Finding job after PR

[narayanf1]

Targeted at: Asivad and others who got PR through EE and landed


Assumption: Got PR through EE, not necessarily landed.
Specifics: Jobs in Information Technology
Background: I'm a software developer with 8 years experience in homeland.
Hearsay: Employers hire only Canadian experienced candidates. Permanent Residents have to do some kind of bridging program and do survival jobs like running taxi, attendant at departmental store, etc., for about 2-3 years.


Question: is the hearsay true? have there been such cases? or does it require a good profile and right way to search jobs?

I'm specifically interested in knowing actual experiences. I'm sure many have this question in their mind.

 

[narayanf1]

Expert opinion/experience please...

 

[luvanuj]

I dont think so. Couple of my friends got a job in IBM, TCS etc. Not sure how it works with long years of experience. But I think there are lots of IT jobs

 

[Asivad Anac]

Wrong section of the forum - check Settlement issues and Finding work in Canada for both horror stories and success stories. Of course, you'll find more horror stories. Fear sells. Negativity sells. No newspaper sold more copies because they had a front line news story about school kids of a particular generation being more dynamic, outgoing and resourceful than kids of the previous generation but every newspaper in the World will carry an ISIS story on the front page if they so much as schedule a press conference to announce their next pathetic misadventure!

And that's true of Canada as well. Unsuccessful people outnumber successful people on the forum. Unsuccessful immigrants are heard more often because they make more noise (probably because the successful ones are busy working the levers of the economy) and media loves noisy people. Economic revival is a Pg 13 left bottom story. Economic mishaps are front page news and the stuff of lofty sermonizing editorials.

Having said that, it is true that the Canadian economy is in trouble. In a broader sense, it is headed for more trouble. Iran will push more oil over the next few months into the global market, not great news when oil is already below 30 now. Oil sands aren't lucrative even at twice that price so Alberta will continue its free fall. But hey, Chinese stock market just crashed as well. So did Japan. Australia and South Korea. Wall Street is spooked. Everyone is watching China while no one knows the reality behind the 'Red Curtain'. When China releases more data on its domestic market this week or later, expect more bloodbath. But here is the critical question - does this affect you?

We all lived through 2008. Some lost their jobs, some barely held on while a few went ahead and got great incentives! Canadian job market is not going to be any different. Some immigrants will struggle, some will compromise, some will take sub-optimal jobs while a few will do well for themselves. The bell curve works and works well. The mistake people make is always assume that they are more right on the bell curve than they deserve to be. Immigration is a reality check. If you're an average performer in your home country (in a place where you know how to 'work' the system), you'll be below-average in Canada till you understand how to 'work' the system. If you were above-average there, you'll probably be average in Canada for a while before finding your feet. If you were exceptional, you'll continue to be exceptional - that's probably the only exception!

The point being - be realistic about who you are and what your chances should be. Only people with a strong inner compass would be able to face the harsh realities of moving to a country where they have to start from scratch on almost every area of their life. Of course, it helps tremendously if you effectively communicate in English. Resume shortlists and interviews are decided in the first minute and not having strong command over the language is a terrible handicap for an already disadvantaged immigrant. In addition to that, the cold bogs many people down. Most immigrants into Canada are not from geographies that experience consistently cold/gloomy/rainy weather for most parts of the year. Naturally, they feel out of place for a while and this adds to their paranoia about Canada being an unwelcoming country.

People succeed and fail in Canada for the same reasons they succeed and fail elsewhere on the planet.

1. They compare notes with others and peg their own success goals artificially high. Then they get disappointed when they can't make it there.

2. They have unrealistic expectations from their future which are completely unrelated with their past and/or their present situation.

3. They hear and discuss more about failures than about successes leading to a vicious circle and the birth of a self-fulfilling prophecy of failure.

4. They are creatures of habit and find it incredibly difficult to adapt to new situations, circumstances, people, ideas and cultures.

5. They don't persevere enough, toil enough, luck out enough, equip themselves enough or stay optimistic for enough time.

Bottom line, not everyone will make it big in Canada. But not everyone will fail too.

All the best!

