Is meeting naturalization residency obligations a hardship for you? Why?

[Lyon37]

Hi All,

I am trying to better analyze in terms of policy if the physical residency requirements (3 out of 5) are problematic to achieve for certain immigrants and why.

- Personally, I have an international career and progressing professionally requires me to travel constantly. As a result, spending 3 out of 5 years in Canada (even though Canada is my home) is challenging and comes at the risk of my losing my career.

Do you face a similar problem? Has the pandemic increased your hardship? Should the Government of Canada be using a different metric to assess ties to Canada?

Thanks for sharing your experience.

(P.S. If you're here to rewrite/reshare the law of naturalization, please don't bother. Everyone is familiar. Thanks!)

 

[rajkamalmohanram]

Hi All,

I am trying to better analyze in terms of policy if the physical residency requirements (3 out of 5) are problematic to achieve for certain immigrants and why.

- Personally, I have an international career and progressing professionally requires me to be deployed in different countries. As a result, spending nearly 3 consecutive years in Canada (even though Canada has been / is my home and I want it to remain my home) is really challenging and comes at the risk of my losing my career. As of now, I've spent 21 months here...with some gaps...and every additional month feels daunting and risky in terms of my work.

Do you face a similar problem? Has the pandemic increased your hardship? Should the Government of Canada be using a different metric to assess ties to Canada?

Thanks for sharing your experience.

As I told you in your original post, it’s not 3 consecutive years but 1095 days of physical presence in the last 5 years. Does it seem less daunting to achieve now? Considering that, it’s pretty generous.

Well, this might be a problem for people who have to travel frequently for work but even when taking that into account, 3 years in a 5 year period is pretty lenient IMO.

In comparison, the US needs 5 years of continuous residence (no trips that are greater than 6 months or more allowed), Australia needs 4 years of residence in the country (can't be outside the country for more than 12 months), New Zealand needs 5 years of residence in the country (can't be outside the country for more than 4 months in a 12 month period). Now, some of these rules cause what could be called 'hardship'.

In Canada, you can be out of the country for 2 years in a 5 year period (the absence can either be continuous OR spread out) and still meet the residence requirements for citizenship. In comparison with the rules of other countries, what we have is very reasonable and lenient IMO. The requirement to become a Canadian citizen is being physically present in Canada for 3 years in a 5 year period from the date of your Citizenship application. There are no strict "no absence" requirements listed for Canadian citizenship applicants and the 3 year period doesn't have to be continuous. The requirement to maintain permanent residence (RO) is even more lenient than that - Physical presence of 2 years in in any 5 year period.

 

[scylla]

Hi All,

I am trying to better analyze in terms of policy if the physical residency requirements (3 out of 5) are problematic to achieve for certain immigrants and why.

- Personally, I have an international career and progressing professionally requires me to be deployed in different countries. As a result, spending nearly 3 consecutive years in Canada (even though Canada has been / is my home and I want it to remain my home) is really challenging and comes at the risk of my losing my career. As of now, I've spent 21 months here...with some gaps...and every additional month feels daunting and risky in terms of my work.

Do you face a similar problem? Has the pandemic increased your hardship? Should the Government of Canada be using a different metric to assess ties to Canada?

Thanks for sharing your experience.

The 3 years don't have to be consecutive. Gaps are fine.

 

[Lyon37]

Well, this might be a problem for people who have to travel frequently for work but even when taking that into account 3 years in a 5 year period is pretty lenient.

In comparison, the US needs 5 years of continuous residence (no trips that are greater than 6 months or more allowed), Australia that needs 4 years of residence in the country (can't be outside the country for more than 12 months), New Zealand needs 5 years of residence in the country and you can't be outside the country for more than 4 months in a 12 month period.

In Canada, you can be out of the country for 2 years in a 5 year period (the absence can either be continuous OR spread out) but in comparison with other countries, these rules are extremely lenient. The requirement to become a Canadian citizen is being physically present in Canada for 3 years in a 5 year period from the date of your Citizenship application. There are no strict "no absence" requirements listed for Canadian citizenship applicants.

Hey - thanks for all the comparisons. Canada has a declining naturalization problem. I am asking this question from people for whom this is a hardship, not to those for whom it is not. Perhaps, my question is not relevant for you. Thanks still for offering your perspective.

 

[wink]

"Canada has a declining naturalization problem."

I have not heard about it prior to this and surprised to hear this.

