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Moving while awaiting PR and children lack of proof of citizenship

Jan 12, 2021
11
1
Hi,

My wife, Canadian, and I, German, want to move to Canada permanently with our 2 children (1 is yet to be born, but would be before we move) from the UK. We have not started a sponsorship application and are heavily researching everything. But we have identified what we think are the 2 biggest issues to figure out.

Our basic plan is to move soon after our second childs birth. My wife is Canadian and born in Canada, no criminal convictions, over 18 years old and all so very sure she should get approved as a sponsor. As we both would move to Canada without jobs lined up, I get that there could be financial concerns but looks to me like there is no need to proof financial resources. We actually have her family in the country that could provide evidence including free housing.

The first big issue is myself. We would go for my wife sponsoring me for permanent residence and have been married for over 6 years, lived together for nearly 10 years and are very confident we can show enough evidence to get approved. Due to personal circumstances, we would though want to move soon after the birth of our 2nd baby which would mean my PR application would still be under consideration. Having looked at this for about 72 hours now, I came across 'dual intent' and understand my ability to enter Canada temporarily would hinge on convincing the border agent at arrival that I actually would only stay for the 6 months my ETA gives me (plus possible a visitor record extension) and I would leave then assuming my PR doesnt get approved in that time frame. But I would stay in Canada if approved for PR. I get it is at the officer's discretion and I would probably have to go to secondary and have a long chat and probably show evidence of what my alternative plan is. Please let me know if I am wrong in my thinking here!? Reference to dual intent from here: https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/operational-bulletins-manuals/temporary-residents/visitors/dual-intent-applicants.html

The second issue could be our children. Given my wife is a Canadian born in Canada our kids would have Canadian citizenship. Our first child only has British citizenship as he was born here, my wife is a dual citizen and our second child would only have British citizenship too. My question is, would there be an issue at the border with them? Do they need to be sponsored? Sponsoring them doesnt make sense to me as they have a right to Canadian citizenship and citizens couldn't be permanent residents too, right? We understand that to get citizenship for them we need to request a certificate of citizenship and then a passport. Could we though just show up at the border and say we want to stay (I know my issues in the above paragraph) with them and then get their citizenships sorted once we are in Canada?

I suppose out of our 2 issues, that I pose the bigger one concern but then I think dual intent allows me to come as a visitor as well as wanting to stay permanently. I think most if our issues are from our timeline of wanting to move before an application for PR and certificates of citizenship have gone through. But are we missing anything? Can anyone give us any advice on these topics/has gone through either or both themselves?

Thank you very much!
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
18,182
9,508
1) Easy question first: you apply for Canadian citizenship for your children and passports at the same time. If that isn't complete when you apply for PR, you attach copies of the application for citizenship and do NOT apply for immigration for them. (They should be able to enter Canada on british passports, keep / bring copy of application for citizenship and inform at border the children are citizens too - if you don't get the passports for them in time).

2) Dual intent: should probably be okay as you say. If you show up with all your worldly possessions, they might ask more questions. Just tell truth, application in process, you would hope to complete while in canada, but you'll also leave. It's hard to say whether they will want to make more of the issue - but probably not in circumstances.

I'd apply for PR as soon as possible - after applying for citizenship for children - and hope it goes quickly. Unliekly there would be many questions about your relationship after so long together and children.

The biggest restriction is you\'ll not be able to work in canada until pr complete (and healthcare for you all).
 
Jan 12, 2021
11
1
1) Easy question first: you apply for Canadian citizenship for your children and passports at the same time. If that isn't complete when you apply for PR, you attach copies of the application for citizenship and do NOT apply for immigration for them. (They should be able to enter Canada on british passports, keep / bring copy of application for citizenship and inform at border the children are citizens too - if you don't get the passports for them in time).

2) Dual intent: should probably be okay as you say. If you show up with all your worldly possessions, they might ask more questions. Just tell truth, application in process, you would hope to complete while in canada, but you'll also leave. It's hard to say whether they will want to make more of the issue - but probably not in circumstances.

I'd apply for PR as soon as possible - after applying for citizenship for children - and hope it goes quickly. Unliekly there would be many questions about your relationship after so long together and children.

The biggest restriction is you\'ll not be able to work in canada until pr complete (and healthcare for you all).
Thank you very much for the very detailed response!

I guess I would have 2 follow up questions.

1. Can I apply for PR before my 2nd child is born or do I need to wait until after the birth?
2. How would we get the passports if we were to arrive in Canada and permanently settle? I.e. do they just send it to an address that we have to provide at the time of application and could we use my wife's parents address in Canada then so we can be sure to get them even though we wouldn't live there at time of application?
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
96,863
22,845
Toronto
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
28-05-2010
AOR Received.
19-08-2010
File Transfer...
28-06-2010
Passport Req..
01-10-2010
VISA ISSUED...
05-10-2010
LANDED..........
05-10-2010
Hi,

My wife, Canadian, and I, German, want to move to Canada permanently with our 2 children (1 is yet to be born, but would be before we move) from the UK. We have not started a sponsorship application and are heavily researching everything. But we have identified what we think are the 2 biggest issues to figure out.

Our basic plan is to move soon after our second childs birth. My wife is Canadian and born in Canada, no criminal convictions, over 18 years old and all so very sure she should get approved as a sponsor. As we both would move to Canada without jobs lined up, I get that there could be financial concerns but looks to me like there is no need to proof financial resources. We actually have her family in the country that could provide evidence including free housing.