 

[gmreddy]

Great explanation!!! Asivad;

Thank you for those words, It was indeed a morale booster..,

 

[guillefranco73]

Wrong section of the forum - check Settlement issues and Finding work in Canada for both horror stories and success stories. Of course, you'll find more horror stories. Fear sells. Negativity sells. No newspaper sold more copies because they had a front line news story about school kids of a particular generation being more dynamic, outgoing and resourceful than kids of the previous generation but every newspaper in the World will carry an ISIS story on the front page if they so much as schedule a press conference to announce their next pathetic misadventure!

And that's true of Canada as well. Unsuccessful people outnumber successful people on the forum. Unsuccessful immigrants are heard more often because they make more noise (probably because the successful ones are busy working the levers of the economy) and media loves noisy people. Economic revival is a Pg 13 left bottom story. Economic mishaps are front page news and the stuff of lofty sermonizing editorials.

Having said that, it is true that the Canadian economy is in trouble. In a broader sense, it is headed for more trouble. Iran will push more oil over the next few months into the global market, not great news when oil is already below 30 now. Oil sands aren't lucrative even at twice that price so Alberta will continue its free fall. But hey, Chinese stock market just crashed as well. So did Japan. Australia and South Korea. Wall Street is spooked. Everyone is watching China while no one knows the reality behind the 'Red Curtain'. When China releases more data on its domestic market this week or later, expect more bloodbath. But here is the critical question - does this affect you?

We all lived through 2008. Some lost their jobs, some barely held on while a few went ahead and got great incentives! Canadian job market is not going to be any different. Some immigrants will struggle, some will compromise, some will take sub-optimal jobs while a few will do well for themselves. The bell curve works and works well. The mistake people make is always assume that they are more right on the bell curve than they deserve to be. Immigration is a reality check. If you're an average performer in your home country (in a place where you know how to 'work' the system), you'll be below-average in Canada till you understand how to 'work' the system. If you were above-average there, you'll probably be average in Canada for a while before finding your feet. If you were exceptional, you'll continue to be exceptional - that's probably the only exception!

The point being - be realistic about who you are and what your chances should be. Only people with a strong inner compass would be able to face the harsh realities of moving to a country where they have to start from scratch on almost every area of their life. Of course, it helps tremendously if you effectively communicate in English. Resume shortlists and interviews are decided in the first minute and not having strong command over the language is a terrible handicap for an already disadvantaged immigrant. In addition to that, the cold bogs many people down. Most immigrants into Canada are not from geographies that experience consistently cold/gloomy/rainy weather for most parts of the year. Naturally, they feel out of place for a while and this adds to their paranoia about Canada being an unwelcoming country.

People succeed and fail in Canada for the same reasons they succeed and fail elsewhere on the planet.

1. They compare notes with others and peg their own success goals artificially high. Then they get disappointed when they can't make it there.

2. They have unrealistic expectations from their future which are completely unrelated with their past and/or their present situation.

3. They hear and discuss more about failures than about successes leading to a vicious circle and the birth of a self-fulfilling prophecy of failure.

4. They are creatures of habit and find it incredibly difficult to adapt to new situations, circumstances, people, ideas and cultures.

5. They don't persevere enough, toil enough, luck out enough, equip themselves enough or stay optimistic for enough time.

Bottom line, not everyone will make it big in Canada. But not everyone will fail too.

All the best!

Nice piece Asivad! This is very true.

 

[Froze950]

Wrong section of the forum - check Settlement issues and Finding work in Canada for both horror stories and success stories. Of course, you'll find more horror stories. Fear sells. Negativity sells. No newspaper sold more copies because they had a front line news story about school kids of a particular generation being more dynamic, outgoing and resourceful than kids of the previous generation but every newspaper in the World will carry an ISIS story on the front page if they so much as schedule a press conference to announce their next pathetic misadventure!

And that's true of Canada as well. Unsuccessful people outnumber successful people on the forum. Unsuccessful immigrants are heard more often because they make more noise (probably because the successful ones are busy working the levers of the economy) and media loves noisy people. Economic revival is a Pg 13 left bottom story. Economic mishaps are front page news and the stuff of lofty sermonizing editorials.

