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I am a Canadian citizen working overseas, PR husband is accompanying me .

Remah

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Oct 6, 2015
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0
Hello,

I am a Canadian citizen who is currently working overseas for the past three years, my husband who is a Canadian permanent resident is accompanying me. My husbands PR card expires in November 2015, we are not able to travel back to canada until January 2016 which is when I start my maternity leave. I have been reading online about residency obligations and I am starting to get confused. Since I am a Canadian citizen working abroad, will the days my husband has spent with me count as days in canada? Because different sites online say they count if I work for a Canadian company which I do not. Since we can't travel before the expiry date, my plan was to allow the card to expire and then apply for a travel document. But of course my fear is doing that, and then have the embassy say that he is not approved for travel document because he has not met the required days spent in canada. All together my husband has spent around 10 months actually present in canada, and the rest of the time he was accompanying me. I hope that you will be able to help me, thinking about what to do everyday is very stressful. Thank you
 

keesio

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Remah said:
Hello,

I am a Canadian citizen who is currently working overseas for the past three years, my husband who is a Canadian permanent resident is accompanying me. My husbands PR card expires in November 2015, we are not able to travel back to canada until January 2016 which is when I start my maternity leave. I have been reading online about residency obligations and I am starting to get confused. Since I am a Canadian citizen working abroad, will the days my husband has spent with me count as days in canada? Because different sites online say they count if I work for a Canadian company which I do not. Since we can't travel before the expiry date, my plan was to allow the card to expire and then apply for a travel document. But of course my fear is doing that, and then have the embassy say that he is not approved for travel document because he has not met the required days spent in canada. All together my husband has spent around 10 months actually present in canada, and the rest of the time he was accompanying me. I hope that you will be able to help me, thinking about what to do everyday is very stressful. Thank you
The days your husband spends with you abroad will count as days in Canada for his PR requirements. The information you see about working for a Canadian company, etc is if a PR is working abroad and NOT with a Canadian spouse. If a PR with a Canadian spouse abroad, all that matters is that you are living together and that is it. So your husband is fine and can apply for a PRTD. Just make sure you keep proofs that you are living together while abroad since he may be asked for it
 

Remah

Newbie
Oct 6, 2015
3
0
Hello,

Thank you so much for the quick reply. I feel so relieved to finally have some clarity.
So you dont think that he will have any problem getting approval for a travel document, since he has been with me?
I was also wondering, when we get back to canada we will be applying to renew his PR status. Once he gets renewed is it still ok for him to continue accompanying me? I guess what iam trying to understand is how many times can someone renew their PR card?
Hope to hear from you soon.
Thanks
 

keesio

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Remah said:
Hello,

Thank you so much for the quick reply. I feel so relieved to finally have some clarity.
So you dont think that he will have any problem getting approval for a travel document, since he has been with me?
I was also wondering, when we get back to canada we will be applying to renew his PR status. Once he gets renewed is it still ok for him to continue accompanying me? I guess what iam trying to understand is how many times can someone renew their PR card?
Hope to hear from you soon.
Thanks
He will only have problem getting a travel document if he does not have any proof at all that he has been living with you (share the same address). That is why you need to collect some proofs. Things that show the same mailing address, lease agreement with both your names, etc. Just some little proof is enough since you are married

he can renew his PR card as many times as needed. Note that CIC will not mail the PR outside Canada so you need to provide a Canadian mailing address.
 

Remah

Newbie
Oct 6, 2015
3
0
Thank you again for the quick reply.
I have proof that we are living together so that shouldn't be a problem.
In regards to a Canadian mailing address, fortunately I have one.

Thanks again for your help.
 

dpenabill

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Apr 2, 2010
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Reminders:

Be sure to follow the instructions completely when the application for the PR Travel Document is made.

