Making a career but loosing a PR - Unfortunate Situation - please help.

[missmywife]

My humble plea for experienced forum members to please read my story in full below and give me the best possible advise you can think of. You can berate me for my foolishness as well - it would be well deserved

A little bit of background first:

Current Situation: Canadian PR who is in currently in US on a J-1 visa pursuing a medical residency to become a doctor.

Detailed background: I immigrated to Canada in 2016 on spousal PR - my partner is a Canadian Citizen. I was a doctor back in my home country. I wanted to get licensed and practice in Canada but realized after 2 years of really hard struggle that Canada is not friendly to foreign trained doctors and makes it next to impossible to practice here (unless you have your education from US or EU).

I took a tough decision to leave my family behind in Canada and go to US to do my medical residency and get certified so that I can come back and practice in Canada in the future. Between mid-2018 and mid-2019 I had to come to US on a visit visa to do some volunteering at various hospitals to gain experience in order to apply for my residency. I gave my USMLE exams and got a 3 year residency at a hospital in US. I started my medical residency mid-2019.

In order to do a medical residency in USA I needed to apply for a visa called J-1 (exchange visitor program) which needs to be renewed every academic year if I intend to travel outside of US during my residency. Also, one of the requirements of the J-1 is to get a statement of need from Health Canada.

From the time I started residency in mid-2019 until March 2020 I came to Canada for 4 weeks (2 week vacations each).

Unfortunately, after March 2020, Covid hit and then I was advised by my hospital to not travel back in case I am stuck in Canada due to border closures etc. I was also taking care of covid patients on the front line.

While this was all happening, my PR card expired in Aug of 2021! I did not even realize this. When it had expired I still would have had met the Residency Obligations.

Its December now, and unfortunately if I count from now on I will not have the Residency Obligation by about 4 months. Not sure if this helps but my spouse (Canadian Citizen) has stayed with me for over 6 months in the last 2 years.

I am able to cross the land border with my spouse in our car and hope that I am allowed in and when I enter Canada I can apply for a renewal of my PR card.

What complicates the issue is that I will need to come back to US in 3 weeks as I still have 6 to 8 months left to get my medicine residency complete and be board certified by US. I am also bound by J-1 rules to work in a remote area of US and serve patients there for 3 years as part of the J-1 visa.

Another complication is that, if I come to Canada - I will need to renew my US J-1 visa in order to travel back to US. One of the requirements of renewal is proof of valid status (PR) in Canada.

I know its a complicated issue and many members may not have seen a similar case. I humbly request your advise and guidance if you have any suggestions. Please also advise me on the best immigration lawyers who can truly help. I have heard of many horror stories of bad immigration consultants/lawyers making a situation even worse for people. DM me if you dont want to post on the forum.

My spouse suggests that we cross the border ASAP in the car and hope that I am let in and dont get flagged (reported) - then I apply for my PR card renewal ASAP. Apply for J-1 visa extension showing them proof that I have valid status in Canada (proof of renewal application process maybe). Travel back to finish my residency and hope that PR card gets renewed. I know this would be a fairy-tale outcome but I have no other options left for me now to pursue

 

[armoured]

my partner is a Canadian Citizen.
...
I am able to cross the land border with my spouse in our car and hope that I am allowed in and when I enter Canada I can apply for a renewal of my PR card.
...
One of the requirements of renewal is proof of valid status (PR) in Canada.

I don't think that this is quite as complicated as you think. I tried to highlight the most important bits:

-in absolute worst case, your spouse is a Canadian citizen and can sponsor you anew (should other aspects of the whole process become untenable).

-without a valid PR card, you can cross at the border with your expired PR card. Again, worst case scenario, you get reported and you appeal and during this period, you should be able to travel back and forth.

-With a spouse and spending some time in Canada, etc., and a really good argument that you have been pursuing the steps you need to practice medicine in Canada (limited residency spots in Canada, so you do what you have to), there is a pretty good chance that the CBSA officers will just wave you through.