Having said that, it is true that the Canadian economy is in trouble. In a broader sense, it is headed for more trouble. Iran will push more oil over the next few months into the global market, not great news when oil is already below 30 now. Oil sands aren't lucrative even at twice that price so Alberta will continue its free fall. But hey, Chinese stock market just crashed as well. So did Japan. Australia and South Korea. Wall Street is spooked. Everyone is watching China while no one knows the reality behind the 'Red Curtain'. When China releases more data on its domestic market this week or later, expect more bloodbath. But here is the critical question - does this affect you?

We all lived through 2008. Some lost their jobs, some barely held on while a few went ahead and got great incentives! Canadian job market is not going to be any different. Some immigrants will struggle, some will compromise, some will take sub-optimal jobs while a few will do well for themselves. The bell curve works and works well. The mistake people make is always assume that they are more right on the bell curve than they deserve to be. Immigration is a reality check. If you're an average performer in your home country (in a place where you know how to 'work' the system), you'll be below-average in Canada till you understand how to 'work' the system. If you were above-average there, you'll probably be average in Canada for a while before finding your feet. If you were exceptional, you'll continue to be exceptional - that's probably the only exception!

The point being - be realistic about who you are and what your chances should be. Only people with a strong inner compass would be able to face the harsh realities of moving to a country where they have to start from scratch on almost every area of their life. Of course, it helps tremendously if you effectively communicate in English. Resume shortlists and interviews are decided in the first minute and not having strong command over the language is a terrible handicap for an already disadvantaged immigrant. In addition to that, the cold bogs many people down. Most immigrants into Canada are not from geographies that experience consistently cold/gloomy/rainy weather for most parts of the year. Naturally, they feel out of place for a while and this adds to their paranoia about Canada being an unwelcoming country.

People succeed and fail in Canada for the same reasons they succeed and fail elsewhere on the planet.

1. They compare notes with others and peg their own success goals artificially high. Then they get disappointed when they can't make it there.

2. They have unrealistic expectations from their future which are completely unrelated with their past and/or their present situation.

3. They hear and discuss more about failures than about successes leading to a vicious circle and the birth of a self-fulfilling prophecy of failure.

4. They are creatures of habit and find it incredibly difficult to adapt to new situations, circumstances, people, ideas and cultures.

5. They don't persevere enough, toil enough, luck out enough, equip themselves enough or stay optimistic for enough time.

Bottom line, not everyone will make it big in Canada. But not everyone will fail too.

All the best!

Spot on ! Everything is bloody spot on !

 

[TheMaze]

I don't believe it's true. I'm also in IT and I found a job that is sponsoring me for a NAFTA work visa while I'm waiting for my PR, so you're actually a more eligible candidate than I was.

 

[JoacRy]

Wrong section of the forum - check Settlement issues and Finding work in Canada for both horror stories and success stories. Of course, you'll find more horror stories. Fear sells. Negativity sells. No newspaper sold more copies because they had a front line news story about school kids of a particular generation being more dynamic, outgoing and resourceful than kids of the previous generation but every newspaper in the World will carry an ISIS story on the front page if they so much as schedule a press conference to announce their next pathetic misadventure!

And that's true of Canada as well. Unsuccessful people outnumber successful people on the forum. Unsuccessful immigrants are heard more often because they make more noise (probably because the successful ones are busy working the levers of the economy) and media loves noisy people. Economic revival is a Pg 13 left bottom story. Economic mishaps are front page news and the stuff of lofty sermonizing editorials.

Having said that, it is true that the Canadian economy is in trouble. In a broader sense, it is headed for more trouble. Iran will push more oil over the next few months into the global market, not great news when oil is already below 30 now. Oil sands aren't lucrative even at twice that price so Alberta will continue its free fall. But hey, Chinese stock market just crashed as well. So did Japan. Australia and South Korea. Wall Street is spooked. Everyone is watching China while no one knows the reality behind the 'Red Curtain'. When China releases more data on its domestic market this week or later, expect more bloodbath. But here is the critical question - does this affect you?

We all lived through 2008. Some lost their jobs, some barely held on while a few went ahead and got great incentives! Canadian job market is not going to be any different. Some immigrants will struggle, some will compromise, some will take sub-optimal jobs while a few will do well for themselves. The bell curve works and works well. The mistake people make is always assume that they are more right on the bell curve than they deserve to be. Immigration is a reality check. If you're an average performer in your home country (in a place where you know how to 'work' the system), you'll be below-average in Canada till you understand how to 'work' the system. If you were above-average there, you'll probably be average in Canada for a while before finding your feet. If you were exceptional, you'll continue to be exceptional - that's probably the only exception!

