New law: 183 days in a calendar year

[ttrajan]

We have to apply only after 6 years or we can apply immediately after 4 years?

 

[alphazip]

No, if he becomes PR on January 1st of 2016, he will have to apply after January 1st of 2020 (assuming he doesn't leave Canada).
In August (and even in July) 2019 he will have 4 calendar years with 183 days each (2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019), but won't have 1460 days yet.
He will reach 1460 days in January 2020.

Yes, you are correct. So, if he became a PR on 1 August 2015, he would have 4 years with 183 days in 2019, rather than 2020. Thanks! +1

 

[sjakub]

This is not as complicated as people think!

When you apply you have to look at 6 years back, and within those 6 years
you have to have BOTH 1460 days in Canada,
and at least 4 calendar (during those 6 years) while you were in Canada for 183 days or more.
you have to satisfy both requirements.
If you never leave Canada after landing you can apply exactly 4 years after you land.
Doesn't matter in which month you landed.

If you travel, then things get a little tricky.
It's possible to satisfy 1460 days in Canada, but not "at least 183 days in 4 calendar years",
or the other way around - have 4 (or even 6) calendar years with over 183 days in Canada,
but less than 1460 days in total.

 

[sjakub]

We have to apply only after 6 years or we can apply immediately after 4 years?

You can apply after 4 years.

This 6 year "window" is actually the limit of time during which you can accumulate days,
not the minimum amount of time after which you are allowed to apply.

For example, if you were a PR for the last 8 years, spending exactly 200 days in Canada
during each year, after those 8 years you would "accumulate" 1600 days in Canada (which is more than required 1460).
However, you won't be eligible to apply, because you can't "add" that 7th and 8th year.
Only the past 6 years count, so you would only have 1200 days.
You would satisfy the other requirement (4 calendar years with over 183 days),
but you need to satisfy both.

 

[sjakub]

Yes, you are correct. So, if he became a PR on 1 August 2015, he would have 4 years with 183 days in 2019, rather than 2020. Thanks! +1

To be precise, he would have 4 years with 183 days after July 2nd 2019 - but he still would have to wait till August 2019 to satisfy 1460 days requirement.

In January 2020 he would still have 4 years with 183 days, but in July 2nd 2020 he would have 5 years (not that it matters at that point).

 

[keesio]

And yet, the initial calendar year wouldn't count, because the person did not spend 183 days in Canada in that year. So, the days count, but the year doesn't?

Yes... at least that is my interpretation of the rule. There are two parts:
1) You must have 1460 days in Canada in the last 6 years
2) And in those 6 years you must have been in Canada for at least 183 days in 4 of those years

So that initial calendar year would count towards the 1460 days required in part 1 but would not count towards one of the 4 years needed for part 2.

Let's say a person becomes a PR on 1 August 2015 and never leaves Canada. He would satisfy four calendar years of residence (minimum 183 days per year) on or about 3 July 2019. So, whether he became a PR on 1 August 2015 or 1 January 2016, the qualifying date is the same. Please explain in detail why this incorrect. Simply stating that it's wrong is not explaining.

For the scenario above, part 2 (4 out of 6 years with at least 183 days) is fulfilled in years 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019. But part 1 is not fulfilled because the total days in Canada for the past 6 years is 1430. 30 days short. So that person would have to wait another month (August 3, 2019) to apply.

2015 - 152
2016 - 365
2017 - 365
2018 - 365
2019 - 183
-----------
TOTAL 1430

 

[OhCanadiana]

And yet, the initial calendar year wouldn't count, because the person did not spend 183 days in Canada in that year. So, the days count, but the year doesn't?

Keep in mind that 183 days of physical presence in Canada during each of the four calendar years that are fully or partially within the six years immediately before the date of application is only one of the requirements that applicants will need to meet to qualify to apply for Canadian citizenship (as of Thursday).

In addition to qualify, the new regulations require that the applicant was physically present in Canada for four years (1,460 days) out of the six years immediately before the date of application.

Therefore, while the days in 2015 are not sufficient for 2015 to count toward the four calendar years that you have to be in Canada a minimum of 183 days for (the first requirement I mentioned), the days in Canada during 2015 would count toward the second requirement (1,460 days in Canada in the prior 6 years). In fact, the days in 2015 would be very valuable in meeting the second requirement since three full years and 184 days in the fourth year is not yet 1,460 days (it is only 1,279 days*). Therefore the 153 days from Aug 1 - Dec 31 2015 would help bring the applicant that much closer to the 1,460 requirement.

