Express Entry / FSW: Need advice

[Haileytran1607]

I am a new member of this group and am currently navigating through the complex system of Canadian Immigration. I would like to get your advice regarding my situation and which option would be best for me. Thank you in advance! I am currently a Permanent resident in the U.S (Vietnam is my citizenship right now) and I am planning to start the process at the end of 2021. Assuming I will submit my application on 12/2021 under Express Entry, Federal Skilled Workers, some of my credentials:

• Bachelor’s or Arts in Law and Justice

• Associate of Arts in Communication Studies

• Over 1 year of continuous work experience as Legal Assistant (02/2020 - 12/2021). I did work as a legal assistant prior to this job for 5 months (08/2019 - 01/2020) and have a gap of 5 days in between 2 jobs (same NOC code), can I still count this?

• IELTS 8.5 band (all 8.5 in 4 sections)

• Funding of $25,000 USD

• Age of 22 years old.

• Unfortunately, I have no relatives in Canada and have never been there.

• My employer is opening a Canadian entity in BC and if they successfully open, I will for sure receive a job offer. However, they’re in the early process so I cannot count on this yet. So I assume that I will not have a job offer.

My CRS score is 416; my Express Entry is 68 points, so not great at all! I am wondering what I should do to increase my chance. My questions are:

1) What PNP should I consider? I am thinking Alberta (low CRS), Nova Scotia (in-demand for NOC 4211), or BC PNP (I might get my job offer from my employer in BC)

2) Should I consider doing my Master in Canada for 1 year? Would that help boost my chance of getting PR?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thank you so much!

 

[primaprime]

A master's could be the most straightforward route. Provincial nominations are far from guaranteed and it's not always as simple as theoretically having a job offer or an in-demand NOC. They're competitive and have many additional requirements.

You can count all foreign work experience as long as at least one year is continuous and in the same NOC. So it sounds like you may have two years of work experience. Your CRS score should increase by 25 points after you get three years of foreign work experience. I would advise you stay in the US to do that, not least because you already have a green card, and so should ideally want to naturalize as a US citizen to give yourself the most options in life. You're young and so you could afford to wait a bit.

You could also consider studying French. If you get up to the B2 (upper intermediate level) your CRS score will increase by 42 points, meaning you can be a competitive applicant without a master's or provincial nomination.

 

[Haileytran1607]

A master's could be the most straightforward route. Provincial nominations are far from guaranteed and it's not always as simple as theoretically having a job offer or an in-demand NOC. They're competitive and have many additional requirements.

You can count all foreign work experience as long as at least one year is continuous and in the same NOC. So it sounds like you may have two years of work experience. Your CRS score should increase by 25 points after you get three years of foreign work experience. I would advise you stay in the US to do that, not least because you already have a green card, and so should ideally want to naturalize as a US citizen to give yourself the most options in life. You're young and so you could afford to wait a bit.

You could also consider studying French. If you get up to the B2 (upper intermediate level) your CRS score will increase by 42 points, meaning you can be a competitive applicant without a master's or provincial nomination.

Thank you so much for your advice! My main issue is that I only have a 2 year Green Card in the U.S and I have to renew on 04/2021, which would give me at least until 10/2022 for my stay. I am in a complicated situation for 10 year green card, and I might not get approved, which is also another reason that I prefer Canada.

So for my job experience, I have worked as a Legal Assistant from 08/2019 to 01/2020 then quit that job and started working on my current job from 02/2020 till now (will continue toward 2 years/more). Can I count both job positions (even with a gap) or just count my current job?

Also, any advice on getting a study permit while being in the Express Entry Pool? Would that count against me as "dual intent"?

