+1(514) 937-9445 or Toll-free (Canada & US) +1 (888) 947-9445

EE PR Application Refused - What's next?

Tnopip

Member
Jun 15, 2015
19
0
Category........
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
AOR Received.
21-03-2016
Med's Done....
15-03-2016
Hi everyone,

Here is my timeline:

Applied for BCPNP in February 2015
BCPNP Approved - May 2015
ITA for PR received - May 2015
Application for CEC PR submitted - July 3rd 2015
Medical Exam passed - End of July 2015
Application Refused - October 7th 2015


So, after over 2 months of complete silence, I finally received an email this morning, and it did not bring good news...

The reasons for the refusal are:

- Not enough working experience over the last 3 years
- The duties listed in the letter of reference are not consistent with the actions in the lead statement under the NOC.


I can understand the letter of reference not matching 100% the NOC description, but I do have the 12 minimum months required during the last 3 years to apply. As per July 3rd (Application date), I had 9 months work experience in my current job (now 13 months), and over 5 months at my previous job.

Is there any way that I can appeal this decision and explain this to CIC? Or do I have to give up with the idea to reopen this application, and start fresh?
 

anujgupta84

Hero Member
Sep 12, 2014
612
57
I am really sorry to learn about your application. Was the experience in two companies under the same NOC?
 

jes_ON

VIP Member
Jun 22, 2009
12,092
1,422
Category........
Visa Office......
New York
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
06-May-2010
AOR Received.
13-Aug-2010
File Transfer...
01-Mar-2011
Passport Req..
30-Jun-2011
VISA ISSUED...
12-Jul-2011 (received 25-Jul-2011)
LANDED..........
03-Sep-2011
Tnopip said:
The reasons for the refusal are:

- Not enough working experience over the last 3 years
- The duties listed in the letter of reference are not consistent with the actions in the lead statement under the NOC.


I can understand the letter of reference not matching 100% the NOC description, but I do have the 12 minimum months required during the last 3 years to apply. As per July 3rd (Application date), I had 9 months work experience in my current job (now 13 months), and over 5 months at my previous job.
So sorry to hear this, but need more information.

- Were both jobs full-time (at least 30 hours per week), and the experience completed no earlier than February 2012 (within 3 years of the application date?)

- What were the NOCs of the 2 jobs?
 

Tnopip

Member
Jun 15, 2015
19
0
Category........
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
AOR Received.
21-03-2016
Med's Done....
15-03-2016
Hi, thanks for the answers.

The jobs were in two different companies, but same NOC (1123), different titles.

And yes, all the work experience was after February 2012; and both were full-time.
 

Phil89

Champion Member
Sep 11, 2014
1,175
21
Tnopip said:
Hi, thanks for the answers.

The jobs were in two different companies, but same NOC (1123), different titles.

And yes, all the work experience was after February 2012; and both were full-time.
Without seeing the actual refusal letter, this is just guessing. Post the letter here!
I wonder how the province nominated you if you were ineligible. Have you submitted the same kinda documents?
 

Reginald

Hero Member
Jun 29, 2015
257
7
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
Doc's Request.
SCH A Oct 20
AOR Received.
Sep 24
I'm really sorry to hear about your application.
 

jes_ON

VIP Member
Jun 22, 2009
12,092
1,422
Category........
Visa Office......
New York
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
06-May-2010
AOR Received.
13-Aug-2010
File Transfer...
01-Mar-2011
Passport Req..
30-Jun-2011
VISA ISSUED...
12-Jul-2011 (received 25-Jul-2011)
LANDED..........
03-Sep-2011
Tnopip said:
Hi, thanks for the answers.

The jobs were in two different companies, but same NOC (1123), different titles.

And yes, all the work experience was after February 2012; and both were full-time.
OK, I will assume you had 2 complete letters of employment (that included hours worked per week) and other documents (e.g. T4) to support that information.

So, there are 2 possibilities.

One (or both) letters did not provide enough information to allow the VO to conclude that the position matched the lead statement of NOC 1123, which is:

"This unit group includes specialists in advertising, marketing and public relations who analyse, develop and implement communication and promotion strategies and information programs, analyse advertising needs and develop appropriate advertising and marketing plans, publicize activities and events, and maintain media relations on behalf of businesses, governments and other organizations, and for performers, athletes, writers and other talented individuals. They are employed by consulting firms, advertising agencies, corporations, associations, government, social agencies, museums, galleries, public interest groups, and cultural and other organizations, or they may be self-employed. Agents such as entertainment, literary and sports agents are included in this unit group."
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/cec/apply-who.asp

We could only comment further if you provided the description/list of duties that were in your Letters of employment.

