong, but I don't see as it has any place in your submission.

 

[canuck78]

@canuck78 But if I surrender my right to sponsor will they accept and remove my non accompanying child from the application? Are there any chances of getting approved?

IRCC is very reluctant to not include children in PR sponsorships because there have been so many cases where in the future children want to come to Canada and it is no longer possible or they overstay their TRV and attempt to obtain PR. You will have to show proof that you have taken all steps in Pakistan to try and get the medical done/contact your ex-spouse. For example did you send registered mail to her home or send her a letter from your lawyer. You should prove that you will not have custody longterm because after age 7 you could get partial/full custody. Did your divorce not indicate longterm custody of your child? How old is your child?

 

[Prab2020]

Thanks guys for your response. @armoured what is this stuff about applying for custody?

Basically, what I was saying is that once a divorce final in Pakistan, the mother is considered to be a natural custodian and has a preferential right to the custody till the the child is seven years of age. Therefore, she can keep the child and keep being the custodian. However, that does not mean that father does not have the right to apply. He can surely go to the court but the courts never uproots a minor child from a mother. Having that said, the IRCC officer could ask that why did I not go to the court to get the matter sorted or to apply for custody or visitation to meet my child? To answe this question I was being proactive and outlined my reasons not to apply i.e. 1) I don't want his custody because I know his welfare is with the mother 2) These case take 3-5 years with a negative outcome for father 3) I don't know my ex-wife or child's whereabouts.

@canuck78

My child is around 5. I did not send letter or mail to the registered address however, I called her on more than a dozen occasions, sent emails to her and her sisters, sent text messages and whatsapp calls but no letter to mailing address. However, with this submission, again I have submitted 1) The right to surrender sponsorship 2) Legal opinion letter from Pakistani lawyer (With case/law references) 3)An explanation letter as to why don't I have a legal custody document and explaning that I am not required by law because the mother is the natural custodian and I don't want the custody of my son therefore I never went to the court to get a formal letter from relevant authorities.

I am not sure if these documents would work or the IRCC is going to act strictly and refuse my application?

 

[armoured]

Thanks guys for your response. @armoured what is this stuff about applying for custody?

Basically, what I was saying is that once a divorce final in Pakistan, the mother is considered to be a natural custodian and has a preferential right to the custody till the the child is seven years of age. Therefore, she can keep the child and keep being the custodian. However, that does not mean that father does not have the right to apply. He can surely go to the court but the courts never uproots a minor child from a mother. Having that said, the IRCC officer could ask that why did I not go to the court to get the matter sorted or to apply for custody or visitation to meet my child? To answe this question I was being proactive and outlined my reasons not to apply i.e. 1) I don't want his custody because I know his welfare is with the mother 2) These case take 3-5 years with a negative outcome for father 3) I don't know my ex-wife or child's whereabouts.

My point is don't write additional verbiage about how your attempts to get custody would fail. This makes it sound like you want and possibly intend to get custody later.

Your case / references by the lawyer should be restricted to: the mother has custody, and due to pakistani law you cannot get proof of that custody (if I understand correctly, before age 7?); by default hte mother has custody, period. [Probably not necessary but lawyer can state after age 7 mother always has preferential right to keep custody.]

If you do not intend to sue for custody after that age, simply state that: the mother has custody, can't prove it because by default mother has it, do not intend to get custody after. But that's from you, not a legal question.

Again, would still be better if you can convince the mother to have the child do medicals etc.