Proof needed to show compliance with PR Residency Obligation based on accompanying a partner who is a Canadian citizen:
-- proof of qualified relationship (copy of certificate of marriage is best)
-- proof of partner's Canadian citizenship (copy of Canadian passport)
-- proof of cohabitation 730+ days within the preceding five years (or number sufficient in combination with actual presence to add up to 730; and more is better)
 

Gumby749

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This thread is timely, as I too have similar questions on the whole 'accompany' issue. I have just read this article about the case law that has impacted the interpretation of the 'accompany a Canadian citizen' provisions of 28 (2) (a) (ii) at http://www.canadavisalaw.com/blog/maintaining-residency-by-accompanying-a-canadian-spouse-outside-canada/

My case is a bit different, unlike Ms. Diouf in the link who met her Canadian spouse after she left Canada, my wife and I had been married for nearly five years before we sought her PR status from outside Canada. It was granted and we intended to return to Canada. Yes, our intention was legitimate, we quit our jobs overseas, bought a house in Canada, etc. Before we could take up residency in Canada I was headhunted for a 'can't say no to' sort of job and we have not yet returned to Canada. So, here are my questions:

1. If we return to Canada before December of 2017 we can easily make 730 days on Canadian soil before our time runs out. However, if we stay overseas past December 2017, in this once-in-a-lifetime job, is my wife considered to be 'accompanying' me? She is under my visa as a spouse in the country we live in and we can easily prove that we live together.

2. Second wrinkle...I've had very fruitful conversations with a Canadian provincial government agency office in the country we're in and expect (as far as one can expect anything depending on budgets in an election year, etc) it to lead to a job offer. If I take up this job offer, but don't return to Canada before December 2017, is my wife considered to be 'accompanying' me?

Any opinions would be appreciated.
 

cempjwi

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Gumby749 said:
This thread is timely, as I too have similar questions on the whole 'accompany' issue. I have just read this article about the case law that has impacted the interpretation of the 'accompany a Canadian citizen' provisions of 28 (2) (a) (ii) at http://www.canadavisalaw.com/blog/maintaining-residency-by-accompanying-a-canadian-spouse-outside-canada/

My case is a bit different, unlike Ms. Diouf in the link who met her Canadian spouse after she left Canada, my wife and I had been married for nearly five years before we sought her PR status from outside Canada. It was granted and we intended to return to Canada. Yes, our intention was legitimate, we quit our jobs overseas, bought a house in Canada, etc. Before we could take up residency in Canada I was headhunted for a 'can't say no to' sort of job and we have not yet returned to Canada. So, here are my questions:

1. If we return to Canada before December of 2017 we can easily make 730 days on Canadian soil before our time runs out. However, if we stay overseas past December 2017, in this once-in-a-lifetime job, is my wife considered to be 'accompanying' me? She is under my visa as a spouse in the country we live in and we can easily prove that we live together.

2. Second wrinkle...I've had very fruitful conversations with a Canadian provincial government agency office in the country we're in and expect (as far as one can expect anything depending on budgets in an election year, etc) it to lead to a job offer. If I take up this job offer, but don't return to Canada before December 2017, is my wife considered to be 'accompanying' me?

Any opinions would be appreciated.
Has she landed? Why is December 2017 so important? For the purposes of the RO, the time spent with a Canadian spouse abroad counts for the RO, regardless of how that union came about, before or after the PR left Canada. So if she landed already, her RO is being met by the time she lives with you abroad. Past 2020 if you will. However, her PR card (if she got one) cannot be renewed (or be obtained for the first time) while she lives outside Canada. To come back to Canada she will need a TD issued by a Canadian consulate.

If she has not landed yet, no RO to be met yet. She needs to land so the RO is even a consideration.
 

Gumby749

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Jan 18, 2014
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cempjwi said:
Has she landed? Why is December 2017 so important? For the purposes of the RO, the time spent with a Canadian spouse abroad counts for the RO, regardless of how that union came about, before or after the PR left Canada. So if she landed already, her RO is being met by the time she lives with you abroad. Past 2020 if you will. However, her PR card (if she got one) cannot be renewed (or be obtained for the first time) while she lives outside Canada. To come back to Canada she will need a TD issued by a Canadian consulate.

If she has not landed yet, no RO to be met yet. She needs to land so the RO is even a consideration.
My understanding is that it is much more complicated than "time with a Canadian spouse abroad counts..." as the case I cited shows. There, Ms. Diouf was denied because of the interpretation of 'accompanied'. She was a PR who met her Canadian citizen husband AFTER she left Canada. The courts said that that was no 'accompanying'. So yes, it is something we need to look at in detail and not assume that all time abroad together counts as case law influences how the text of 28 (2) (a) (ii) is interpreted.. Yes, she landed in December of 2014. To get two years of actual time on Canadian soil she needs to be back in Canada by December of 2017.
 