The point being - be realistic about who you are and what your chances should be. Only people with a strong inner compass would be able to face the harsh realities of moving to a country where they have to start from scratch on almost every area of their life. Of course, it helps tremendously if you effectively communicate in English. Resume shortlists and interviews are decided in the first minute and not having strong command over the language is a terrible handicap for an already disadvantaged immigrant. In addition to that, the cold bogs many people down. Most immigrants into Canada are not from geographies that experience consistently cold/gloomy/rainy weather for most parts of the year. Naturally, they feel out of place for a while and this adds to their paranoia about Canada being an unwelcoming country.

People succeed and fail in Canada for the same reasons they succeed and fail elsewhere on the planet.

1. They compare notes with others and peg their own success goals artificially high. Then they get disappointed when they can't make it there.

2. They have unrealistic expectations from their future which are completely unrelated with their past and/or their present situation.

3. They hear and discuss more about failures than about successes leading to a vicious circle and the birth of a self-fulfilling prophecy of failure.

4. They are creatures of habit and find it incredibly difficult to adapt to new situations, circumstances, people, ideas and cultures.

5. They don't persevere enough, toil enough, luck out enough, equip themselves enough or stay optimistic for enough time.

Bottom line, not everyone will make it big in Canada. But not everyone will fail too.

All the best!

Thank you for the words of caution and the words of inspiration combined. I can confer as I have been on a Working Visa and from my perspective the economy is in a downward spiral.

 

[narayanf1]

Thanks Asivad. You took quite a time to explain the reality.

Also to add upon that, one should constantly self-improve and keep up with current demands by learning and gaining experience. One should be open to look beyond their field of expertise for opportunities.

Best of luck to everyone.

 

[number411]

Asivad - Since you are personally experiencing job search now, will you mind writing such diary notes every week on what you are doing. The place for this thread is in Settlement section. Your thoughts are sensible and useful to hundreds who will follow you, so can you please document your approach of settlement regularly? This is a request on behalf of all forum users, please consider, I'm sure you will.

Economic revival is a Pg 13 left bottom story. Economic mishaps are front page news and the stuff of lofty sermonizing editorials.

Really mature assessment, esp on the editorials. I can see economic punters are out in newspapers like Globe and Mail and National Post.

Having said that, it is true that the Canadian economy is in trouble. In a broader sense, it is headed for more trouble. Iran will push more oil over the next few months into the global market, not great news when oil is already below 30 now. Oil sands aren't lucrative even at twice that price so Alberta will continue its free fall. But hey, Chinese stock market just crashed as well. So did Japan. Australia and South Korea. Wall Street is spooked. Everyone is watching China while no one knows the reality behind the 'Red Curtain'. When China releases more data on its domestic market this week or later, expect more bloodbath. But here is the critical question - does this affect you?

Maybe it does affect because Oil and Gas, and Commodity industries, and Banks are very big in Canada and if those guys are laying off and not recruiting, it will affect the entire job market. But yeah, macro pictures are not so relevant to one person who is searching for a or any job in Calgary. His own personal resume, interview and other skills and disposition matter most.

The point being - be realistic about who you are and what your chances should be. Only people with a strong inner compass would be able to face the harsh realities of moving to a country where they have to start from scratch on almost every area of their life. Of course, it helps tremendously if you effectively communicate in English. Resume shortlists and interviews are decided in the first minute and not having strong command over the language is a terrible handicap for an already disadvantaged immigrant. In addition to that, the cold bogs many people down. Most immigrants into Canada are not from geographies that experience consistently cold/gloomy/rainy weather for most parts of the year. Naturally, they feel out of place for a while and this adds to their paranoia about Canada being an unwelcoming country.

Excellent point. Having an ethnic name drops recruiter response by half, and having a foreign degree and no work experience, by another half. I am told repeatedly by many friends in Canada to expect 6 months of job search, to make job search a full time job, and to network well to find a job. I would expect these 6 months to be very tough time, and a recessing economy and winter will aggravate the pain.

