Is asylum possible for Ukrainian citizens?

[johnthewanderer]

I'm Ukrainian citizen, let my name be John Doe. I've been living abroad for roughly 10 years. I had my own reason to leave just as millions of other Ukrainians years before this major war. This corrupt government (and all the previous ones) had been plundering the country for decades and in fact pushed people to leave and they didn't seem to give a damn about us. On the news media they were often refering to us as to (single word in Ukrainian but untranslatable) "money earners". But now everything has changed. Incurring tremendous losses due to no weapons, lack of training and adequate commanders they several times remembered that they have men abroad. First time it was a bill which if passed would require each men of conscription age to return within 10 days if I remember rightly, the bill was registered soon after war had broken out, they didn't pass it. Recently they passed the decree regulating military registration abroad in embassies. For failing to register there's fine you have to pay SO FAR. Knowing this mentality very well I can tell where it's going. When they see that people don't give a damn about fines they will make it a criminal offence thus criminalizing millions of men residing abroad. People have loans, mortgages for heaven's sake. It's not if, it's when.
No one in the west has no idea what kind of mayhem they put on in Ukraine as western media make hero out of zelensky, printing him on times cover while the truth is he's just another corrupt official just like putin but unlike putin he's hiding behind the mask of a democratic leader. They shut down opposition media, fire the ones who criticize or "threatens" them. The head of the zelensky's office yermak is a piece of work too, he literally writes laws for themselves.
That only is, ministry of defence's recent eggs purchase contract for the armed forces with three times higher price than retail. And guess what, government purchases registry isn't public anymore.
Mayhem, dirt and disgust is everything I feel looking at it when so many people are dying both civilians and soldiers. I also believe they understate the losses 5-10x to avoid panic as they catch people on the streets, beat them up and take to military units. There are literally raids.
Is it possible to get asylum in Canada with the ground that I oppose conscription because I don't want to give my life for this mayhem and money heist, for the country I haven't been living in for almost a decade and where I won't return ever?
I'm asking it because as far as I know there is a list of safe countries which are usually fast tracked and seeing how everybody on the west admire zelensky I have very big doubts about that it's possible

 

[scylla]

I'm Ukrainian citizen, let my name be John Doe. I've been living abroad for roughly 10 years. I had my own reason to leave just as millions of other Ukrainians years before this major war. This corrupt government (and all the previous ones) had been plundering the country for decades and in fact pushed people to leave and they didn't seem to give a damn about us. On the news media they were often refering to us as to (single word in Ukrainian but untranslatable) "money earners". But now everything has changed. Incurring tremendous losses due to no weapons, lack of training and adequate commanders they several times remembered that they have men abroad. First time it was a bill which if passed would require each men of conscription age to return within 10 days if I remember rightly, the bill was registered soon after war had broken out, they didn't pass it. Recently they passed the decree regulating military registration abroad in embassies. For failing to register there's fine you have to pay SO FAR. Knowing this mentality very well I can tell where it's going. When they see that people don't give a damn about fines they will make it a criminal offence thus criminalizing millions of men residing abroad. People have loans, mortgages for heaven's sake. It's not if, it's when.
No one in the west has no idea what kind of mayhem they put on in Ukraine as western media make hero out of zelensky, printing him on times cover while the truth is he's just another corrupt official just like putin but unlike putin he's hiding behind the mask of a democratic leader. They shut down opposition media, fire the ones who criticize or "threatens" them. The head of the zelensky's office yermak is a piece of work too, he literally writes laws for themselves.
That only is, ministry of defence's recent eggs purchase contract for the armed forces with three times higher price than retail. And guess what, government purchases registry isn't public anymore.
Mayhem, dirt and disgust is everything I feel looking at it when so many people are dying both civilians and soldiers. I also believe they understate the losses 5-10x to avoid panic as they catch people on the streets, beat them up and take to military units. There are literally raids.
Is it possible to get asylum in Canada with the ground that I oppose conscription because I don't want to give my life for this mayhem and money heist, for the country I haven't been living in for almost a decade and where I won't return ever?
I'm asking it because as far as I know there is a list of safe countries which are usually fast tracked and seeing how everybody on the west admire zelensky I have very big doubts about that it's possible

Based on the above, the chances would likely be very low. You've been living outside of the country for a decade so the current conscription don't impact you. The possible future laws you describe don't exit right now. You can't base a claim on something that hasn't happened yet. You need to show that you yourself have been persecuted - not sure how you do this given you haven't lived there for 10 years. Additionally, depending on where you are living now, the question may arise as to why you didn't claim asylum there if there was a real threat to you. IMO chances of a claim being successful in Canada are going to be low.