-And if they report you and you appeal, chances also good - education, spouse in Canada, the reason you undertook that education, covid, intense requirements of a residency program, etc - that you'll win the appeal.

-And if you lose - so what? Your spouse sponsors you again. (Or conceivably get a Canadian employer to assist or qualify on your own, whatever is more conveneint and fastest).

-The hard part is whether you can get your card renewed. Worth a try, perhaps. Perhaps they'd even be nice about the time your spouse spent with you.

-BUT: I do not know about the US visa renewal and how you'd show your valid status in Canada. That might be easy, it might be hard, but given how important that is, you might be best-served to consult a (US) immigration lawyer. The irony is, you will have some status in Canada regardless (with only possibly a small gap), but it may be difficult to show. (I suspect US authorities are aware of the unique dysfunctions of the Canadian system, just a question of whether they're willing to ignore these bits or not)


As a bit of a random thought, it might really help your case if you can get some Canadian institution (university or hospital for example) to let you work or even volunteer from time to time (perhaps your US institution would give you 'credit' for such?). But my field is not medicine.

 

[jakklondon]

If your spouse is the Canadian citizen and stayed with you for 6 months, those 6 months count as if you lived in Canada. Just add it to number of days you stayed in Canada in the past 5 years and prior to leaving it.

Also, since your spouse is Canadian citizen, he or she can always sponsor you for PR. So, travel back to Canada whenever you want. If reported - go ahead and appeal removal decision. Immediately have your spouse sponsor you for PR (if it's doable while a PR). Chances are that by the time IAD reviews your case you will qualify for PR as a spouse of citizen, and issuing you removal order would be futile unless you were inadmissible for some reason and prevented from getting PR as a spouse of Canadian citizen.

This looks like a simple matter. Focus on your residence, get your credentials to become a doctor. You an always become Canadian PR, if you wish to.

 

[missmywife]

If your spouse is the Canadian citizen and stayed with you for 6 months, those 6 months count as if you lived in Canada. Just add it to number of days you stayed in Canada in the past 5 years and prior to leaving it.

Thank you so much jakklondon! this would make all my problems into non-issues. Yes, my spouse is a Canadian Citizen and was able to stay with me for around 6 months cumulatively in the last year (due to work from home opportunity).

Not that relevant but the house we own in Canada is registered on both our names and my name is on the Utility bill. Plus I still use my Canadian cell number as my primary number and pay for it.

Also, since your spouse is Canadian citizen, he or she can always sponsor you for PR. So, travel back to Canada whenever you want. If reported - go ahead and appeal removal decision. Immediately have your spouse sponsor you for PR (if it's doable while a PR). Chances are that by the time IAD reviews your case you will qualify for PR as a spouse of citizen, and issuing you removal order would be futile unless you were inadmissible for some reason and prevented from getting PR as a spouse of Canadian citizen.

This looks like a simple matter. Focus on your residence, get your credentials to become a doctor. You an always become Canadian PR, if you wish to.
Thank you - thank you - thank you from the bottom of my heart!

 

[missmywife]

I don't think that this is quite as complicated as you think. I tried to highlight the most important bits:

Having messed up by not renewing the PR card while it was still valid and while I had still met all the RO requirements, I was just starting top loose hope as my pursuit of a specialization within medicine (fellowship) still depended on being a Canadian PR.

-in absolute worst case, your spouse is a Canadian citizen and can sponsor you anew (should other aspects of the whole process become untenable).

-without a valid PR card, you can cross at the border with your expired PR card. Again, worst case scenario, you get reported and you appeal and during this period, you should be able to travel back and forth.

-With a spouse and spending some time in Canada, etc., and a really good argument that you have been pursuing the steps you need to practice medicine in Canada (limited residency spots in Canada, so you do what you have to), there is a pretty good chance that the CBSA officers will just wave you through.

I am hoping so as well!

-And if they report you and you appeal, chances also good - education, spouse in Canada, the reason you undertook that education, covid, intense requirements of a residency program, etc - that you'll win the appeal.