The first big issue is myself. We would go for my wife sponsoring me for permanent residence and have been married for over 6 years, lived together for nearly 10 years and are very confident we can show enough evidence to get approved. Due to personal circumstances, we would though want to move soon after the birth of our 2nd baby which would mean my PR application would still be under consideration. Having looked at this for about 72 hours now, I came across 'dual intent' and understand my ability to enter Canada temporarily would hinge on convincing the border agent at arrival that I actually would only stay for the 6 months my ETA gives me (plus possible a visitor record extension) and I would leave then assuming my PR doesnt get approved in that time frame. But I would stay in Canada if approved for PR. I get it is at the officer's discretion and I would probably have to go to secondary and have a long chat and probably show evidence of what my alternative plan is. Please let me know if I am wrong in my thinking here!? Reference to dual intent from here: https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/operational-bulletins-manuals/temporary-residents/visitors/dual-intent-applicants.html

The second issue could be our children. Given my wife is a Canadian born in Canada our kids would have Canadian citizenship. Our first child only has British citizenship as he was born here, my wife is a dual citizen and our second child would only have British citizenship too. My question is, would there be an issue at the border with them? Do they need to be sponsored? Sponsoring them doesnt make sense to me as they have a right to Canadian citizenship and citizens couldn't be permanent residents too, right? We understand that to get citizenship for them we need to request a certificate of citizenship and then a passport. Could we though just show up at the border and say we want to stay (I know my issues in the above paragraph) with them and then get their citizenships sorted once we are in Canada?

I suppose out of our 2 issues, that I pose the bigger one concern but then I think dual intent allows me to come as a visitor as well as wanting to stay permanently. I think most if our issues are from our timeline of wanting to move before an application for PR and certificates of citizenship have gone through. But are we missing anything? Can anyone give us any advice on these topics/has gone through either or both themselves?

Thank you very much!
You'll run into issues with your children well before you arrive at the border. Without appropriate documentation, they won't be allowed to board the plane in the UK to fly to Canada. UK passport holders need an eTA to travel to Canada. They do not qualify for eTAs since they are Canadian citizens.

I would apply for confirmation of citizenship for your first child ASAP and then get a Canadian passport. For your second child, you can apply for a temporary / limited validity passport right after birth.
 
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Jan 12, 2021
11
1
You'll run into issues with your children well before you arrive at the border. Without appropriate documentation, they won't be allowed to board the plane in the UK to fly to Canada. UK passport holders need an eTA to travel to Canada. They do not qualify for eTAs since they are Canadian citizens.

I would apply for confirmation of citizenship for your first child ASAP and then get a Canadian passport. For your second child, you can apply for a temporary / limited validity passport right after birth.
Alright, thank you for responding to this as well. My older child actually has travelled on a British passport to Canada with an eTA, so i guess it can be done. But i absolutely hear you on getting moving on things and will do for child 1 and look into the temporary passport for the other one now
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
96,863
22,845
Toronto
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
28-05-2010
AOR Received.
19-08-2010
File Transfer...
28-06-2010
Passport Req..
01-10-2010
VISA ISSUED...
05-10-2010
LANDED..........
05-10-2010
Alright, thank you for responding to this as well. My older child actually has travelled on a British passport to Canada with an eTA, so i guess it can be done. But i absolutely hear you on getting moving on things and will do for child 1 and look into the temporary passport for the other one now
The only way that's possible is if you misrepresented answers on the eTA application. I personally wouldn't do that and would not use that eTA to travel again.
 
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armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
18,182
9,508
Thank you very much for the very detailed response!

I guess I would have 2 follow up questions.

1. Can I apply for PR before my 2nd child is born or do I need to wait until after the birth?
2. How would we get the passports if we were to arrive in Canada and permanently settle? I.e. do they just send it to an address that we have to provide at the time of application and could we use my wife's parents address in Canada then so we can be sure to get them even though we wouldn't live there at time of application?
You can apply any time, but should at least apply for citizenship for the first child before doing so (don't need to wait for the citizenship/passport, but will need a copy of the citizenship application).

As @scylla pointed out, you'll need to get Canadian travel documents for the children; I forgot about the ETA issue. You should have time for the elder, and hopefully they'll be quick for the newborn when the time comes. (They do issue some kind of provisional / temporary passport and I understand that can be quick).
 
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armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
18,182
9,508
You'll run into issues with your children well before you arrive at the border. Without appropriate documentation, they won't be allowed to board the plane in the UK to fly to Canada. UK passport holders need an eTA to travel to Canada. They do not qualify for eTAs since they are Canadian citizens.
Thank you, good catch - the blasted ETA stuff is still something I forget.
 
Jan 12, 2021
11
1
You can apply any time, but should at least apply for citizenship for the first child before doing so (don't need to wait for the citizenship/passport, but will need a copy of the citizenship application).

As @scylla pointed out, you'll need to get Canadian travel documents for the children; I forgot about the ETA issue. You should have time for the elder, and hopefully they'll be quick for the newborn when the time comes. (They do issue some kind of provisional / temporary passport and I understand that can be quick).
Alright, great. I'll get into my application asap and the older ones citizenship and then see when our see when baby no 2 makes an appearance and deal with it then

Appreciate both of your help!
 
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