If you want to immigrate to Canada, the better option is to take advantage of the CUAET 3 year open work permit that is being offered to Ukrainians and come here and work - then try to translate that to PR through applying for PR through an economic immigration program like Express Entry.

 

[johnthewanderer]

Based on the above, the chances would likely be very low. You've been living outside of the country for a decade so the current conscription don't impact you. The possible future laws you describe don't exit right now. You can't base a claim on something that hasn't happened yet. You need to show that you yourself have been persecuted - not sure how you do this given you haven't lived there for 10 years. Additionally, depending on where you are living now, the question may arise as to why you didn't claim asylum there if there was a real threat to you. IMO chances of a claim being successful in Canada are going to be low.

If you want to immigrate to Canada, the better option is to take advantage of the CUAET 3 year open work permit that is being offered to Ukrainians and come here and work - then try to translate that to PR through applying for PR through an economic immigration program like Express Entry.

Thank you for replying!
I do understand that I'm only supposed to claim asylum if I already reside in Canada and yes you're right that law I described doesn't exist as for now.
I also have cuaet visa stamped but I'm uncertain if I'd be eligible to apply for PR as I don't have an occupation in demand I've been working my whole working "career" as a labourer on a factory.
I'll try to turn my question differently.
If I come to Canada under cuaet, fail to meet the eligibility criteria and they pass this law in Ukraine which I described which criminalizes us and either my passport is expired or my visa is expiring (or both).
What would chances of successful asylum claim be like in this case?

 

[scylla]

Thank you for replying!
I do understand that I'm only supposed to claim asylum if I already reside in Canada and yes you're right that law I described doesn't exist as for now.
I also have cuaet visa stamped but I'm uncertain if I'd be eligible to apply for PR as I don't have an occupation in demand I've been working my whole working "career" as a labourer on a factory.
I'll try to turn my question differently.
If I come to Canada under cuaet, fail to meet the eligibility criteria and they pass this law in Ukraine which I described which criminalizes us and either my passport is expired or my visa is expiring (or both).
What would chances of successful asylum claim be like in this case?

Correct. You would need to be inside Canada to submit the claim. You cannot do this from outside of Canada.

I don't think anyone here can guess what your chances will be. Generally speaking you want to show evidence that you yourself have been targeted to have a strong claim, meaning that criminal changes have been filed against you specifically. Ultimately really hard to say. It will be a gamble.

 

[Masjuy]

Thank you for replying!
I do understand that I'm only supposed to claim asylum if I already reside in Canada and yes you're right that law I described doesn't exist as for now.
I also have cuaet visa stamped but I'm uncertain if I'd be eligible to apply for PR as I don't have an occupation in demand I've been working my whole working "career" as a labourer on a factory.
I'll try to turn my question differently.
If I come to Canada under cuaet, fail to meet the eligibility criteria and they pass this law in Ukraine which I described which criminalizes us and either my passport is expired or my visa is expiring (or both).
What would chances of successful asylum claim be like in this case?

yes, as it was mentioned above you should be inside Canada and Canada supports Ukraine, they understand that Ukraine needs guys to fight.

I am Eastern Ukrainian, female, well, I am not sure what chances would be now but at that time in 2019 my chance could be 5% of success(according to my lawyer) I had completely different story( not political), I am permanent resident now. Once you are here you should find a lawyer who had case with similar situation

 

[canuck78]

Thank you for replying!
I do understand that I'm only supposed to claim asylum if I already reside in Canada and yes you're right that law I described doesn't exist as for now.
I also have cuaet visa stamped but I'm uncertain if I'd be eligible to apply for PR as I don't have an occupation in demand I've been working my whole working "career" as a labourer on a factory.
I'll try to turn my question differently.
If I come to Canada under cuaet, fail to meet the eligibility criteria and they pass this law in Ukraine which I described which criminalizes us and either my passport is expired or my visa is expiring (or both).
What would chances of successful asylum claim be like in this case?

yes, as it was mentioned above you should be inside Canada and Canada supports Ukraine, they understand that Ukraine needs guys to fight.