 

[mknox]

Some thoughts from a Canadian master's degree holder who has just applied for PR:
1. Your points seem to be 449 to me. You should select "two of more degrees" since you have an associate as well, not one. I assume the AA is separate and not stacked into your BA? And I am assuming you are single? That makes it 449.
2. You are very young. This means you have loads of time to increase your score. I suggest you use the time to get a Canadian qualification that will increase your points.
4. I might be wrong but I don't believe 5 months of work at your other job helps very much because it does not take you to 2 years of work. Much more importantly, if you use the calculator to check, you'll see that even if you had had 2 full years, there is no difference in points between 1 year and 2 years. I would just claim points the 1 year and put the 5 months work experience in the personal history section. Keep it simple, less documentation.
4. I am not sure about dual intent, but I don't think it will be a problem to have an EE profile while applying for a study permit. I doubt it means very much until you get an ITA and have a PR application in processing at the same as having a study permit application in processing. You will not get an ITA through FSW at score of 449. You might get an ITA based on PNP, but it's still quite uncertain and shouldn't stop you from applying for a study program here.

If I were you, I would not worry too much about an EE profile if I am sure that I want to study because I know I am young enough to wait a couple of years. So I would look into enrolling for a program here to increase my points.

That being said, keep in mind some things as a study permit applicant:
1. There are relatively fewer 1-year master's programs here, most are for 2 years. Choose carefully. Remember that getting into grad school is not always easy. Unless you love research, be careful not to choose a thesis-based program. Professional master's, i.e., non-thesis based might be easier to get into. If you have a strong GPA, that's good though and you can choose whatever you like. There is usually some form of funding available for thesis-based master's, but rarely for professional master's.
2. Choose based on the province you a) want to ultimately settle in, b) have future job prospects in depending on the province's labour needs, c) has good PNP or other types of international graduate immigration programs that suit your profile after you have gained that particular degree you went to school here for.
3. Consider the cost of the master's against the cost of living that you will need to demonstrate financial capacity for when you apply for a study permit.
4. Applying for a master's program for the Sept 2021 intake means the deadlines are December 2020–Jan 2021. You have to start researching and contacting departments now.

 

[Haileytran1607]

Some thoughts from a Canadian master's degree holder who has just applied for PR:
1. Your points seem to be 449 to me. You should select "two of more degrees" since you have an associate as well, not one. I assume the AA is separate and not stacked into your BA? And I am assuming you are single? That makes it 449.
2. You are very young. This means you have loads of time to increase your score. I suggest you use the time to get a Canadian qualification that will increase your points.
4. I might be wrong but I don't believe 5 months of work at your other job helps very much because it does not take you to 2 years of work. Much more importantly, if you use the calculator to check, you'll see that even if you had had 2 full years, there is no difference in points between 1 year and 2 years. I would just claim points the 1 year and put the 5 months work experience in the personal history section. Keep it simple, less documentation.
4. I am not sure about dual intent, but I don't think it will be a problem to have an EE profile while applying for a study permit. I doubt it means very much until you get an ITA and have a PR application in processing at the same as having a study permit application in processing. You will not get an ITA through FSW at score of 449. You might get an ITA based on PNP, but it's still quite uncertain and shouldn't stop you from applying for a study program here.

If I were you, I would not worry too much about an EE profile if I am sure that I want to study because I know I am young enough to wait a couple of years. So I would look into enrolling for a program here to increase my points.

That being said, keep in mind some things as a study permit applicant:
1. There are relatively fewer 1-year master's programs here, most are for 2 years. Choose carefully. Remember that getting into grad school is not always easy. Unless you love research, be careful not to choose a thesis-based program. Professional master's, i.e., non-thesis based might be easier to get into. If you have a strong GPA, that's good though and you can choose whatever you like. There is usually some form of funding available for thesis-based master's, but rarely for professional master's.
2. Choose based on the province you a) want to ultimately settle in, b) have future job prospects in depending on the province's labour needs, c) has good PNP or other types of international graduate immigration programs that suit your profile after you have gained that particular degree you went to school here for.
3. Consider the cost of the master's against the cost of living that you will need to demonstrate financial capacity for when you apply for a study permit.
4. Applying for a master's program for the Sept 2021 intake means the deadlines are December 2020–Jan 2021. You have to start researching and contacting departments now.

