Ohh Frolic, you just reflect how ignorancy can hurt the humanity.
First of all, you said what you said gets me. Yes, you are right it does get me.
It gets me that you talk and talk with no clue of what's going on, blinded with myths and wrong ideas.
I've known so many illegal immigrants, soo many, you have no clue, not just here in the USA, but also in Mexico, from where I am from by the way, since you were so "interested" to know. I've know illegal immigrants who were in Mexico coming to the USA, and in no way, even when I didn't have any clue how people treat them in the States, NEVER diminished them. I help them when I could, with no intention of getting anything back, with no bragging about it. They are just people, like you, like me who its true, they did broke a law, but not anymore or worse than most of other people I've met (legal ones too).
Im sure there are more than 12 million immigrants, but there are a lot more, there is no exact number but there are calculations between 12 and 20 mill.
Your whole debate just demonstrates the xenophobic way of looking at things, coming for an immigrant, that's really sad.
And what good do illegals bring you asked????
Illegal immigrants sometimes pay more taxes because like you said, they are afraid that they can be caught by immigration for filling a tax return, so sometimes they don't fill one, thus they never get the money back they "deserve" under the tax laws.
Illegals immigrants contribute billions, YES BILLIONS of dollars a year to Social Security and Medicare, and never see a penny back. Hell even we legal immigrants contribute to that and would never see nothing back if we don't live here for at least 10 years, wich there is a lot of us who wont.
Illegal immigrants are not hurting anyone, people complain about them working too hard, because they won't complaint since they don't have papers, but there's nothing than a illegal can do that a legal can't, the legals just won't do it even if their job is on the line. Maybe if americans were bitching less, crying like little babies, and WORKING MORE, they wouldn't have so much problems. But most of them are just lazy ass workers than don't want to do any work. Also most of the illegal workers are people from the country side of Mexico, hard workers used to do hard work, they are "horses" that don't know about cigarrettes breaks, or coffe time, and they don't expect employers to treat them like their girlfriends, because where they come from, they are not treated soft, so it has nothing to do with legal status. Besides, employers doesn't know for sure if their employees are illegals or not, in most of the cases they do know, but not always, and they keep the illegals because they work more and better, it has nothing to do with legal status again. And yeah, they would do the work most americans nor Canadians won't do. ANOTHER THINK YOU SHOULD THANK THEM FOR. Yes, illegals are cheaper labour, but that's because of the employer, not the employees. IF YOU THINK FARMERS CAN PAY WORKERS $20/HR FOR PICKING UP ONIONS, YOU ARE OUT OF YOUR FKNG MIND. THANKS TO THOSE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS YOU CAN KEEP THE INFLATION DOWN. HOW MUCH DO YOU THINK YOU WOULD PAY FOR ONE ORANGE THAT COST $10 TO COLLECT??????
And if they are trated like cheap slaves why wouldn't you sympathize, instead of judging them?? Do you realize people thinking like you it's what contribute to that treatment??
Before you said you wanna know if they commit any crime, do you want them to wear a tatto that says if they have commit a crime too??? All the criminals, or just the illegal mexicans??? And I asked you before, but you never answer, IF YOU KNOW YOU NEIGHBOR ITS A MURDERER WHO WAS CONVICTED AND RELEASED, WHAT WOULD YOU DO???
Illegal immigrants are the core and fuel of the many important industries, without them, those industries will collapse, that's why the goverment hasn't throw them out.
Now, this is how I know how ignorant you are, from all the illegal immigrants you so much hate, 30% yeah, that's right 30% at least are people who overstayed their visas and work permits, so guess what, THEY HAD A BACKGROUND CHECK, THEY HAD MEDICALS, THEY WERE THOUGHT THEY WEREN'T GONNA BE "CRIMINALS", JUST LIKE YOU. So how is a legal immigrant better than a illegal one???.
What do you think about them???
There's one reason why illegal immigrants doesn't have to go to jail like any other serious crime, and its because IT'S NOT A SERIOUS CRIME. And yet people wanna paint it like that because all the hating and racism involved.
