Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth’ rules

[keesio]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

Which I agree with your comment. So government could change it so that only Canadian and PRs shall be granted right to "citizenship by birth" to their children. Everyone else, can only get citizenship of parent only. Is this basically what it comes down to?

Screech339

Well the details have yet to be fully presented but this is what people are speculating.

I actually would extend "citizenship by birth" to beyond just citizens and PRs. I'd also include any resident... temporary or permanent. Like people on extended work visas and also students. Basically to anyone beyond "visitor" status. Maybe too lenient for some but I would be fine with it myself personally.

 

[keesio]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

I think currently any baby born in Canada is considered a citizen if one of the parents has at least PR status.

Actually, it is

"I think currently any baby born in Canada is considered a citizen". PERIOD.

There are some very very rare exceptions (like children born to diplomats and ambassadors or specific countries/roles) but otherwise, if you are born in Canada, you are a Citizen - regardless of your parents status in Canada.

 

[screech339]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

Well the details have yet to be fully presented but this is what people are speculating.

I actually would extend "citizenship by birth" to beyond just citizens and PRs. I'd also include any resident... temporary or permanent. Like people on extended work visas and also students. Basically to anyone beyond "visitor" status. Maybe too lenient for some but I would be fine with it myself personally.

The problem with going beyond visitors to include those on temporary work visa / study visa is that some people will think they should not be granted "citizenship by birth" on account that they are here to "study" or "work" TEMPORARY. If we include those here on temporary work or study visas, those on visitor visa can sue for discrimination since those on temporary study and work visa gets the privilege and not the visitor status under the argument that they are also "temporary resident" like the others.

To prevent discrimination on that argument, stating only PRs and Canadians can only get "citizenship by birth" rights will remove the temporary resident argument from the visitor status. Only those who have PERMANENT status like Canadian and PRs will separate those who are here TEMPORARY. Clear define boundary between the two.

Screech339

 

[keesio]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

those on visitor visa can sue for discrimination since those on temporary study and work visa gets the privilege and not the visitor status under the argument that they are also "temporary resident" like the others.

I thought there was clear distinction that a "visitor" is NOT a resident of any sort... even temporary. Just like someone on a temporary work permit can MOVE to Canada temporarily... but someone visiting Canada can not move to Canada. At least CBSA makes this distinction.

 

[BLT]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

In many countries, even a baby from PR parents is not a citizen. Only if one of the parents is citizen.

 

[keesio]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

In many countries, even a baby from PR parents is not a citizen. Only if one of the parents is citizen.

Yes, indeed. Despite the feeling that Canada and USA is becoming more hostile to immigrants (which is true), both countries still have some of the most favorable immigration laws in the developed world.

 

[screech339]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

I thought there was clear distinction that a "visitor" is NOT a resident of any sort... even temporary. Just like someone on a temporary work permit can MOVE to Canada temporarily... but someone visiting Canada can not move to Canada. At least CBSA makes this distinction.

I agree but lawyers are not going to use that argument. They will say "they are legally temporary residents" no difference from those on work and study visa. They are all "legal temporary residents".

Look at what happened to those on refugee status on getting medical benefits. The federal court of appeals ruled that despite refugee from a "safe" country, he/she should get the same benefits as those from "unsafe" countries all under the argument that they are ALL refugees. The court considered it to be unfair that "refugees" from SAFE countries doesn't get the same benefits as refugees not from SAFE countries.

Lawyers can use the same line of argument that they are all "TEMPORARY" residents thus if those here in Canada on work or study visa get the citizenship by birth rights, so does the those with "visitor" status.

Screech339

 

[BLT]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

Yes, indeed. Despite the feeling that Canada and USA is becoming more hostile to immigrants (which is true), both countries still have some of the most favorable immigration laws in the developed world.

Canada will find it very difficult without immigrants. Some people who work behind the desk will keep shouting to stop immigration. But for those who work at the front lines, like car sales men, realtors, business people, waiters, casinos, etc will keep shouting to add more immigrants. I'm from Vancouver, and currently 50% of house buyers below 2 million dollar are immigrants, and 90% for above 3 million dollar. Then my friend works in a casino, those who place single bet over 10 grand are 100% Asians. 100%,not even 99% anymore. Then look at universities in Canada are making money from international students, etc. If Canada closes door to foreigners, it will become a suicide attempt. Some people just don't realize this.

 

[Rayan14]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

So that mean Canada is looking to join the rest of the developed world with the exception of the USA (which is also looking to stop this procedure). I can't say I oppose this idea.

Anchor babies?