 

[bellaluna]

Hey - thanks for all the comparisons. Canada has a declining naturalization problem. I am asking this question from people for whom this is a hardship, not to those for whom it is not. Perhaps, my question is not relevant for you. Thanks still for offering your perspective.

You did post your question in an immigration forum where citizenship grant applicants do congregate, so the profile of posters is skewed towards that, and the majority of answers you will receive will probably follow the same vein. Yours is the first time I've ever heard anyone bring up this issue in all my years in this forum.

 

[Lyon37]

"Canada has a declining naturalization problem."

I have not heard about it prior to this and surprised to hear this.

You did post your question in an immigration forum where citizenship grant applicants do congregate, so the profile of posters is skewed towards that. Yours is the first time I've ever heard anyone bring up this issue in all my years in this forum.

Yes its true, this forum is full of people dying to get to Canada - so it's a skewed set of profiles. But I'm asking PRs, not applicants. Nonetheless, if you just read the PR obligations threads, you can see the number of people struggling to even meet PR obligation requirements - forget naturalization. Most of these people want to be naturalized, but struggle with physical presence requirements. There is a lot of excellent immigration journalism and IRCC's own analyses that may help you get an objective understanding.

 

[Das67]

"Canada has a declining naturalization problem."

I have not heard about it prior to this and surprised to hear this.

You may need to read this and it was published in Nov 2019 way before covid.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5359973

 

[foodie69]

Struggling to meet the residency requirements is self inflicted. You either come to Canada and commit yourself for the time it takes or you don't and pay the consequences. You can't have the cake and eat it, too.

 

[rajkamalmohanram]

Yes its true, this forum is full of people dying to get to Canada - so it's a skewed set of profiles. But I'm asking PRs, not applicants. Nonetheless, if you just read the PR obligations threads, you can see the number of people struggling to even meet PR obligation requirements - forget naturalization. Most of these people want to be naturalized, but struggle with physical presence requirements. There is a lot of excellent immigration journalism and IRCC's own analyses that may help you get an objective understanding.

People do have their reasons to stay outside the country for extended periods of time but the problem is that the laws governing Permanent Residence doesn't provide a 'humanitarian' solution to all of them. For example, if someone had a terminally ill family member that they needed to take care of and they weren't able to meet the RO and they can provide convincing evidence for their claims, CBSA will let them in under the Humanitarian and Compassionate grounds. If you lived outside Canada with a Canadian spouse, then that time will be counted towards satisfying your PR residency obligations (but you can't count that time towards the 'physical presence' requirement for Citizenship).

We'll have to draw a line somewhere; We'll have to be lenient enough that MOST Permanent Residents wouldn't have the hardship of meeting the RO and/or requirements for citizenship. Obviously, CBSA/IRCC can't satisfy everyone's needs. Even if the government were to reduce the residency obligation for PRs to 1 year and the physical presence required for Citizenship to 2 years, you will see people STILL complaining. Can't satisfy everyone.

What I'm getting at is that the rules are what they are and as long as the majority of the people seem to be able to adhere to it, the government would be okay with it, IMO.

 

[rajkamalmohanram]

Struggling to meet the residency requirements is self inflicted. You either come to Canada and commit yourself for the time it takes or you don't and pay the consequences. You can't have the cake and eat it, too.

More often than not, yes. But there are some genuine cases where the applicant was absolutely unable to get back on time (illness of a close family member, for instance) or for other compelling reasons. There are provisions for people with compelling reasons and they will be permitted to continue their residence without getting reported if they can prove the 'exceptional circumstance' that prevented them from meeting the RO.

 

[issteven]

declining naturalization rate: some countries don't allow dual citizenship, so they have to give up citizenship of their home country, some big factors here are Chinese, Koreans, Japanese, all these countries don't allow dual citizenship

 

[wink]

Should the Government of Canada be using a different metric to assess ties to Canada?

Curious to know what other metric one can use to show that one is committed to become a citizen...

 

[Copingwithlife]

Hey - thanks for all the comparisons. Canada has a declining naturalization problem. I am asking this question from people for whom this is a hardship, not to those for whom it is not. Perhaps, my question is not relevant for you. Thanks still for offering your perspective.

Can’t tell if you’re actually being serious , attempting to be serious, or a bad attempt at being facetious .

 

[Copingwithlife]

Curious to know what other metric one can use to show that one is committed to become a citizen...

The o/p is probably shooting for just having an address in the country