Let's say a person becomes a PR on 1 August 2015 and never leaves Canada. He would satisfy four calendar years of residence (minimum 183 days per year) on or about 3 July 2019. So, whether he became a PR on 1 August 2015 or 1 January 2016, the qualifying date is the same. Please explain in detail why this incorrect. Simply stating that it's wrong is not explaining.

Given the second requirement, the applicant would not yet be eligible to apply on or about 3 July 2019 since they wouldn't have the 1430 days in Canada since landing as a PR. Even with no trips abroad, the person would only have accrued to a total of 1432 days of physical presence:

3 full years = 365*3 = 1,095 days
Aug 1 2015 to Dec 31 2015 = 153 days
Jan 1 - Jul 3 2019 = 184 days
SUM = 1432 days

This means they still have to wait for at least 28 days to be accrued before meeting the requirement to have been in Canada at least 1460 days in the 6 years preceding the application (obviously, any time abroad needs to be added back in). Note that this doesn't consider that, at least under the current application requirements, you need to wait to date the application until the day after you qualify.

* Assuming Feb 29 on leap years continues to not be counted.

ETA - what keesio said as I was typing away I think our Math is off by a couple days because as I interpret the rules, both the landing day counts and the qualification day counts. So, it's the difference in the dates and then you add back in the original date. But, this is a minor difference and the message is the same regarding days counting for citizenship qualification purposes even if the year won't count toward the four with minimum 183 days presence.

 

[alphazip]

Yes... at least that is my interpretation of the rule. There are two parts:
1) You must have 1460 days in Canada in the last 6 years
2) And in those 6 years you must have been in Canada for at least 183 days in 4 of those years

So that initial calendar year would count towards the 1460 days required in part 1 but would not count towards one of the 4 years needed for part 2.

For the scenario above, part 2 (4 out of 6 years with at least 183 days) is fulfilled in years 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019. But part 1 is not fulfilled because the total days in Canada for the past 6 years is 1430. 30 days short. So that person would have to wait another month (August 3, 2019) to apply.

2015 - 152
2016 - 365
2017 - 365
2018 - 365
2019 - 183
-----------
TOTAL 1430

Thanks for the explanation!

 

[alphazip]

Keep in mind that 183 days of physical presence in Canada during each of the four calendar years that are fully or partially within the six years immediately before the date of application is only one of the requirements that applicants will need to meet to qualify to apply for Canadian citizenship (as of Thursday).

In addition to qualify, the new regulations require that the applicant was physically present in Canada for four years (1,460 days) out of the six years immediately before the date of application.

Therefore, while the days in 2015 are not sufficient for 2015 to count toward the four calendar years that you have to be in Canada a minimum of 183 days for (the first requirement I mentioned), the days in Canada during 2015 would count toward the second requirement (1,460 days in Canada in the prior 6 years). In fact, the days in 2015 would be very valuable in meeting the second requirement since three full years and 184 days in the fourth year is not yet 1,460 days (it is only 1,279 days*). Therefore the 153 days from Aug 1 - Dec 31 2015 would help bring the applicant that much closer to the 1,460 requirement.

Given the second requirement, the applicant would not yet be eligible to apply on or about 3 July 2019 since they wouldn't have the 1430 days in Canada since landing as a PR. Even with no trips abroad, the person would only have accrued to a total of 1432 days of physical presence:

3 full years = 365*3 = 1,095 days
Aug 1 2015 to Dec 31 2015 = 153 days
Jan 1 - Jul 3 2019 = 184 days
SUM = 1432 days

This means they still have to wait for at least 28 days to be accrued before meeting the requirement to have been in Canada at least 1460 days in the 6 years preceding the application (obviously, any time abroad needs to be added back in). Note that this doesn't consider that, at least under the current application requirements, you need to wait to date the application until the day after you qualify.

* Assuming Feb 29 on leap years continues to not be counted.

ETA - what keesio said as I was typing away

Thanks to you, too!

 

[cprak0]

And yet, the initial calendar year wouldn't count, because the person did not spend 183 days in Canada in that year. So, the days count, but the year doesn't? Let's say a person becomes a PR on 1 August 2015 and never leaves Canada. He would satisfy four calendar years of residence (minimum 183 days per year) on or about 3 July 2019. So, whether he became a PR on 1 August 2015 or 1 January 2016, the qualifying date is the same. Please explain in detail why this is incorrect. Simply stating that it's wrong is not explaining.