Hello,

Thanks so much for the detailed advice. I did not really think about the 2 degrees I have because I was considering my highest one. Just want to note that I am planning to apply around 02/2022, and I am currently looking at UBC LLM research-based program.

To further explain my degree, I have an Associate degree (2 years) through a Community College in the U.S. I then complete another 2 years at a University and achieve my Bachelor's Degree (still count as 4 years). Does that mean they stack? Or can you explain what you mean by "stacking".
I want to ask, do you know how hard it is for an employer to get LMIA positive? My current job right now is very open to getting an LMIA and job offer for me, but they have never done it before. How does one approach/discuss this? It would cost the company money and efforts?

 

[mknox]

Hello,

Thanks so much for the detailed advice. I did not really think about the 2 degrees I have because I was considering my highest one. Just want to note that I am planning to apply around 02/2022, and I am currently looking at UBC LLM research-based program.

To further explain my degree, I have an Associate degree (2 years) through a Community College in the U.S. I then complete another 2 years at a University and achieve my Bachelor's Degree (still count as 4 years). Does that mean they stack? Or can you explain what you mean by "stacking".
I want to ask, do you know how hard it is for an employer to get LMIA positive? My current job right now is very open to getting an LMIA and job offer for me, but they have never done it before. How does one approach/discuss this? It would cost the company money and efforts?

- Ah yes, then that means they stack. Sorry, then you count only the bachelor's. I thought they were separate because the fields are somewhat different. 416 then. Although if you were to study in Canada, none of them would matter except the highest qualification, which would then be a master's.

- UBC is great, but tough to get into. If you can do it, by all means apply. Keep an eye on the tuition though—and remember that Vancouver is mad expensive to live in. Research-based LLM may have some funding involved, not sure. You do need a good GPA and academic references. I trust that you can arrange for all of that. Regardless of which intake you want to apply for, remember that the law school of a university often has separate deadlines—typically a year in advance of the date of program commencement.

- I'll be honest, LMIAs are tough to get. I've been an international student here for 5 years (master's first, currently a PhD student) and have many friends who are international students, now graduated. Ease of obtaining an LMIA depends a lot on the field but most employers do not want to do it. You will see LMIA-based jobs more often for low wage jobs, not for the skilled labour jobs, unless you are an exceptionally desirable candidate. This is why there are scores and scores of master's degree graduates who don't work in the field they graduated from but take up jobs as retail supervisors and gas station managers—because those are the jobs that come with LMIAs more often. From what I have understood, an LMIA requires the employer to sort of declare that they couldn't find a Canadian candidate for the job. Of course, there are ways to do this if they really want to, but the point is that they usually do not want to. It is too much bother when they can easily get a Canadian candidate. However, most of my friends who have not gone into further study after a master's, have not worried too much about the LMIA. This is because you will have enough points at the end of a Canadian master's to get picked up in an FSW draw (like me). If you are young, you will absolutely have no problems getting an ITA after a degree here, because you get more points for age than someone like me does. Your points would be approx 486 after a master's—with no need for LMIA or even a job, for that matter.. Furthermore, you get a PGWP after your studies, which means you can work here for a year and also qualify for CEC. Finally, if nothing else, you can almost always get nominated under your province's graduate stream (aimed at international graduates who have studied in that province). So you may not really need an LMIA.

- If you have a good employer who is supportive, likes your work, is possibly expanding to Canada, think about whether you would want to let them go in these uncertain times. If they do manage to open in Canada, and if you do actually end up needing an LMIA (regardless of whether or not you study here), it will be far easier to do so via a company that knows you, your work, and is already willing.

 

[Haileytran1607]

- Ah yes, then that means they stack. Sorry, then you count only the bachelor's. I thought they were separate because the fields are somewhat different. 416 then. Although if you were to study in Canada, none of them would matter except the highest qualification, which would then be a master's.

- UBC is great, but tough to get into. If you can do it, by all means apply. Keep an eye on the tuition though—and remember that Vancouver is mad expensive to live in. Research-based LLM may have some funding involved, not sure. You do need a good GPA and academic references. I trust that you can arrange for all of that. Regardless of which intake you want to apply for, remember that the law school of a university often has separate deadlines—typically a year in advance of the date of program commencement.