 

[screech339]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

Canada will find it very difficult without immigrants. Some people who work behind the desk will keep shouting to stop immigration. But for those who work at the front lines, like car sales men, realtors, business people, waiters, casinos, etc will keep shouting to add more immigrants. I'm from Vancouver, and currently 50% of house buyers below 2 million dollar are immigrants, and 90% for above 3 million dollar. Then my friend works in a casino, those who place single bet over 10 grand are 100% Asians. 100%,not even 99% anymore. Then look at universities in Canada are making money from international students, etc. If Canada closes door to foreigners, it will become a suicide attempt. Some people just don't realize this.

It is not surprising to see university catering to international students over Canadian / PR. International students bring more revenue to university pockets due to having to pay international fees over domestic fees.

 

[keesio]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

Canada will find it very difficult without immigrants. Some people who work behind the desk will keep shouting to stop immigration. But for those who work at the front lines, like car sales men, realtors, business people, waiters, casinos, etc will keep shouting to add more immigrants. I'm from Vancouver, and currently 50% of house buyers below 2 million dollar are immigrants, and 90% for above 3 million dollar. Then my friend works in a casino, those who place single bet over 10 grand are 100% Asians. 100%,not even 99% anymore. Then look at universities in Canada are making money from international students, etc. If Canada closes door to foreigners, it will become a suicide attempt. Some people just don't realize this.

Every country wants RICH immigrants (and visitors). Heck, they even advertise to them. In some countries, you can almost buy your way to citizenship.

 

[sazamizi]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

I think every immigrant around the world is pretty smart at the time. If Canada or any other country would like to have rich immigrants, they need to provide facilities, job and business security. Money doesn't come to a moderate market but does easily go to a brilliant market. If these countries just think to bring people and benefit from their money without providing enough service, people are smart and find a way to get their money.

 

[keesio]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

I think every immigrant around the world is pretty smart at the time. If Canada or any other country would like to have rich immigrants, they need to provide facilities, job and business security. Money doesn't come to a moderate market but does easily go to a brilliant market. If these countries just think to bring people and benefit from their money without providing enough service, people are smart and find a way to get their money.

Canada and the US are prime targets for wealthy mainland Chinese. This is because of more relaxed immigration rules, less barrier for entry, and the perceived stability of the countries. Canada also has a reputation of being a "clean" country, especially the air. This is concern as air pollution becomes a bigger issue in China.

 

[BLT]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

Canada and the US are prime targets for wealthy mainland Chinese. This is because of more relaxed immigration rules, less barrier for entry, and the perceived stability of the countries. Canada also has a reputation of being a "clean" country, especially the air. This is concern as air pollution becomes a bigger issue in China.

You know what, every developing country has an air quality issue. I think Hanoi, Manila, Jakarta, New Delhi, Kuala Lumpur, etc are just as pollute as any city in China or even worse. Canada has a good quality of air because the population is much less, and there is almost no factory here. In US, with much more population but still less factories than China, pollution is worse than Canada. In China, some cities alone has about 150 million of population (the whole Canada = 30 million) and being the factory of the world, there is no way air quality can be better than US, let alone Canada or Swiss.
And fyi, Singapore has more mainland Chinese than Canada, it's just very difficult to immigrate to Singapore, so most of their status are not PR or citizen. But they park their money there much more than they do in Canada. Here they just park it mostly as property assets. In Singapore, they park it there as properties and investment fund. That's why the government of Singapore imposed a stamp fee of 18% for foreigners buying property and make it very difficult to get mortgage, to stop mainland Chinese from buying the whole country.

 

[eileenf]

Re: Harper government considers tightening ‘citizenship by birth' rules

My impression was that this was studied for inclusion in the citizenship Bill but left by the wayside because it lacks practicality, so I'm surprised to see the Tories saying it is still under consideration. This idea fights a small and anecdotal problem by creating a bigger problem: High cost, difficult implementation, bureaucratic hassle, costs to provinces to redesign their birth certificate process, and the inevitable creation of statelessness for some children whose parents go underground or who fall through some entirely predictable cracks.

Canada signed the Convention on statelessness, but it's inevitable that some people fall through the cracks. My guesses: children of temporary or undocumented workers; children of refugees or PRs whose cases are still pending but do not have status yet; children of students; children of temporary residents found inadmissible for PR due to criminality or security issues; children of refugees denied status who cannot be deported due to security situations in their home countries (i.e. Afghanistan, Democratic Republic of Congo, Haiti, Iraq and Zimbabwe and usually Gaza, Mali, certain regions in Somalia, Syria and the Central African Republic).