OR -

The VO evaluated you against the FSW criteria of one year of continuous full-time work. If the VO made this error you could request a reconsideration.
 

Tnopip

Member
Jun 15, 2015
19
0
Category........
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
AOR Received.
21-03-2016
Med's Done....
15-03-2016
Hi,

Thanks a lot for your answers!

If it can help, here's the whole letter:


Dear X:

I have completed the assessment of your application for a permanent resident visa as a member of the
provincial nominee class. I refused your application because I have determined that you do not meet the
requirements for immigration to Canada described in the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act and
the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (“the Regulations”).

According to the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations, applicants in the Provincial Nominee
Program are assessed under the following programs for section 11.2: Canadian Experience Class, Federal
Skilled Trades Program and Federal Skilled Workers. Your application was assessed based on Canadian
Experience Class which you identified as part of your skilled work experience in Canada. You are
assessed on the basis of the pass/fail requirements set out in subsection R87.1(2). The assessment of these
criteria determines whether a worker with Canadian experience will be able to become economically
established in Canada. The criteria are:

 temporary resident status during the qualifying period of work experience in Canada,
 meeting the minimum language proficiency threshold in either English or French, and
 qualifying Canadian skilled work experience.

Based on the documents provided, I am not satisfied that during the period of your employment at
Company A as Job Title from September 8, 2014 to the
date your application was received that you have met the qualifying Canadian skilled work experience as
set out in the occupational descriptions of the National Occupational Classification- 1123.
Your letter of reference dated August 27, 2014 demonstrated that you do not have the minimum
requirement of full-time work experience within the last three years accumulated in Canada prior to the
received date of your application of July 3, 2015. Furthermore, there are no duties listed in the letter(s) of
reference which appear to be consistent with the actions in the lead statement under the NOC code 1123.
The letter(s) of reference doesn’t appear to be consistent with a substantial number of the main duties
under the NOC code 1123.

As a result, I am not satisfied that you meet the minimum requirements under Canadian Experience Class
regulations under skilled work experience set out in subsection R87.1(2)(b)(c). Therefore, you do not
qualify as a provincial nominee and selection under the provincial nominee program.
Subsection 11(1) of the Act states that a foreign national must, before entering Canada, apply to an officer
for a visa or for any other document required by the Regulations. The visa or document may be issued if,
following an examination, the officer is satisfied that the foreign national is not inadmissible and meets
the requirements of this Act.

In addition, according to the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act (IRPA).
11.2 An officer may not issue a visa or other document in respect of an application for permanent
residence to a foreign national who was issued an invitation under Division 0.1 to make such an
application if – at the time the invitation was issued or at the time the officer received their
application – the foreign national did not meet the criteria set out in an instruction given under
paragraph 10.3(1)(e) or does not have the qualifications on the basis of which they were ranked
under an instruction given under paragraph 10.3(1)(h) and were consequently issued the
invitation.

Section 11.2 of IRPA requires that information provided in your Express Entry Profile concerning your
eligibility to be invited to apply (10.3(1)(e)) as well as the qualifications on the basis of which you were
ranked (10.3(1)(h)) be valid both at the time the invitation was issued and at the time the application for
permanent residence is received.

Following an examination of your application, I am not satisfied that you meet the requirements of the Act
and Regulations for the reasons explained above. I am therefore refusing your application.
You will receive a refund of the Right of Permanent Residence Fee that you have paid.
The decision communicated in this letter constitutes the definitive and final decision on your present
application. Your application will be retained, under current Government of Canada file retention
guidelines, for a period of two years. Your application forms and supporting documents will not be
returned to you. If you should submit a new application it would require new fees and documentation and
would need to meet all the requirements in effect at the time the application is submitted.
You must remove your Job Seeker profile from the Job Bank website as you are no longer an Express
Entry candidate. You must also remove any references that you are a candidate for Express Entry from
any private job board websites, if you used any.