cempjwi

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Mar 14, 2012
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31-Jul-12
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09-Feb-13; Sent 13-Mar-13
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15-Oct-12; In-process 26-Mar-13
File Transfer...
15-Oct-12
Med's Request
02-Apr-13 Chest Xray Only
Med's Done....
14-May-12; 04-Apr-13 (Delivered 15-Apr-13)
Interview........
Waived
Passport Req..
19-Apr-2013
VISA ISSUED...
19-Apr-2013 (Rcvd May 15th, 2013)
LANDED..........
1-July-2013
Gumby749 said:
My understanding is that it is much more complicated than "time with a Canadian spouse abroad counts..." as the case I cited shows. There, Ms. Diouf was denied because of the interpretation of 'accompanied'. She was a PR who met her Canadian citizen husband AFTER she left Canada. The courts said that that was no 'accompanying'. So yes, it is something we need to look at in detail and not assume that all time abroad together counts as case law influences how the text of 28 (2) (a) (ii) is interpreted.. Yes, she landed in December of 2014. To get two years of actual time on Canadian soil she needs to be back in Canada by December of 2017.
So it seems that the court's interpretation of "accompanying a Canadian" means that the PR MUST leave Canada to accompany her husband but in the sense of "coming/going with or along with" him. That means that she must have left with you, which she clearly didn't do. I do not think that the interpretation could change based on the facts that she married you before she became a PR while abroad. A much more difficult situation is that you promised to go back to Canada as soon as your wife became a PR, which you have not done.

IRPA 130. (2) A sponsor who is a Canadian citizen and does not reside in Canada may sponsor a foreign national who makes an application referred to in subsection (1) and is the sponsor’s spouse, common-law partner, conjugal partner or dependent child who has no dependent children, if the sponsor will reside in Canada when the foreign national becomes a permanent resident.

Do you honestly believe that if you were to fight her RO while you both are still abroad, CIC will not find you as having defaulted the conditions of IRPA 130. (2) in regards to the approval of her PR?
 

dpenabill

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Apr 2, 2010
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Gumby749 said:
This thread is timely, as I too have similar questions on the whole 'accompany' issue. I have just read this article about the case law that has impacted the interpretation of the 'accompany a Canadian citizen' provisions of 28 (2) (a) (ii) at http://www.canadavisalaw.com/blog/maintaining-residency-by-accompanying-a-canadian-spouse-outside-canada/

My case is a bit different, unlike Ms. Diouf in the link who met her Canadian spouse after she left Canada, my wife and I had been married for nearly five years before we sought her PR status from outside Canada. It was granted and we intended to return to Canada. Yes, our intention was legitimate, we quit our jobs overseas, bought a house in Canada, etc. Before we could take up residency in Canada I was headhunted for a 'can't say no to' sort of job and we have not yet returned to Canada. So, here are my questions:

1. If we return to Canada before December of 2017 we can easily make 730 days on Canadian soil before our time runs out. However, if we stay overseas past December 2017, in this once-in-a-lifetime job, is my wife considered to be 'accompanying' me? She is under my visa as a spouse in the country we live in and we can easily prove that we live together.

2. Second wrinkle...I've had very fruitful conversations with a Canadian provincial government agency office in the country we're in and expect (as far as one can expect anything depending on budgets in an election year, etc) it to lead to a job offer. If I take up this job offer, but don't return to Canada before December 2017, is my wife considered to be 'accompanying' me?

Any opinions would be appreciated.
Generally, the key to credit for time "accompanying" a citizen spouse abroad has been cohabitating. The Diago Diouf IAD decision is an exception, and not the only one.

That said, if the reason the two of you remain abroad is due to your employment abroad (and you being the citizen partner), even if the more restrictive interpretation of "accompanying" was employed, you should be OK. But that is OK relative to the credit toward compliance with the PR Residency Obligation.

You do identify a wrinkle, one relative to not actually settling in Canada following the grant of PR status.

I do not wish to overly alarm you. What follows is more so that you aware of potential concerns and can be better prepared in the event the issue arises. My guess is that there will be no problem. But there is some risk. So I elaborate:

Personally I would be certain to retain all documentary evidence you can which would show that you had indeed made concrete plans to return to live in Canada (including, for example, documents related to the purchase of a home in Canada) and that changes in circumstances led you to change your plans after your partner landed.