- I'll be honest, LMIAs are tough to get. I've been an international student here for 5 years (master's first, currently a PhD student) and have many friends who are international students, now graduated. Ease of obtaining an LMIA depends a lot on the field but most employers do not want to do it. You will see LMIA-based jobs more often for low wage jobs, not for the skilled labour jobs, unless you are an exceptionally desirable candidate. This is why there are scores and scores of master's degree graduates who don't work in the field they graduated from but take up jobs as retail supervisors and gas station managers—because those are the jobs that come with LMIAs more often. From what I have understood, an LMIA requires the employer to sort of declare that they couldn't find a Canadian candidate for the job. Of course, there are ways to do this if they really want to, but the point is that they usually do not want to. It is too much bother when they can easily get a Canadian candidate. However, most of my friends who have not gone into further study after a master's, have not worried too much about the LMIA. This is because you will have enough points at the end of a Canadian master's to get picked up in an FSW draw (like me). If you are young, you will absolutely have no problems getting an ITA after a degree here, because you get more points for age than someone like me does. Your points would be approx 486 after a master's—with no need for LMIA or even a job, for that matter.. Furthermore, you get a PGWP after your studies, which means you can work here for a year and also qualify for CEC. Finally, if nothing else, you can almost always get nominated under your province's graduate stream (aimed at international graduates who have studied in that province). So you may not really need an LMIA.

- If you have a good employer who is supportive, likes your work, is possibly expanding to Canada, think about whether you would want to let them go in these uncertain times. If they do manage to open in Canada, and if you do actually end up needing an LMIA (regardless of whether or not you study here), it will be far easier to do so via a company that knows you, your work, and is already willing.

OMG Thank you so so much for all the details! I really appreciate it. As I want to apply to UBC and my job will be in BC, I think it might be the province that I want to stay at. However, I read that BC only want Master degree in science fields, which do not include my field (law).

"You must have graduated in the last three years with a master's or doctorate (PhD) degree in the natural, applied or health sciences:

• agriculture
• biological and biomedical sciences
• computer and information sciences and support services
• engineering
• engineering technology
• health professions and related clinical sciences
• mathematics and statistics
• natural resources conservation and research
• physical sciences"

Can I have your advice - is this correct at all? Should I look at another province? Thank you!

 

[mknox]

OMG Thank you so so much for all the details! I really appreciate it. As I want to apply to UBC and my job will be in BC, I think it might be the province that I want to stay at. However, I read that BC only want Master degree in science fields, which do not include my field (law).

"You must have graduated in the last three years with a master's or doctorate (PhD) degree in the natural, applied or health sciences:

• agriculture
• biological and biomedical sciences
• computer and information sciences and support services
• engineering
• engineering technology
• health professions and related clinical sciences
• mathematics and statistics
• natural resources conservation and research
• physical sciences"

Can I have your advice - is this correct at all? Should I look at another province? Thank you!

This is correct so far for their graduate-specific stream, although they may or may not have other streams open up in future. Also, I believe all of this is irrelevant if you do have an employer who does end up giving you an LMIA, whether it is your current company that does this for you later or some other company. Keep in mind that you will STILL get points for your Canadian master's degree regardless of what BC wants to do for its PNP streams. You will always, always get points for Canadian education of any kind when you compute your CRS score for federal immigration. So no, I would not necessarily look at other provinces only due to the above BC priority list. Because other factors outweigh this particular factor. The outweighing factors are: 1) Your company may move there (provided this is realistically happening) and help you network and / or employ you there again, 2) BC is lovely to live in and people do find jobs there in legal professions, 3) You can always move elsewhere for a job after you graduate, 4) You will STILL be young and have enough FSW points without needing BC's support at the end of a degree, 5) UBC, if you do get in, is one of the very best.