Suppose "A " becomes a PR Jul3 2015, and never leaves Canada. he completes the requirement of 1460 days residence on Jul4 2020 19 (sorry couldn't count!! Thanks sjakub!) , which would also satisfy minimum 183 days / yr as well (min 183 days 2015)... if we assume he becomes a PR only on Sep 3 2015, becomes eligible to apply only on Sep 4 202019, and in that case, yes 2015 yr would be less than 183 but then, yr 2020 2019 would have the minimum 183, so he satisfies the 183 day/ yr for 4 yr requirement. So, if one has the 1460 days, you would also have the min 183 days per yr provided you don't leave the country often... which apparently is the point. Although, unfair to Canadian based businesses with clientele abroad...
Looks like they have made it easier for the CIC to process, no more headaches in the residence requirement calculation seems to be a lot easier than the current rules....

 

[sjakub]

Suppose "A " becomes a PR Jul3 2015, and never leaves Canada. he completes the requirement of 1460 days residence onJul4 2020, which would also satisfy minimum 183 days / yr as well (min 183 days 2015)... if we assume he becomes a PR only on Sep 3 2015, becomes eligible to apply only on Sep 4 2020, and in that case, yes 2015 yr would be less than 183 but then, yr 2020 would have the minimum 183, so he satisfies the 183 day/ yr for 4 yr requirement. So, if one has the 1460 days, you would also have the min 183 days per yr provided you don't leave the country often... which apparently is the point. Although, unfair to Canadian based businesses with clientele abroad...

If he lands in 2015 and never leaves, he doesn't have to wait till 2020 - he will be eligible in 2019.

 

[Maple_tree15]

If he lands in 2015 and never leaves, he doesn't have to wait till 2020 - he will be eligible in 2019.

He will be eligible in 2019, assuming that the Citizenship Act does not change again in the meantime.

 

[dpenabill]

Calculating Residency per New Requirements

There was some uncertainty expressed (I had no doubts and offered some detailed explanations, consistent with similar observations by others here, such as OhCanadiana) about how the new residency requirements would be calculated.

In particular, some doubted my calculation that the individual who arrived in the second half of the year would, nonetheless, qualify as of the fourth anniversary of landing assuming no absences (thus, usually, fourth anniversary of landing plus additional days to make up for all absences in the meantime).

In contrast, there were some who had a different view, particularly as to how the 183 X 4 CY (calendar years) would be calculated. For example:

It is clearly mentioned that in those 4 years, you have to be in Canada more than 183 days. So, if anybody land on July 15th, 2014 and do not leave Canada, he can apply on Jan 1st, 2019. We can stop discussion about this and wait for 5 days. Then we can check online residency calculator on June 11th. So, everything will be clear.

I do not know why you think you are 100% correct and the others are wrong! I am not wrong at all since besides my understanding from the bill, I attended a seminar held in Success and asked a CITIZENSHIP JUDGE about it and he confirmed my understanding. You can wait and see that you are wrong. Just wait for Jun 11th and check who is wrong! Good luck!

I assume that by now a number of participants here have plugged some dates into the new residency calculator and ascertained that what I and some others posted was indeed correct.

Perhaps, however, CIC has been reading the forums, since one of the examples CIC now has posted in its Program Delivery Instructions for "How residence/physical presence is calculated" (for applications made after June 10, 2015) is very close to the scenario discussed here:

Example 3
Which years can be considered in assessing the 183-day requirement?

Example D

Date of permanent residence: August 2, 2016

Date of application: August 3, 2020

Calendar years:

2014: No (Note 2 - The applicant is not yet a permanent resident.)
2015: No (Note 2 - The applicant is not yet a permanent resident.)
2016: No (Note 1 - There are not enough days between August 2 and December 31 to be able to amount to 183 days.
)
2017: Yes
2018: Yes
2019: Yes
2020: Yes

Significant Changes in Calculating Days:

February 29 in leap years now counts.

All days present in Canada now count

The latter means that now both dates of exit and dates of entry count (old law only gave credit for one of these days).

Relative to the change regarding leap years, this probably derives from the language of the requirement itself. Old law requirement was three years resident in Canada, and the definition of a year was 365 days, which does not account for any February 29. New law requirement is specifically based on the number of days: 1460 days in the relevant six years, 183 days in at least each of 4 calendar years fully or partially within the six year period.

When there is a February 29, it is indeed a day, so the new law essentially requires it to be counted.

Regarding the new law for which all days present in Canada now count, much like it does for the PR Residency Obligation, I do not understand why it was any different all along, and indeed in any where this might make the difference (such as someone with numerous trips, falling short of 1095 by just a few days, for whom counting both dates of exit and dates of return would give enough days to meet the 1095 day threshold) I had suggested that could be an argument made to the CJ and/or on appeal (problem with this, however, is that negative decisions very rarely depended on just a few days, but rather based more on issues of proof generally, so getting just a few days extra credit would rarely make a difference).