Leading to this:
Gumby749 said:
Yes, she landed in December of 2014. To get two years of actual time on Canadian soil she needs to be back in Canada by December of 2017.
This timeline gives the impression the change in plans may have occurred prior to the date she landed. Indeed, it might overtly support a specific inference the change in plans occurred prior to the date of landing. Otherwise why so short a stay in Canada following the landing?

Is this a problem? How much might CIC re-examine the original process for obtaining PR status? I do not know. The timeline, however, suggests the burden of proving when you changed your plans could easily be placed on you and your spouse . . . that is, that CIC could infer the change in plans was before the date of landing, which would mean you would need to rebut that. Proof of the actual date of accepting the offer for the job that kept you abroad would be of much evidentiary importance . . . but if that date is prior to the date of landing (not the date of the PR application, but the date of landing), ouch.

I do not know whether this is likely to come up, but if it does, and you took the job before the date of landing, that tends to indicate misrepresentation by omission, by failing to notify CIC of a material change in circumstances, notably that your plans to return to Canada had changed.

Impression matters. Appearance matters.

If the job offer, or at least the date you accepted the job offer, was after the date of landing, and you have the documentation reflecting this, then there should be minimal risk related to this.

Moreover, while I am largely speculating about this, I doubt it will come up as an issue so long as compliance with the PR Residency Obligation does NOT come up. Technically one should have little or nothing to do with the other.

But, for example, if the two of you are back in Canada to live before she would need a PR Travel Document in order to return to Canada, my guess is that neither CBSA or CIC would dig into why there was a delay in settling in Canada. No problem.

The problem could more easily arise if she applied for a PR Travel Document. And in that instance, it is going to be glaringly obvious that you did not return to Canada to live together in Canada, based on the disclosure of addresses for the previous five years.

Probably no problem at a POE if the two of you are traveling together. Hard to see a border officer digging past finding out you are a citizen, her spouse, and the two of you have been living together. Particularly if she is still traveling with a valid PR card.

But visa office processing of PR Travel Document applications tend to be significantly, if not greatly, more strict. It is no coincidence that the Diago Diouf IAD case, and the Kartar Singh Khaira case (another decision similar to the Diouf decision, but much more recent) arose from PR TD applications which were denied, and the appeals denied as well; and a couple other recent cases where the visa office denied the PR TD on similar grounds but the IAD allowed the appeal, in the Kingsley Robertson Liong case (2013), and the Roberto P. Balan case (November 2012).

In contrast, for example, even if you do not return to live in Canada before December 2017, but you do so while her PR card is still valid, there is probably a very good chance you could come to Canada, together, and encounter no problems at the POE. No guarantees. And I am no expert. But, well, in this scenario there should be little to arouse concern for a border officer.

But once the PR card expires and a PR TD is needed, the risk of problems obviously increases.

As I noted, while technically the one issue really has little or nothing to do with the other, if a visa office engages in a residency determination, that is when the risks increase, when CIC is more likely to go digging for whatever negatives they might find. And again, impression matters, appearance matters.

Moreover, the law itself is always subject to change.



Historical observations:

In looking at the Diago Diouf IAD decision (decision dated May 30, 2011), and some more recent decisions regarding this issue, it is apparent that under the Harper government CIC has moved back toward an older, never common, more strict interpretation of the applicable statutory provision, one which does indeed examine who is accompanying whom. The more difficult cases appear to go both ways. That is never good. That means you can never be sure how it will go.

The irony is that some years ago this issue appeared to be completely settled, and qualifying for the exception only required the proof I outlined in my previous post:
-- proof of being in a qualified relationship (copy of marriage certificate for example)
-- proof of partner's Canadian citizenship (copy of Canadian passport for example)
-- and proof of cohabitation, of living together

It appears that it is not so well settled now, and has not been for a bit.

When I first researched this issue, regarding the interpretation and application of the "accompanying" a Canadian citizen spouse, it was actually so well-settled in both IAD and Federal Court decisions, in the intervening years I have not revisited looking at actual cases and formal decisions.

To be clear, what was well-settled was that the applicable law was consistent with the policy prescribed in the applicable operational manual, ENF 23 – Loss of Permanent Resident Status. There, in section 7.5, it states:
"In the case of a permanent resident outside Canada accompanying a Canadian citizen, it is not necessary to determine who is accompanying whom, nor is it necessary to determine for what purpose. In other words, under A28(2)(a)(ii) and R61(4), as long as a permanent resident is accompanying a Canadian citizen, the intent and purpose of their absences are not relevant as the residency obligation is met."