Since the decision to go to UBC does not in any way harm your prospects, the only reasons to look at other universities are these: 1) Cost of living in Vancouver is very, very, very high as is 2 years of tuition fee, 2) Even if you are very good, getting into the Top 5 Canadian universities is always hard, so you should apply to at least three or four schools across the country to maximise your chances and give yourself the benefit of choosing between them when the offers come in.

 

[Haileytran1607]

This is correct so far for their graduate-specific stream, although they may or may not have other streams open up in future. Also, I believe all of this is irrelevant if you do have an employer who does end up giving you an LMIA, whether it is your current company that does this for you later or some other company. Keep in mind that you will STILL get points for your Canadian master's degree regardless of what BC wants to do for its PNP streams. You will always, always get points for Canadian education of any kind when you compute your CRS score for federal immigration. So no, I would not necessarily look at other provinces only due to the above BC priority list. Because other factors outweigh this particular factor. The outweighing factors are: 1) Your company may move there (provided this is realistically happening) and help you network and / or employ you there again, 2) BC is lovely to live in and people do find jobs there in legal professions, 3) You can always move elsewhere for a job after you graduate, 4) You will STILL be young and have enough FSW points without needing BC's support at the end of a degree, 5) UBC, if you do get in, is one of the very best.

Since the decision to go to UBC does not in any way harm your prospects, the only reasons to look at other universities are these: 1) Cost of living in Vancouver is very, very, very high as is 2 years of tuition fee, 2) Even if you are very good, getting into the Top 5 Canadian universities is always hard, so you should apply to at least three or four schools across the country to maximise your chances and give yourself the benefit of choosing between them when the offers come in.

Thank you so much! This makes me want to consider another option - Paralegal certificate. It will still be 1 year, so can I still get a 1 year PGWP?
Also, since I will have my BA and that certificate, it will still boost my score for education/potential employment in Canada right?

thanks so so much for your answer!

 

[scylla]

Thank you so much! This makes me want to consider another option - Paralegal certificate. It will still be 1 year, so can I still get a 1 year PGWP?
Also, since I will have my BA and that certificate, it will still boost my score for education/potential employment in Canada right?

thanks so so much for your answer!

You will qualify for a 1 year PGWP. However this is a pretty risky plan if your objecitve is to get PR.

You want to take at least a 2 year program in Canada so that you qualify for a 3 year PGWP. With only a 1 year PGWP, there is no guarantee that you will be able to secure the right kind of job and get 1 year of work experience in Canada to boost your score. Many with only a 1 year PGWP struggle to get enough points for PR. It's a bad plan. Take a 2 year program.

You also want to make sure that the program you take in Canada makes sense in light of your previous work experience and education. If not, you are at risk of the study permit being refused since Canada will say that your planned studies in Canada do not make sense. Since you already have a bachelor degree, then you would want to make sure that you are taking at least a post graduate diploma in Canada (not a regular diploma). A master's would be preferable.

 

[mknox]

I am not sure which paralegal certificate this is—not all are created equal. I will second what scylla has said. You need to ensure that the program you choose 1) shows a natural progression in light of prior education and work experience AND 2) is a higher qualification than your current highest qualification. Both of these criteria, if not satisfied, can form grounds for rejection of a study permit.

And while you may choose a 1-year program for reasons such as how much you can afford (tuition and living costs), you should choose the longer duration for the reason scylla brings up. People often think it is easy to get a job in 1 year, whereas in reality, it is often too short a time period within which to find a good job, and then find a realistic way to extend your stay after that 1 year is over. What if you have not been able to find any job, or you have found a job, but not an LMIA-based one in that 1-year period? How would you extend your stay then after that? A 2-year course, on the other hand, will provide you with a 3-year PGWP to sort all this out much better. In that scenario, you finish your master's degree, immediately apply for your PR right away with a new 486 score if it is still above cut-off, continue your job search, work while waiting for your PR to be processed. You can still remain in Canada that way while also collecting Canadian work experience—useful, if by chance the cut-off goes above 486, or whatever else happens.

Long story short, if you can afford it and can get accepted, take the 2-year master's.