I wanna ask you something frolic, you said you were an immigrant in Canada, and you said you'd assume responsabilities like a man, Imagine you come from a thirld world country, and you have a family, let's suppouse you get divorce, and suddenly for some unfortunate situation you are gonna be deported back to your country, where you know if you go, your family doesn't stand a chance, your kids would suffer because they won't have the economic support they need, and you would too, besides, besides your ex-wife won't move back and the kids would stay with her, so you would not be able to see your kids anymore. Can you tell me you wouldn't stay living illegaly???
Another thing most illegal immigrants is not equal to criminals, it upset me how blind in the subject people is. Almost 60% of the illegal are from Mexico, and it's sad for me to say, but Mexico is a criminal paradise. What do I mean by that?? Criminals doesn't need to come to the USA, they stay in Mexico, they have it good there, they can keep doing what they are doing and police won't catch them, Why would they go into a country where they'd have more trouble doing what they do (kidnapping, stealing, etc). They don't need to fly to the USA trying to scape from the police. It's most of the people trying to get away from them the ones who immigrate.
That's why people immigrate right? To give themselves and their families a better life, a better future, or even a better present?? Legals or illegals, the reasons remain alike. Why are you immigrating people???
Also frolic, you said you paid for the speeding tickes you got, that's when you got caught, what about when you were speeding and you didn't got caught, did you went to the police deparment saying: "Hey officer, I was speeding, I'm here to get my ticket" ???? I don't think so right? So you are breaking the law too, putting the life of other people and yourself in danger. I don't know how its in Canada, but in the USA if you get too many tickets, you could get your license suspended. So if you are speeding or driving agreesively too many times, you should get your license suspended, and I'm sure at this point, 90% in here should have it suspended it already, so we are all breaking a serious law in theory. Like in theory you said an illegal immigrant cost more than a legal resident with all the cost of Investigation, enforcement , detention, deportation and hearings and more. But if they don't get caught, then they are not costing money on detention, deportation and herings right?? So it's just investigation and enforcement, wich they still have to keep to avoid the legal residents become illegal residents. It's like saying if all people didn't commit crimes we could get rid of the police corps wich by the way have a lot more funding than immigration agencies. So what you said that the illegals immigrant costing more because the immigration enforcement, and that immigration officer would not be lay off and would be moved to another department its just irreal, and with all respect, stupid, . Haven't you seen the current situation in the world??? If they don't need so many people patrolling THEY WOULD GET RID OF THEM. Not just that, some of those people doesn't have the skills or will to do other jobs. How in the world would you even suggest that??? How can you come with that conclusion???? Besides you still need patrolling of the border to avoid narcotrafic and smuggling merchandise and weapons. So americans and canadians need to pay with their taxes for that wether there is illegal immigration or not. So again this point its just stupid.
I don't know why americans worry so much about paying taxes (if there were any, there would be minimal) for deporting illegal immigrants and yet they agree, and support on a war that has cost them so much money, and contribute to the country broken economy, for the "freedom" of a country that is half way across the world. It seem like they should start giving "freedom" to the people in their own soil don't you think?, but rather yet some of they judge them, they treat them worst than the baddest criminals on the community. I called this DOUBLE MORALITY.
Illegals aren't saints, "nor the cure for humanity" neither, there are downsides of illegal immigration, like overpopulation, an innacuracy on census and stadistics, they could contribute to a country increase on birth mortality and lesser the life expectancy, some crimes being not punished, that there's people who could get in that way who you REALLY don't want to let in. But that doesn't mean you should hold the majority responsible. You said you wanna clear house, and to send back all those people with no papers, well why don't we ask anybody in this forum who doesn't look american nor canadian, if they'd like to be stopped every 5 minutes on the streets to be asked for their immigration papers, or even better, lets make them wear a bracelet that says, "IM LEGAL".
Ohh, I know, "I have an idea too, after we deport all the illegal immigrants" let's find what race commits the most crime, and lets put them all in jail before they commit any crime, that way we would be saving thousands of lives, and reducing criminality to zero. Ohh wait, I think they have done similar things in the past haven't they?? Maybe the Nazis, or the KKK??? It's that the path you wanna follow??.