I am Eastern Ukrainian, female, well, I am not sure what chances would be now but at that time in 2019 my chance could be 5% of success(according to my lawyer) I had completely different story( not political), I am permanent resident now. Once you are here you should find a lawyer who had case with similar situation

Would actually suggest coming to Canada and working. There are many semi-skilled jobs that will qualify you for PR. Would look at the immigration programs and work towards qualifying for PR. Not sure what your background is but something like truck driving is in high demand with a short training. Being a retail assistant manager or manager is another option that doesn’t require a lot of training. The fact that you haven’t been living in Ukraine for a long time makes your case for asylum very different than most Ukrainians and the Canadian government created a special work permit for Ukrainians so they would work and not claim asylum. You have much more control of your future if you try to qualify for PR via economic means and express entry are far less consequences than applying for asylum whether you are approved or denied.

 

[johnthewanderer]

Would actually suggest coming to Canada and working. There are many semi-skilled jobs that will qualify you for PR. Would look at the immigration programs and work towards qualifying for PR. Not sure what your background is but something like truck driving is in high demand with a short training. Being a retail assistant manager or manager is another option that doesn’t require a lot of training. The fact that you haven’t been living in Ukraine for a long time makes your case for asylum very different than most Ukrainians and the Canadian government created a special work permit for Ukrainians so they would work and not claim asylum. You have much more control of your future if you try to qualify for PR via economic means and express entry are far less consequences than applying for asylum whether you are approved or denied.

I see that the Canadian government made it this way so that Ukrainians don't claim asylum. I don't want to understate the significance of the opportunities given to us but generally it feels like it's done to fill the current employees shortages right here right now and around 90% of the Ukrainians coming to Canada will eventually leave.

 

[moscatojuices]

I'm Ukrainian citizen, let my name be John Doe. I've been living abroad for roughly 10 years. I had my own reason to leave just as millions of other Ukrainians years before this major war. This corrupt government (and all the previous ones) had been plundering the country for decades and in fact pushed people to leave and they didn't seem to give a damn about us. On the news media they were often refering to us as to (single word in Ukrainian but untranslatable) "money earners". But now everything has changed. Incurring tremendous losses due to no weapons, lack of training and adequate commanders they several times remembered that they have men abroad. First time it was a bill which if passed would require each men of conscription age to return within 10 days if I remember rightly, the bill was registered soon after war had broken out, they didn't pass it. Recently they passed the decree regulating military registration abroad in embassies. For failing to register there's fine you have to pay SO FAR. Knowing this mentality very well I can tell where it's going. When they see that people don't give a damn about fines they will make it a criminal offence thus criminalizing millions of men residing abroad. People have loans, mortgages for heaven's sake. It's not if, it's when.
No one in the west has no idea what kind of mayhem they put on in Ukraine as western media make hero out of zelensky, printing him on times cover while the truth is he's just another corrupt official just like putin but unlike putin he's hiding behind the mask of a democratic leader. They shut down opposition media, fire the ones who criticize or "threatens" them. The head of the zelensky's office yermak is a piece of work too, he literally writes laws for themselves.
That only is, ministry of defence's recent eggs purchase contract for the armed forces with three times higher price than retail. And guess what, government purchases registry isn't public anymore.
Mayhem, dirt and disgust is everything I feel looking at it when so many people are dying both civilians and soldiers. I also believe they understate the losses 5-10x to avoid panic as they catch people on the streets, beat them up and take to military units. There are literally raids.
Is it possible to get asylum in Canada with the ground that I oppose conscription because I don't want to give my life for this mayhem and money heist, for the country I haven't been living in for almost a decade and where I won't return ever?
I'm asking it because as far as I know there is a list of safe countries which are usually fast tracked and seeing how everybody on the west admire zelensky I have very big doubts about that it's possible

There is no way in the world that one of the strongest supporters of Ukraine is going to contradict itself by declaring you a protected person against Ukraine.

So I see your points and everything but your solution to claim asylum is quite frankly utterly lazy. You as a Ukrainian have a gift in getting a 3-year visa, something most immigrants have to pay through the nose for as they have to first get an expensive education in order to get a PGWP.

Instead of (legitimately) griping about it, why don't you make a plan to come here, retrain or reskill in order to get a job where you'd be eligible for PR under the Provincial Nominee Program? This is going to be a much quicker and easier route than asylum.

 

[Simba112]

I see that the Canadian government made it this way so that Ukrainians don't claim asylum. I don't want to understate the significance of the opportunities given to us but generally it feels like it's done to fill the current employees shortages right here right now and around 90% of the Ukrainians coming to Canada will eventually leave.

