Entry with valid PR card but less the two years in canada/advice please

[hushraj]

Hi Guys and experienced members (Leon, Msafiri and other senior members)

need advice please.

I became PR on 2nd june 2010, have PR card along with my wife which is valid till July 2015. I landed on 2nd June and came back to UK after 10days, now planning to go back in December 2013 as I have been offered a full time permanent post. I was unable to go early as wife had been poorly, I would really appreciate your advice on following questions,

1. If I go in December I will have have one and half year left so I will not meet residency obligations. Shall I go by air or land route is relatively safer?

2. Would it be better to give up PR and ask employer to get work permit (not keen as it gives least flexibility and I will have to apply for PR again, you never know, rules keep changing)

3. My wife has chosen to have my surname and her PR card is with her original surname, we had indian passport when we took PR but we have now got British passport which has got her new surname, would this be a problem? although she has her old passport with her original details.

4. My biggest worry, we have a child less than one year old British citizen with British passport, I did not have a child when we got PR, so what will be her status if we are able to enter? (we are currently living in UK, wife had three miscarriages and she was admitted before we had baby, which is the main reason we could not leave UK early)

I am very keen to do this new job and settle in Canada.please advice, many thanks

 

[Leon]

You should try your luck with the PR. If the immigration officer talks to you about not meeting the residency requirements, say that you had medical reasons and can prove it. If they report you on entry, you will have to prove it and hope they feel that was a good enough reason not to return sooner. If they don't report you, you have the option of putting your PR status back in good standing by staying in Canada for 2 years straight and only then apply to renew your PR card.

However, your problem with the non-PR child is that your child can only stay in Canada as a visitor for 6 months and may not be granted health care. Ideally, you would have to sponsor your child for PR. However, since you do not meet the residency obligation yourself, you risk that if you try to sponsor your child right away, you will bring immigrations attention to that fact and that they will start investigating your PR status so even if you get into Canada without being reported, you will get caught when you try to sponsor.

It's a bit of a dilemma. Either you wait to sponsor your child until you meet the residency obligation after two years or you apply right away and risk your PR. If you decide to apply right away, I would suggest that you wait a few months until you are already a bit more settled in Canada. Then have your wife sponsor the child instead of doing it yourself. If they decide to investigate her PR status, she will show up with her medical documents to explain why she did not return to Canada sooner.

 

[hushraj]

Thank you very much Leon for your reply and a very helpful advice.

What do you think of 2nd option, giving up PR and asking new employer to get a work permit. I am not sure if this would be a wise thing to do at all?

Secondly, my rest of family including parents live in India so it would be difficult to not to leave Canada at all for two years particularly if there are any emergencies in India like parents illness etc

You should try your luck with the PR. If the immigration officer talks to you about not meeting the residency requirements, say that you had medical reasons and can prove it. If they report you on entry, you will have to prove it and hope they feel that was a good enough reason not to return sooner. If they don't report you, you have the option of putting your PR status back in good standing by staying in Canada for 2 years straight and only then apply to renew your PR card.

However, your problem with the non-PR child is that your child can only stay in Canada as a visitor for 6 months and may not be granted health care. Ideally, you would have to sponsor your child for PR. However, since you do not meet the residency obligation yourself, you risk that if you try to sponsor your child right away, you will bring immigrations attention to that fact and that they will start investigating your PR status so even if you get into Canada without being reported, you will get caught when you try to sponsor.

It's a bit of a dilemma. Either you wait to sponsor your child until you meet the residency obligation after two years or you apply right away and risk your PR. If you decide to apply right away, I would suggest that you wait a few months until you are already a bit more settled in Canada. Then have your wife sponsor the child instead of doing it yourself. If they decide to investigate her PR status, she will show up with her medical documents to explain why she did not return to Canada sooner.

 

[Leon]

Thank you very much Leon for your reply and a very helpful advice.

What do you think of 2nd option, giving up PR and asking new employer to get a work permit. I am not sure if this would be a wise thing to do at all?

Secondly, my rest of family including parents live in India so it would be difficult to not to leave Canada at all for two years particularly if there are any emergencies in India like parents illness etc

I don't think you should give up your PR just yet. You can follow my advise and see how things play out. If you give up your PR right away, there is no guarantee that the employer is willing to apply for an LMO for you or even that he is, if he will get one and even if he gets one that you will then be granted a work permit.