However, the reason may be the same as for counting February 29, and that is that the requirement is now specifically based on days present in Canada, so any day present in Canada should count. (Noting that the PR Residency Obligation is also based on days present in Canada . . . ?question? does this suggest that February 29 also counts in the PR Residency Obligation?)

In any event, going back to the example disputed by Zaker:

So, if anybody land on July 15th, 2014 and do not leave Canada, he can apply on Jan 1st, 2019.

No, this individual will be eligible as of July 15, 2018, having met the 4 X 183 requirement as of July 3, 2018 and the 1460 days total requirement as of July 14, 2018 (making him eligible to apply July 15, 2018 . . . and noting that for 2016 he gets 366 days credit, that being a leap year). (And assuming all other requirements have been met, such as compliance with CRA tax filing obligations et al.)

Again, there are numerous examples offered by CIC in the Program Delivery Instructions for "How residence/physical presence is calculated" (for applications made after June 10, 2015).

There should be minimal confusion now about how these two requirements apply and how the calculation is done.

 

[NN74]

Yes dpenabill, I've used the new online residency calculator and did our calculations. Your explanation of CY and 183x4 was absolutely right.

Thanks

Calculating Residency per New Requirements

There was some uncertainty expressed (I had no doubts and offered some detailed explanations, consistent with similar observations by others here, such as OhCanadiana) about how the new residency requirements would be calculated.

In particular, some doubted my calculation that the individual who arrived in the second half of the year would, nonetheless, qualify as of the fourth anniversary of landing assuming no absences (thus, usually, fourth anniversary of landing plus additional days to make up for all absences in the meantime).

In contrast, there were some who had a different view, particularly as to how the 183 X 4 CY (calendar years) would be calculated. For example:


I assume that by now a number of participants here have plugged some dates into the new residency calculator and ascertained that what I and some others posted was indeed correct.

Perhaps, however, CIC has been reading the forums, since one of the examples CIC now has posted in its Program Delivery Instructions for "How residence/physical presence is calculated" (for applications made after June 10, 2015) is very close to the scenario discussed here:



Significant Changes in Calculating Days:

February 29 in leap years now counts.

All days present in Canada now count

The latter means that now both dates of exit and dates of entry count (old law only gave credit for one of these days).

Relative to the change regarding leap years, this probably derives from the language of the requirement itself. Old law requirement was three years resident in Canada, and the definition of a year was 365 days, which does not account for any February 29. New law requirement is specifically based on the number of days: 1460 days in the relevant six years, 183 days in at least each of 4 calendar years fully or partially within the six year period.

When there is a February 29, it is indeed a day, so the new law essentially requires it to be counted.

Regarding the new law for which all days present in Canada now count, much like it does for the PR Residency Obligation, I do not understand why it was any different all along, and indeed in any where this might make the difference (such as someone with numerous trips, falling short of 1095 by just a few days, for whom counting both dates of exit and dates of return would give enough days to meet the 1095 day threshold) I had suggested that could be an argument made to the CJ and/or on appeal (problem with this, however, is that negative decisions very rarely depended on just a few days, but rather based more on issues of proof generally, so getting just a few days extra credit would rarely make a difference).

However, the reason may be the same as for counting February 29, and that is that the requirement is now specifically based on days present in Canada, so any day present in Canada should count. (Noting that the PR Residency Obligation is also based on days present in Canada . . . ?question? does this suggest that February 29 also counts in the PR Residency Obligation?)

In any event, going back to the example disputed by Zaker:
No, this individual will be eligible as of July 15, 2018, having met the 4 X 183 requirement as of July 3, 2018 and the 1460 days total requirement as of July 14, 2018 (making him eligible to apply July 15, 2018 . . . and noting that for 2016 he gets 366 days credit, that being a leap year). (And assuming all other requirements have been met, such as compliance with CRA tax filing obligations et al.)

Again, there are numerous examples offered by CIC in the Program Delivery Instructions for "How residence/physical presence is calculated" (for applications made after June 10, 2015).

There should be minimal confusion now about how these two requirements apply and how the calculation is done.

 

[prcard18]

Hello dear friend ( Leon )

If during filling application considering last 6 year period
since 2011- 2017
in 2011 - 30 days
2012 - 110 days
2013 - 130 days
2014 - 365 days
2015 -365 days
2016 - 300 days
2017 - 200 days
so in 4 / 6 years residence requirement - ok
Tax requirement - ok

My question is whether

ques 1. As in 2011, 2012, & 2013 the days stayed are less in Canada.

In this circumstances does CIC may issue RQ and may led the application to Non routine ?
Which may push the processes to around 3 years as mentioned in the site.

Quest 2. Is there any chance the if the new govt if other than ruling party may make some softening steps in intent to reside clause, to the existing rules in future.

Please clarify

Thank you so much