Since Ukrainian are eligible for 3 years work permit, that 3 yrs of Canadian Experience will give enough points to either apply through Provincial Nominee or EE.

 

[Masjuy]

I see that the Canadian government made it this way so that Ukrainians don't claim asylum. I don't want to understate the significance of the opportunities given to us but generally it feels like it's done to fill the current employees shortages right here right now and around 90% of the Ukrainians coming to Canada will eventually leave.

It’s unique opportunity for Ukrainians, I have never seen other country that has the same support. I do not know about amount of ppl who will leave Canada after 3 years. For some would be hard to apply for pr if they are old, not enough language skills or not stable job. But still you have great chance to do all. You are lucky that you are in Europe, Ukrainian guys cannot leave country…

 

[johnthewanderer]

It’s unique opportunity for Ukrainians, I have never seen other country that has the same support. I do not know about amount of ppl who will leave Canada after 3 years. For some would be hard to apply for pr if they are old, not enough language skills or not stable job. But still you have great chance to do all. You are lucky that you are in Europe, Ukrainian guys cannot leave country…

Thank you, I get your point. Job experience is my biggest concern considering that I have only worked as a labourer on a plant. I'm doing some research about Manitoba Provincial Nomination Program. It seems there is no eligible occupations list or eligible noc types

 

[Masjuy]

Thank you, I get your point. Job experience is my biggest concern considering that I have only worked as a labourer on a plant. I'm doing some research about Manitoba Provincial Nomination Program. It seems there is no eligible occupations list or eligible noc types

Your English is good, so you have advantage, trades are great too. Canada needs electricians, welders, mechanics and etc. just do programs research and Good luck!

 

[scylla]

Thank you, I get your point. Job experience is my biggest concern considering that I have only worked as a labourer on a plant. I'm doing some research about Manitoba Provincial Nomination Program. It seems there is no eligible occupations list or eligible noc types

Do you know how many points you would have under MPNP?

Manitoba has been conducting special draws for Ukrainians. You need to meet specific requirements including scoring at least 60.

https://immigratemanitoba.com/2023/01/ukraine-draw-10/

 

[xichanmontreal]

A friend personally knows a Ukrainian national who lived for more than 6 years in an African country, and he had a business that made him earn a lot of money. His wife is a local citizen of the country where he lives (and of course had a permanent residence of the country in question, by marriage)

As soon as the special program was created, he hurried to fill in the form, and was able to land here... With his wife (The program grants an open work permit also to co-spouses of foreign Ukrainians!).

This person's life was not really in immediate danger... He just took advantage of the situation.

In other words: It's the best time to be Ukrainian right now! (other countries also offer similar programs to Ukrainian nationals, with eligibility only with this nationality, without taking into account the actual situation of the applicant).

The fact that it is not an asylum per se, by definition, excludes the definition of refugee and therefore of immediate danger... There have been similar programs for residents of China's Hong Kong Special Administrative Zone in the UK, in Canada too, if I'm not mistaken?

Personally I find that the special program for Ukrainians is unfair, in the sense that it grants a privilege to Ukrainians only because they are Ukrainians... Without any consideration of their real situations or the urgency of their case.

 

[Masjuy]

A friend personally knows a Ukrainian national who lived for more than 6 years in an African country, and he had a business that made him earn a lot of money. His wife is a local citizen of the country where he lives (and of course had a permanent residence of the country in question, by marriage)

As soon as the special program was created, he hurried to fill in the form, and was able to land here... With his wife (The program grants an open work permit also to co-spouses of foreign Ukrainians!).

This person's life was not really in immediate danger... He just took advantage of the situation.

In other words: It's the best time to be Ukrainian right now! (other countries also offer similar programs to Ukrainian nationals, with eligibility only with this nationality, without taking into account the actual situation of the applicant).

The fact that it is not an asylum per se, by definition, excludes the definition of refugee and therefore of immediate danger... There have been similar programs for residents of China's Hong Kong Special Administrative Zone in the UK, in Canada too, if I'm not mistaken?

Personally I find that the special program for Ukrainians is unfair, in the sense that it grants a privilege to Ukrainians only because they are Ukrainians... Without any consideration of their real situations or the urgency of their case.

You are right, basically ppl who are in danger in East they do not have money, opportunity to come to Canada, and yes ppl are taking advantages from West or from other countries where is relevant safe. What we can do, it is not us, it’s government call.