My sense is that is still the dominant approach, but again the Diago Diouf IAD decision and the Kartar Singh Khaira case raise this issue again, and it is clear that some visa offices are denying PRs a PR Travel Document (and thereby terminating the individual's PR status) after a more nuanced assessment as to who is accompanying whom.

Thus, for example, there is the Kingsley Robertson Liong case (2013), where the applicant was denied a PR TD based on the visa office's determination that " . . . it could not be said that it was [the PR] who accompanied [the citizen spouse] and, therefore, [the PR was not entitled to] any credit for time spent with [the PR]'s Canadian citizen [spouse] abroad."

And the Roberto P. Balan decision (November 2012) where, similarly, the PR was denied a PR TD based on the conclusion that the citizen was accompanying the PR.

In both the Kingsley Robertson Liong case and the Roberto P. Balan case, the appeal was allowed, the visa office decision overturned largely on the basis of the policy as prescribed in the operational manual quoted above, which one IAD panel described as the "unrestricted interpretation" of the statutory exception.

In particular, in the Roberto P. Balan case, the IAD stated:
"The issues presented by this case are familiar to the IAD as they have come up on other occasions and with" [some notable exceptions (including the Diago Diouf IAD decision)] "all appear to have been resolved in favour of the unrestricted interpretation. While the panel favours the logic of [the interpretation by the IAD panel which issued the Diouf decision] . . . it is obliged to follow the interpretation favoured by the appellant by which he can claim the legal benefit of being abroad in the company of his Canadian citizen wife.

Obviously, there is a greater risk now of a more restrictive interpretation of the "accompanying" a citizen partner exception. My sense is that cohabitation is still the key, rather than who accompanied whom, but particularly for those couples with, as might be said, other wrinkles, there is some risk.

The risk is likely tied in part to overall length of time abroad and extent to which the PR has had more direct ties to residing in Canada. One thing that appears common in all these cases, where the visa office denied the PR TD, is that the PR really had minimal direct Canadian experience or ties, never really was settled in Canada.

As noted, since you, the citizen, is the one with the job abroad, there should be no problem with obtaining the credit . . . but it is more the potential impression or perception a visa office might jump to when seeing the address history and how that could influence what they go digging to find.


Final note: there is some chance that things could swing a bit more toward a more flexible approach from CIC after the election. A Conservative government has, obviously, been pushing more enforcement and more strict enforcement. But this is also something widely desired by Canadians, so a change in the government might have no more than a minimal impact on enforcement policies or practices.
 

Gumby749

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I very much appreciate the thoughtful and detailed reply that you have provided. You are clearly very knowledgeable on this issue and the impact of precedent on these sorts of cases.

A bit more detail might be in order. When laying out our plans to return to Canada I was asked to explain in my wife's PR application my employment plans, which I did in some detail. I indicated employment plans for the short term, but that I had been involved in informal yet fruitful talks with a provincial government agency for longer-term employment in Canada. I indicated that these things take time and were dependent on budgets, my applying and getting hired, etc. I included a few emails of our correspondence back and forth.

We landed in Canada just before Christmas of 2014 with the intention to spend the holidays with family and then start the settling-in process. Early in the New Year I was contacted and told that the budget had been approved for a project in Canada and asked if I wanted to be part of it. I agreed. However, a week or so later our situation changed as another project, in the country we had just left, was initiated and I was asked to join as an independent contractor. I couldn't say no, as I was a natural fit for the position. From our perspective and that of Alberta it made perfect sense for me to return to somewhere where I have contacts and the language. I expect that the paperwork to move from contractor to a more regular status in the near future as there were formalities to be followed in the hiring process. However, I can imagine how it will look applying for PR, being in Canada just shy of three weeks, then returning to the country we had just left. I do have emails and employment contracts supporting this timeline, but I can easily see it raising some red flags.

On the positive front, I did indicate that I was in talks during the initial PR paperwork process and there is a substantial paper trail, and I am with a provincial government. On the negative side we weren't in Canada long at all and we have rented out the property that we bought - which looks a tad suspicious.




dpenabill said:
Generally, the key to credit for time "accompanying" a citizen spouse abroad has been cohabitating. The Diago Diouf IAD decision is an exception, and not the only one.