If you want to keep your PR, you need to commit to staying in Canada for two years. These difficulties are the price you pay for not meeting the RO. If you had met the RO, you wouldn't have a problem right now.

 

[hushraj]

I don't think you should give up your PR just yet. You can follow my advise and see how things play out. If you give up your PR right away, there is no guarantee that the employer is willing to apply for an LMO for you or even that he is, if he will get one and even if he gets one that you will then be granted a work permit.

If you want to keep your PR, you need to commit to staying in Canada for two years. These difficulties are the price you pay for not meeting the RO. If you had met the RO, you wouldn't have a problem right now.

Thanks a lot Leon you are a star,

I guess its certainly a better option to keep PR.You are right I am and I will have to pay the price for not meeting RO. However I did not have choice, except leaving my partner to struggle with all her health issues which had been ongoing until we had the baby. One could argue that Canada should have same health care standards if not better than UK however travelling and settling in a new country with repeated miscarriages and hospital admissions, and multiple investigations is certainly not a good idea.

Your advice is very useful, I will surely try my luck if it does not work we will come back and settle in the UK instead. please do keep me posted if you have any other advise as my knowledge is very limited on these issues.

I must say its great having you on this forum, I feel a lot more reassured, rest is my family's luck...

 

[hushraj]

I don't think you should give up your PR just yet. You can follow my advise and see how things play out. If you give up your PR right away, there is no guarantee that the employer is willing to apply for an LMO for you or even that he is, if he will get one and even if he gets one that you will then be granted a work permit.

If you want to keep your PR, you need to commit to staying in Canada for two years. These difficulties are the price you pay for not meeting the RO. If you had met the RO, you wouldn't have a problem right now.

Hi Leon,

My mind has been wondering, just wanted your opinion on the following option to deal with my current situation,

1. I will ask my employer to get work permit for me, they may so yes or no. if they are ready to take work permit, I give up my PR and apply for work permit (after they get LMO) if I get refusal for work permit in UK after LMO then its my luck.

2. I believe my child can accompany me if I get work permit?

3. My wife will continue to remain on PR

4. we will enter Canada with my work permit, my child dependent on me and my wife on PR card

5. For my wife, we will go ahead with plan as suggested by yourself (if she enters, she can then remain in Canada for two years without any travel and apply for extension, if she is reported then she will appeal on humanitarian/medical grounds. if she is successful then fine, she can remain there for two years and sponsor me after that on her PR, if rejected then I can sponsor her on the basis of my work permit)

I understand that I cant apply for work permit while I am PR ? what do you think about this plan and have I got it all very wrong, please help and advise, thanks

 

[Leon]

If that is what you want to do, then sure you can but your plan is completely based on you getting the work permit or not and that is something you can't know.

 

[hushraj]

If that is what you want to do, then sure you can but your plan is completely based on you getting the work permit or not and that is something you can't know.

Thanks Leon,

The reason I am choosing this option is because I am worried that if I have to come to UK or India even once in the two year period (if I am allowed for the first time) I will end up in the same or possibly a difficult situation.

What I was not sure was if this plan is workable if I happen to get work permit. I am not experienced and I dont have much idea about rules etc. I am not sure how immigration officer will behave if I have a work permit and my partner has a PR, do they check? by the way I was the Principal applicant,

other issues are we had indian passport when we became PR, so PR card still has same information on nationality etc and my wife's surname has changed would that be an issue (although she has old indian passport with her original surname), I mean UK passport has her new surname and her PR card has old surname? Thanks a lot for the help.

 

[Leon]

If your wife has two passports and one PR card and one passport shows her married name, I think she will be believed when she explains that. It is quite possible if you give up your PR based on not meeting the residency requirements and then apply for a work permit stating that you have a PR spouse that they will look into your wife's PR status as well. Even if they don't, in case your family has an emergency, you plan to leave but you plan for your wife to stay for the full 2 years? What if her family has an emergency?

In order to get a work permit, the employer needs to prove that they have advertised the job and that they found no qualified Canadians or PR's who wanted the job as well as they are paying market wages for the job. They will have to prove that you are qualified for the job. In order to be seen as qualified for the job, I assume you need some education and some work experience.

 

[hushraj]

If your wife has two passports and one PR card and one passport shows her married name, I think she will be believed when she explains that. It is quite possible if you give up your PR based on not meeting the residency requirements and then apply for a work permit stating that you have a PR spouse that they will look into your wife's PR status as well. Even if they don't, in case your family has an emergency, you plan to leave but you plan for your wife to stay for the full 2 years? What if her family has an emergency?