People succeed and fail in Canada for the same reasons they succeed and fail elsewhere on the planet.

Bottom line, not everyone will make it big in Canada. But not everyone will fail too.

All the best!

One has to have a realistic goal of immigration, and define his own success metric. Canada is not US and the society there is set-up for middle class lives. You know what is the metric of success set by government for Syrian refugees. To put them in a house and their kids in school, and then the govt settlement organizations do their regular thing with them. With no or minimal english skills, if they get any job that will probably be called a success. The first Syrian refugee, who got out of plane and personally welcomed by Trudeau, is an obstetric surgeon who performed 10,000 childbirths in Syria. He can't work as a doctor in Canada. So his life goals and success metric has to be something else compared to home, although he is probably an exceptional guy. Tone down your expectations of success and you'll be pleased faster.

 

[Asivad Anac]

Asivad - Since you are personally experiencing job search now, will you mind writing such diary notes every week on what you are doing. The place for this thread is in Settlement section. Your thoughts are sensible and useful to hundreds who will follow you, so can you please document your approach of settlement regularly? This is a request on behalf of all forum users, please consider, I'm sure you will.

The best way to learn is by making mistakes while the easiest way is to learn from others' mistakes.

I'll probably do this in March/April - giving advice on how to manage the early days in Canada - after making my own mistakes and adding them to the list.

 

[perfectSkilledMigrant]

What Asivad said was excellent, a neutrally realistic view of things.

I am also in the IT field (more into Telecom, NOC2147) and having extreme doubts regarding adapting to Canada especially when it comes to finding a job; however, that bridge is to be crossed when it is reached.

I can also add in a testimony from a friend of mine who moved to Canada 3+ years ago as an IT Manager, which I can summarize as follows:

1- Each person who moved to Canada has his own story, quick success, slow success, struggling, or perhaps even giving up and returning back home. The friend of mine has a few relatives there who had went before him, one was a doctor who was forced to work as a medic, another is working as a taxi driver while a third just gave up and returned home.

2- It is better to be specialised rather than be a "Joker card", he has another friend who just works with Informatica, 10+ years experience and he still finds work (from what I understood he is a freelancer).

3- The friend also struggled to find a job because all demanded Canadian experience (for managerial posts, for technical work, they generally do not care, a Solaris machine functions similarly whether in Canada or the Himalaya mountains !!) and he ended up accepting a job where he does work that he used to do 4-5 years ago. He told me that for managers/supervisors jobs are hard without Canadian experience while for regular technical work, it is easier and the great thing is that you do not really need to become a manager to "advance", when you are called a "Senior Software Engineer" for example, it really makes a difference unlike where I come from, he has a friend there who makes 80$ an hour for 10 years experience with *nix systems .... So it really depends on the person..

4- Finding jobs depends on "Networking" which is a nice way of saying that you most likely need referrals and/or contacts... many if not most of the jobs posted online are already filled through referrals and are only posted because companies are legally obliged or something while there are even lots of jobs that are not listed and filled before a need to rises.

N.B.: What I stated applies to the IT field, I am not sure if it is the same for others...

Most immigrants are initially in the same boat, I was tense about it before and now even more tense with the "crash" of Oil and with it the CAD, but I see Canada as something worth a shot; however, being an extremely rational person I have set up the following "safemode plan" that I intend to follow:

a- Once I get the visa stamped and CoPR, I will purchase a Fongo number (check Play store and Apple store for it) and my friend suggested I use his address and update the latter two into my resume and begin applying for every online posting that I see fit, the reaction that I may or may not get would give me some insight into my possible chances in Canada or perhaps even get lucky and land a job before landing there as the recruiters in IT mostly are open to Skype interviews with a minority that insists on face to face ones (my friend told me that), even if I fail to get something, the interviews experience would be helpful.

b- This point I am still unsure of, I may land for a month and look for a job and if unsuccessful return to my current one or just move fully, I am still uncertain and perhaps the results of point a would push me one way or another.

c- The backup plan is to have enough funds that allow for a year of studies there (the drop of the CAD could prove beneficial for this) while doing any kind of part-time work to cover basic expenses, not only would a Canadian degree/diploma make a person more desirable to employers, but also if one returns to the fact that "Networking" is essential for finding a job in Canada, colleges and universities are one of the best places to build a network of contacts.

d- Remember, everyday you spend in Canada brings you closer to citizenship which will eventually make you more desirable for the world wide job market but even if you travel abroad for work, DO NOT FORGET TO PAY TAX !!