That said, if the reason the two of you remain abroad is due to your employment abroad (and you being the citizen partner), even if the more restrictive interpretation of "accompanying" was employed, you should be OK. But that is OK relative to the credit toward compliance with the PR Residency Obligation.

You do identify a wrinkle, one relative to not actually settling in Canada following the grant of PR status.

I do not wish to overly alarm you. What follows is more so that you aware of potential concerns and can be better prepared in the event the issue arises. My guess is that there will be no problem. But there is some risk. So I elaborate:

Personally I would be certain to retain all documentary evidence you can which would show that you had indeed made concrete plans to return to live in Canada (including, for example, documents related to the purchase of a home in Canada) and that changes in circumstances led you to change your plans after your partner landed.

Leading to this:
This timeline gives the impression the change in plans may have occurred prior to the date she landed. Indeed, it might overtly support a specific inference the change in plans occurred prior to the date of landing. Otherwise why so short a stay in Canada following the landing?

Is this a problem? How much might CIC re-examine the original process for obtaining PR status? I do not know. The timeline, however, suggests the burden of proving when you changed your plans could easily be placed on you and your spouse . . . that is, that CIC could infer the change in plans was before the date of landing, which would mean you would need to rebut that. Proof of the actual date of accepting the offer for the job that kept you abroad would be of much evidentiary importance . . . but if that date is prior to the date of landing (not the date of the PR application, but the date of landing), ouch.

I do not know whether this is likely to come up, but if it does, and you took the job before the date of landing, that tends to indicate misrepresentation by omission, by failing to notify CIC of a material change in circumstances, notably that your plans to return to Canada had changed.

Impression matters. Appearance matters.

If the job offer, or at least the date you accepted the job offer, was after the date of landing, and you have the documentation reflecting this, then there should be minimal risk related to this.

Moreover, while I am largely speculating about this, I doubt it will come up as an issue so long as compliance with the PR Residency Obligation does NOT come up. Technically one should have little or nothing to do with the other.

But, for example, if the two of you are back in Canada to live before she would need a PR Travel Document in order to return to Canada, my guess is that neither CBSA or CIC would dig into why there was a delay in settling in Canada. No problem.

The problem could more easily arise if she applied for a PR Travel Document. And in that instance, it is going to be glaringly obvious that you did not return to Canada to live together in Canada, based on the disclosure of addresses for the previous five years.

Probably no problem at a POE if the two of you are traveling together. Hard to see a border officer digging past finding out you are a citizen, her spouse, and the two of you have been living together. Particularly if she is still traveling with a valid PR card.

But visa office processing of PR Travel Document applications tend to be significantly, if not greatly, more strict. It is no coincidence that the Diago Diouf IAD case, and the Kartar Singh Khaira case (another decision similar to the Diouf decision, but much more recent) arose from PR TD applications which were denied, and the appeals denied as well; and a couple other recent cases where the visa office denied the PR TD on similar grounds but the IAD allowed the appeal, in the Kingsley Robertson Liong case (2013), and the Roberto P. Balan case (November 2012).

In contrast, for example, even if you do not return to live in Canada before December 2017, but you do so while her PR card is still valid, there is probably a very good chance you could come to Canada, together, and encounter no problems at the POE. No guarantees. And I am no expert. But, well, in this scenario there should be little to arouse concern for a border officer.

But once the PR card expires and a PR TD is needed, the risk of problems obviously increases.

As I noted, while technically the one issue really has little or nothing to do with the other, if a visa office engages in a residency determination, that is when the risks increase, when CIC is more likely to go digging for whatever negatives they might find. And again, impression matters, appearance matters.

Moreover, the law itself is always subject to change.



Historical observations:

In looking at the Diago Diouf IAD decision (decision dated May 30, 2011), and some more recent decisions regarding this issue, it is apparent that under the Harper government CIC has moved back toward an older, never common, more strict interpretation of the applicable statutory provision, one which does indeed examine who is accompanying whom. The more difficult cases appear to go both ways. That is never good. That means you can never be sure how it will go.

The irony is that some years ago this issue appeared to be completely settled, and qualifying for the exception only required the proof I outlined in my previous post:
-- proof of being in a qualified relationship (copy of marriage certificate for example)
-- proof of partner's Canadian citizenship (copy of Canadian passport for example)
-- and proof of cohabitation, of living together

It appears that it is not so well settled now, and has not been for a bit.