In order to get a work permit, the employer needs to prove that they have advertised the job and that they found no qualified Canadians or PR's who wanted the job as well as they are paying market wages for the job. They will have to prove that you are qualified for the job. In order to be seen as qualified for the job, I assume you need some education and some work experience.

Hi Leon,

Wife has most of her family including parents in Canada/USA, so less likely to travel out of Canada. I have my family in India, property in UK so I am more likely to travel in two years.

You are right I may not get work permit but I will try and discuss with employer this week and see what they say. The issue is if we all go on our PR cards without meeting RO, as u said I cant sponsor my child and eventually we will have to sponsor him, we cant be without his health card for two years so I guess I dont have a reasonable option, if employer is in agreement of work permit its fine otherwise I just have to forget Canada.
IS There a forum where I can check what sort of humanitarian ground they consider, is repeated miscarriage with ongoing intermittent hospital admissions and treatment a reasonable reason for not meeting RO? I know it might be difficult but have u heard of people getting having successful appeal for such reasons?

Is there any chance I can explain my case to canadian embassy in UK? I guess I cant apply travel document as I have valid PR card? Thanks a lot.

 

[Leon]

There is nothing you can do to explain your case or ask for any travel document at this point because your PR cards are still valid. However, if it makes you feel better, you can report yourself on entry to Canada as not meeting the residency requirements and appeal for your PR. However, as per recent post from a person who was reported on entry, they have now been waiting 2 years for their appeal hearing. They were allowed to renew their PR cards for a period of 1 year. They had medical reasons of taking care of sick parents.

I think my idea of you slipping in unnoticed if you can and then for your wife to sponsor your child is a good idea. If she is called for an interview about her PR status, she can bring her medical records and see what happens. As for your child, depending on the province he may be able to get health care based on being your dependent and based on you being in the process of sponsoring him. If immigration keeps you waiting on the sponsorship, there is a possibility that you can apply for a TRP for him, a visa allowing him to stay temporarily based on H&C grounds and then he would be eligible for health care.

In the meantime, you would stay and work and in case you must leave because of an emergency in the next 2 years, you could return on your PR card if still valid or if not, on your UK passport and expired PR card. If you get reported on entry, you would claim your medical grounds and appeal.

 

[hushraj]

There is nothing you can do to explain your case or ask for any travel document at this point because your PR cards are still valid. However, if it makes you feel better, you can report yourself on entry to Canada as not meeting the residency requirements and appeal for your PR. However, as per recent post from a person who was reported on entry, they have now been waiting 2 years for their appeal hearing. They were allowed to renew their PR cards for a period of 1 year. They had medical reasons of taking care of sick parents.

I think my idea of you slipping in unnoticed if you can and then for your wife to sponsor your child is a good idea. If she is called for an interview about her PR status, she can bring her medical records and see what happens. As for your child, depending on the province he may be able to get health care based on being your dependent and based on you being in the process of sponsoring him. If immigration keeps you waiting on the sponsorship, there is a possibility that you can apply for a TRP for him, a visa allowing him to stay temporarily based on H&C grounds and then he would be eligible for health care.

In the meantime, you would stay and work and in case you must leave because of an emergency in the next 2 years, you could return on your PR card if still valid or if not, on your UK passport and expired PR card. If you get reported on entry, you would claim your medical grounds and appeal.

Hi Leon

Thanks for very helpful advice. I shall think over it once again and I will update you, in the meantime if you hear something (from another members experience) that you believe is important/or might be related to my case, kindly kindly do let me know. I am getting my head around with this complicated situation of mine.

 

[hushraj]

Hi Leon

Thanks for very helpful advice. I shall think over it once again and I will update you, in the meantime if you hear something (from another members experience) that you believe is important/or might be related to my case, kindly kindly do let me know. I am getting my head around with this complicated situation of mine.

 

[vijay31077]

Hi mate.. I have seen your pm to me regarding entering canada woth expired pr card. No i did not choose to go back to canada as i got well paid job in uk.so i can notnhelp you further in this matter.but good luck to you.

 

[hushraj]

Thanks Vijay,

I have decided to try my luck and Leon has given me fair bit of idea in terms of what to expect,rest is my luck