If you still want to come to Canada as a skilled immigrant, you may take steps to improve your
competitiveness and register for Express Entry at a later date. For example, you may try to improve your
language score or gain a higher level of education. However, you must meet the minimum requirements
to enter the Express Entry pool and there is no guarantee that you will be issued another invitation to
apply for permanent residence under one of the immigration programs subject to Express Entry.
Thank you for the interest you have shown in Canada.

Yours sincerely,

Citizenship and Immigration Canada | Citoyenneté et Immigration Canada
Government of Canada | Gouvernement du Canada
They mention Company A (where I am still working), but not Company B, where I spent almost 10 months...

Also, they are refering to a "letter of reference'', which I do not remember...?
 

ctaylor8676

Full Member
Jul 28, 2015
42
1
HI

Sorry to hear about your refusal. You have made me super nervous. I have the same NOC as you. It was the closest to my role (Fundraising Manager) but the duties are so un-aligned with my actual duties at work that I'm super paranoid they wont accept me.

Would you mind letting me know what your exact job title is? Also did your reference letter refer specifically to duties from the NOC list or did your reference letter actually state what you actually do in your role?

I'm now worried my reference letter is too truthful by actually saying what my duties are. Do you think I should get my employer to write a new reference letter, more aligned with 1123 NOC duties and send it as additional information?

Thanks
 

Tnopip

Member
Jun 15, 2015
19
0
Category........
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
AOR Received.
21-03-2016
Med's Done....
15-03-2016
@ctaylor8676 - My title is Online Marketing Coordinator, doing a lot of advertising online and in magazines; amongst many things. The reference letter listed most of the tasks I am doing in my position... Getting a new one closer to what they want to see might be a good idea, given my situation... I wish I did!

@Phil89 - Yes, this is right. The letter is dated in 2014 (when I started to work for the company, that's the only letter they gave me with job description etc). I did not send paystubs - as I have a closed worked permit with them I thought it'd be enough to prove employment.
 

jes_ON

VIP Member
Jun 22, 2009
12,092
1,422
Category........
Visa Office......
New York
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
06-May-2010
AOR Received.
13-Aug-2010
File Transfer...
01-Mar-2011
Passport Req..
30-Jun-2011
VISA ISSUED...
12-Jul-2011 (received 25-Jul-2011)
LANDED..........
03-Sep-2011
Tnopip said:
They mention Company A (where I am still working), but not Company B, where I spent almost 10 months...

Also, they are refering to a "letter of reference'', which I do not remember...?
OK. So there were 2 major problems with the Letter of Reference (= Letter of employment) from Company A.

1) The date of the letter - dated August 27, 2014 ??? Was this a job offer letter, not a letter of employment?

A letter of employment is your employer's testimony that you have done the skilled work experience for the time period being assessed. The VO cannot assume anything about your work experience beyond the date of that letter. It is essential that the letter be dated AFTER you complete the time requirement (unless you provide an explanation and alternative proof). The letter of employment describes your PAST work experience (not future). It is not the same as a job offer letter (which says what you are hired to do in the future, but does not testify to what you did in the past).

Because of the date of this letter (unless the VO misread something), the VO had no evidence of the job duties you performed after August 27, 2014.

2) The job duties did not match the NOC.

Well, we would have to see what job duties were in the letter to understand this comment.
 

Phil89

Champion Member
Sep 11, 2014
1,175
21
Tnopip said:
@ctaylor8676 - My title is Online Marketing Coordinator, doing a lot of advertising online and in magazines; amongst many things. The reference letter listed most of the tasks I am doing in my position... Getting a new one closer to what they want to see might be a good idea, given my situation... I wish I did!

@Phil89 - Yes, this is right. The letter is dated in 2014 (when I started to work for the company, that's the only letter they gave me with job description etc). I did not send paystubs - as I have a closed worked permit with them I thought it'd be enough to prove employment.
That could be the reason why VO said that you don't have enough experience. The letter should have said that it is your current job with a more recent date.
Does your LMIA or LMO has the same NOC code on it?
 

sharma1990

Hero Member
Apr 5, 2015
923
15
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
i am so sorry to hear about refusal....did they request you any additional document within these 2 months? and i think your date could be the problem as it was mentioned sept 2014...
 

Banff2015

Hero Member
Jul 3, 2015
658
13
Category........
Visa Office......
Ottawa
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
what would be wrong with the date guys sept 14??