When I first researched this issue, regarding the interpretation and application of the "accompanying" a Canadian citizen spouse, it was actually so well-settled in both IAD and Federal Court decisions, in the intervening years I have not revisited looking at actual cases and formal decisions.

To be clear, what was well-settled was that the applicable law was consistent with the policy prescribed in the applicable operational manual, ENF 23 – Loss of Permanent Resident Status. There, in section 7.5, it states:
"In the case of a permanent resident outside Canada accompanying a Canadian citizen, it is not necessary to determine who is accompanying whom, nor is it necessary to determine for what purpose. In other words, under A28(2)(a)(ii) and R61(4), as long as a permanent resident is accompanying a Canadian citizen, the intent and purpose of their absences are not relevant as the residency obligation is met."

My sense is that is still the dominant approach, but again the Diago Diouf IAD decision and the Kartar Singh Khaira case raise this issue again, and it is clear that some visa offices are denying PRs a PR Travel Document (and thereby terminating the individual's PR status) after a more nuanced assessment as to who is accompanying whom.

Thus, for example, there is the Kingsley Robertson Liong case (2013), where the applicant was denied a PR TD based on the visa office's determination that " . . . it could not be said that it was [the PR] who accompanied [the citizen spouse] and, therefore, [the PR was not entitled to] any credit for time spent with [the PR]'s Canadian citizen [spouse] abroad."

And the Roberto P. Balan decision (November 2012) where, similarly, the PR was denied a PR TD based on the conclusion that the citizen was accompanying the PR.

In both the Kingsley Robertson Liong case and the Roberto P. Balan case, the appeal was allowed, the visa office decision overturned largely on the basis of the policy as prescribed in the operational manual quoted above, which one IAD panel described as the "unrestricted interpretation" of the statutory exception.

In particular, in the Roberto P. Balan case, the IAD stated:
"The issues presented by this case are familiar to the IAD as they have come up on other occasions and with" [some notable exceptions (including the Diago Diouf IAD decision)] "all appear to have been resolved in favour of the unrestricted interpretation. While the panel favours the logic of [the interpretation by the IAD panel which issued the Diouf decision] . . . it is obliged to follow the interpretation favoured by the appellant by which he can claim the legal benefit of being abroad in the company of his Canadian citizen wife.

Obviously, there is a greater risk now of a more restrictive interpretation of the "accompanying" a citizen partner exception. My sense is that cohabitation is still the key, rather than who accompanied whom, but particularly for those couples with, as might be said, other wrinkles, there is some risk.

The risk is likely tied in part to overall length of time abroad and extent to which the PR has had more direct ties to residing in Canada. One thing that appears common in all these cases, where the visa office denied the PR TD, is that the PR really had minimal direct Canadian experience or ties, never really was settled in Canada.

As noted, since you, the citizen, is the one with the job abroad, there should be no problem with obtaining the credit . . . but it is more the potential impression or perception a visa office might jump to when seeing the address history and how that could influence what they go digging to find.


Final note: there is some chance that things could swing a bit more toward a more flexible approach from CIC after the election. A Conservative government has, obviously, been pushing more enforcement and more strict enforcement. But this is also something widely desired by Canadians, so a change in the government might have no more than a minimal impact on enforcement policies or practices.
 

Gumby749

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This is the issue, isn't it? See my longer response below for more details. In my mind, it is clear that we left Canada after she became a PR, but a very very short time after. I can easily understand how some might see it as misrepresentation though.


cempjwi said:
So it seems that the court's interpretation of "accompanying a Canadian" means that the PR MUST leave Canada to accompany her husband but in the sense of "coming/going with or along with" him. That means that she must have left with you, which she clearly didn't do. I do not think that the interpretation could change based on the facts that she married you before she became a PR while abroad. A much more difficult situation is that you promised to go back to Canada as soon as your wife became a PR, which you have not done.

IRPA 130. (2) A sponsor who is a Canadian citizen and does not reside in Canada may sponsor a foreign national who makes an application referred to in subsection (1) and is the sponsor’s spouse, common-law partner, conjugal partner or dependent child who has no dependent children, if the sponsor will reside in Canada when the foreign national becomes a permanent resident.