Sorry for the long post and blabbering, but I thought I should share what I know and what my plan is, maybe some can benefit from me or benefit me with advice that could correct my views on this.

Regards,

 

[StAnger]

A bit of humor would do no harm.

Person A: So what do you in summers while in Canada?
Person B: I fish and have plenty of S**

Person A: And in winters?
Person B: I just don't fish.

Jokes aside, I think, beside jobs and all that mumbo jumbo, one needs to look into various aspects of life in general, for instance standards of living, infrastructure, health benefits, future for your kids etc etc.

I have a very respected (atleast thats what I would like to believe ) middle management job in my country. Am I happy with it? Well sorta, but I am not content with it in entirety. I want to keep moving ahead in my life, achieve more, explore new opportunities, have good living standards, own a better car and a good house. Am I ready to work hard for it? Well damn it I am...I am not scared to start at the bottom because I know I will reach at the top (not in a dirty way ), sooner or later. So here's the moral of the story, you will have to work your a&* off prior making it big in North America. Swallow this fact with beer or water, whichever you prefer.

 

[AnnaBG]

I hope you people realize that there is a HUGE difference between stories, people, places they chose to live in, situations ...

I do have a lot of acquaintances, friends and also relatives in Canada.
Each of them found their way into Canadian system differently.

1. My uncle decided not to fight to get a position related to his education (chemistry engineering or something graduaded in moscow) - he immigrated with his family 15 years ago - he started working in a bakery almost immediately, worked few lame jobs for year and half and then started as a building supervisor which he is still working. But his english never got improved to the level he hoped for so he decided to stay in this job and fight to get as high in the hierarchy in this field. He is pretty well set at this moment.
2. My aunt started courses to defend her education - same chemistry engineering/ technology or whatever. It took her 3 years. she started working about 3 or 4 months after they got there, she worked in a chemistry company while she was studing as a simple laboratory clerk. After she got her diploma here she started as a head of quality control lab.
3. Friend - owned a store in here - started working some warehouse job pretty fast while his wife was studying for a teacher (which she was in my country) because he had to support her. Now he is managing some warehouse department (low management position) but still pretty well set.
4. His wife - studies 2 or 3 years to get her education straight. She was babysitting for this time. Now she did became a teacher again. they both started their canadian life at their mid 30s (above 35 for sure).
5. friend - went to Vancouver two years ago to a 2 year working programme or something like that. She said she was looking for a job for 6 months. 6 months!! And even when she applied for receptionist or any other kind of position not requiring too much from you she was not hired. Later she said, after few interviews telling her she was overqualified, she removed her PHD from her resume and found a job and was soon promoted because she indeed is very good at whatever she decided to work, I've known her since we went to USA work and travel programmes together. She applied to EE and is currently waiting for her VISA while her employer who is very satisfied with her work is helping her struggles and waiting for her to get her documents straight to hire her immediately after. She was lucky.

I only wrote you this so my point of view could be proved by real stories.
Everyone's story goes in a different direction - either luck, or more efforts, or more studies - it is up to you to chose it but the main point is if you are persistent you will manage to deal with it.

Now, the bad thing is many people think that when they go to Canada it will be a piece of cake and once they set their feet on the airport they will find a job in a week and start their dream life immediately.
Finding a job is no different in Canada or elsewhere I think .. you still have to prove yourself and have patience just like you did in your own country. Nobody is going to put you somewhere because of good will. And the faster people understand that the better for them.
And another thing is ... just because you were highly qualified in your country does not mean that you are the same in Canada. There might be a need for additional courses. There is nothing wrong in working a lesser job until you find your place. it is still income that you will need in those critical first 2 or 3 years. After all if you could grow in your country and prove yourself why wouldn't you do it in Canada too? The difference is now you are smarter than lets say 5 years ago.

Wish you all guys to find your place.