-And if you lose - so what? Your spouse sponsors you again. (Or conceivably get a Canadian employer to assist or qualify on your own, whatever is more conveneint and fastest).

-The hard part is whether you can get your card renewed. Worth a try, perhaps. Perhaps they'd even be nice about the time your spouse spent with you.

This is actually the most crucial part for me as having a valid card will help me keep my status in US as a J-1 visa holder and I can still get a "Statement of Need" from Health Canada when I apply for a specialization as the next step.

-BUT: I do not know about the US visa renewal and how you'd show your valid status in Canada. That might be easy, it might be hard, but given how important that is, you might be best-served to consult a (US) immigration lawyer. The irony is, you will have some status in Canada regardless (with only possibly a small gap), but it may be difficult to show. (I suspect US authorities are aware of the unique dysfunctions of the Canadian system, just a question of whether they're willing to ignore these bits or not)


As a bit of a random thought, it might really help your case if you can get some Canadian institution (university or hospital for example) to let you work or even volunteer from time to time (perhaps your US institution would give you 'credit' for such?). But my field is not medicine.

This is quite hard and I tried it a few times and failed - US institutions have limited rotation opportunities and those are with the programs that they have tie-ups with other wise it is not counted as a requirement of the residency.

 

[missmywife]

@jakklondon and @armoured - if at all possible could you please DM me some really reputable immigration lawyers that I can talk to. I do want to count the 6 months that my spouse stayed with me US as if I lived in Canada. This would put me well over the RO.

Also - I am assuming I should not apply for a PRTD as it may make my case more ripe for flagging at the land border.

 

[jakklondon]

@jakklondon and @armoured - if at all possible could you please DM me some really reputable immigration lawyers that I can talk to. I do want to count the 6 months that my spouse stayed with me US as if I lived in Canada. This would put me well over the RO.

missmywife, for security and privacy reasons I have disabled PM option, but I am glad to suggest you the law office of Campbell and Cohen. Ask for a consultation with one of their attorneys (preferably with Mr. Cohen, if he still offers personal consultations).

For all practical purposes, you may not need an attorney to confirm that your stay abroad with your Canadian citizen spouse counts towards your residency requirement. See the following link: https://www.cic.gc.ca/english/helpcentre/answer.asp?qnum=1466&top=10
It states in particular:
Can my time abroad count toward my permanent resident status?
It depends on what you do and who you travel with. Your time outside of Canada may count toward your permanent resident status if you meet 1 of these conditions:
You travel with a spouse or common-law partner
Your spouse or common-law partner needs to be:

• a Canadian citizen,

Should the border agent report you, just go ahead and appeal it.
See this link for more information on appeal:
http://www.cba.org/CBA/cle/PDF/IMM13_paper_roth.pdf

 

[jakklondon]

Thank you - thank you - thank you from the bottom of my heart!

You are welcome! Wish you the best of luck!

 

[steaky]

missmywife, for security and privacy reasons I have disabled PM option, but I am glad to suggest you the law office of Campbell and Cohen. Ask for a consultation with one of their attorneys (preferably with Mr. Cohen, if he still offers personal consultations).

For all practical purposes, you may not need an attorney to confirm that your stay abroad with your Canadian citizen spouse counts towards your residency requirement. See the following link: https://www.cic.gc.ca/english/helpcentre/answer.asp?qnum=1466&top=10
It states in particular:
Can my time abroad count toward my permanent resident status?
It depends on what you do and who you travel with. Your time outside of Canada may count toward your permanent resident status if you meet 1 of these conditions:
You travel with a spouse or common-law partner
Your spouse or common-law partner needs to be:

• a Canadian citizen,

Should the border agent report you, just go ahead and appeal it.
See this link for more information on appeal:
http://www.cba.org/CBA/cle/PDF/IMM13_paper_roth.pdf

Isn't it Campbell Cohen (instead of Campbell and Cohen)?