Do you honestly believe that if you were to fight her RO while you both are still abroad, CIC will not find you as having defaulted the conditions of IRPA 130. (2) in regards to the approval of her PR?
 

dpenabill

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Apr 2, 2010
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Gumby749 said:
This is the issue, isn't it? See my longer response below for more details. In my mind, it is clear that we left Canada after she became a PR, but a very very short time after. I can easily understand how some might see it as misrepresentation though.
cempjwi said:
Do you honestly believe that if you were to fight her RO while you both are still abroad, CIC will not find you as having defaulted the conditions of IRPA 130. (2) in regards to the approval of her PR?
Indeed, while there are many variables and possibilities, the more significant risk arises, as cempjwi highlights, if there is a Residency Determination made abroad.

That, as I had noted, would happen if there is a PR Travel Document application. As I said, the issue is not likely (in terms of probabilities) to arise "so long as compliance with the PR Residency Obligation does NOT come up."

In particular, as long as you are traveling together when coming to Canada, and her PR card is still valid, there is minimal risk of elevated scrutiny at the POE.



What does this mean in practical terms? Some further observations:

It means that the target for returning to Canada more or less long term does not have to be by December 2017, giving you a year or nearly two years more flexibility. Beyond that the risks increase. Regular travel to and from Canada, together, in the meantime, could significantly mitigate the risks.

Explanation for this:

The PR RO question might arise as soon as she has been outside Canada for a period approaching 1095 days, notwithstanding "accompanying" you. As anyone experienced in bureaucratic transactions is aware, just the question can be problematic, even if the correct answer to the question should be favourable. That is particularly illustrated in this scenario, where once the PR RO question arises, the PR's immigration history itself may be examined, which could lead to questions about the truthfulness of representations made in the PR visa application process.

But so long as she has a valid PR card and would be accompanying you on any trip to Canada, the odds of a probing residency interview at the POE are low. Thus, it is not necessarily critical for the move to Canada to be made by December, 2017, but could be up to nearly two years later. Again, occasional brief trips to Canada in the meantime, while accompanying you, would improve the odds positively even more.

The real risk comes if and when an application for a PR Travel Document must be made. Or, similarly although not to the same degree, if the PR card expires and she is able, nonetheless, to travel to a Canadian POE, where upon seeking entry the expired PR card might trigger a more probing examination of her immigration history in conjunction with a probing residency interview.

The former, the PR TD application, is probably the far more risky scenario. PRs living abroad long-term appear to face fairly elevated, if not rather strict scrutiny by visa offices abroad. The longer abroad, the more so. In contrast, the fact that you are the one, the citizen partner, whose employment causes the two of you to be abroad is a huge, positive factor. So there may be minimal risk. I do not read all PR IAD decisions (and do not recall being aware of the Diouf case before you mentioned it), but over the course of years I have not seen much in what I have read, or in forum reports, to indicate that the failure to actually make the move to Canada (for citizens abroad sponsoring partners) is targeted as a ground for inadmissibility based on misrepresentation.

But for anyone who is risk aversive, this is a risk warranting some attention, and being prepared for.


Leading to the main reason for these further observations:

The convention wisdom, the overwhelming consensus, has long been what I posted a couple times above, that for the PR who is living abroad with a Canadian citizen partner, to be sure to be allowed credit for the time living together abroad, the PR should be prepared to prove:
-- proof of being in a qualified relationship (copy of marriage certificate for example)
-- proof of partner's Canadian citizenship (copy of Canadian passport for example)
-- and proof of cohabitation, of living together

Historically that has been enough. At least almost always enough.

It now appears that, especially for those with a potential wrinkle in their circumstances or history, it would also be prudent to also have proof of the citizen's employment abroad, to show that the reason for being abroad is that the citizen is employed abroad.

Obviously, many PRs abroad with citizen partners will not have this, as oft times it is indeed the PR who is the one employed abroad. For now most probably do not need this additional proof of the citizen's employment abroad. But for those whose circumstances might lead to more probing and potentially negative scrutiny, it will be prudent to have and present this additional layer of proof.

In this regard, your query and report should be appreciated by this forum. Too often these problems are not addressed, not brought up, until the damage has been done. The more common context in these forums, for example, is the PR (or PR's partner) posting a more or less WTF happened? query after a PR TD application has been denied. You were prudent to look into this early and again the forum should appreciate what could amount to an important head-up for others who might be in similar situations.