 

[armoured]

if at all possible could you please DM me some really reputable immigration lawyers that I can talk to. I do want to count the 6 months that my spouse stayed with me US as if I lived in Canada. This would put me well over the RO.

Also - I am assuming I should not apply for a PRTD as it may make my case more ripe for flagging at the land border.

I do not personally know lawyers I'd recommend. This site is sponsored by a legal firm that seems to have a decent rep.

If you have enough days to meet the RO with your spouse's time, you could try that. Similarly for PRTD - they might well just grant you if you apply, and then you could apply for a PR card with the H&C approval.

Again the harder part seems to be having the documentation you need for the USA visa. And that may require some procedural knowledge that is rather specific.

Good luck.

 

[jakklondon]

To Steaky:
It's super petty (has no bearing on substance) and would be useless to point out if it indeed turned out that I made an error in naming the firm (when it's too obvious which firm I was referring to), but since you brought it up I must state that the name of the firm (which one could name "RocketLawCohenCampbell") is one thing, what that name stands for is another. I suggested OP to speak with one particular attorney , David Cohen, who is probably one of the very best immigration attorneys in Canada, with over 40 years of experience. And the firm was founded by two partners, so it is indeed the firm of Mr. Campbell and Mr. Cohen, not of CampbellCohen. So, it's plausible to refer to it as a firm of Campbell & Cohen (even though they could have chosen to name it CohenCampbell, or SpaceRocketLawyers). Just in case you didn't know.

 

[missmywife]

It's super petty (has no bearing on substance) and would be useless to point out if it indeed turned out that I made an error in naming the firm (when it's too obvious which firm I was referring to), but since you brought it up I must state that the name of the firm (which one could name "RocketLawCohenCampbell") is one thing, what that name stands for is another. I suggested OP to speak with one particular attorney , David Cohen, who is probably one of the very best immigration attorneys in Canada, with over 40 years of experience. And the firm was founded by two partners, so it is indeed the firm of Mr. Campbell and Mr. Cohen, not of CampbellCohen. So, it's plausible to refer to it as a firm of Campbell & Cohen (even though they could have chosen to name it CohenCampbell, or SpaceRocketLawyers). Just in case you didn't know.

Thanks @jakklondon - it looks like Mr Cohen recently passed away due to cancer . I will try and reach out to some other lawyers on their team on Monday.

This is a stretch but I still want to ask anyways - if I am able to count my days (RO for PR card) while my spouse was with me in US can I also count them towards citizenship requirements? I only ask because by counting those days I am also over the three years required to be eligible to apply for a Canadian Citizenship!

 

[jakklondon]

Thanks @jakklondon - it looks like Mr Cohen recently passed away due to cancer . I will try and reach out to some other lawyers on their team on Monday.

This is a stretch but I still want to ask anyways - if I am able to count my days (RO for PR card) while my spouse was with me in US can I also count them towards citizenship requirements? I only ask because by counting those days I am also over the three years required to be eligible to apply for a Canadian Citizenship!

I am sorry for having to respond to poster above on your thread. And I am sorry to hear that David passed away. He was a great attorney.....

Regarding days counted for RO v Citizenship, I really can't tell. I don't know if days spent out with Canadian citizen spouse count as days spent in Canada for citizenship qualifying purposes. I can only assume that they do, but I could be wrong.

 

[armoured]

This is a stretch but I still want to ask anyways - if I am able to count my days (RO for PR card) while my spouse was with me in US can I also count them towards citizenship requirements? I only ask because by counting those days I am also over the three years required to be eligible to apply for a Canadian Citizenship!

Nope, different requirements. Similar but not identical.

 

[PMM]

Hi

I am sorry for having to respond to poster above on your thread. And I am sorry to hear that David passed away. He was a great attorney.....

Regarding days counted for RO v Citizenship, I really can't tell. I don't know if days spent out with Canadian citizen spouse count as days spent in Canada for citizenship qualifying purposes. I can only assume that they do, but I could be wrong.

1. Days outside of Canada, unless working for a Canadian Gov't/Military DO NOT count for citizenship.