Does Experience on Off-Campus Work Permit (after graduation) count?

[zhddz]

As we probably all know, I can use my Off-Campus Work Permit to work full time after graduation, while waiting for the Post Graduate Work Permit. Does that experience on Off-Campus Work Permit counts for my one year's experience?

Your option is welcome and appreciated, and if you could give the reference of your answer, it will be really helpful to me. Thank you very much!

Here is what it says on the Guide:
Note: The experience must be acquired after you have completed the required study and obtained a Canadian credential (work performed under the Off-Campus Work Permit Program or co-op work terms do not count).

Here is a example on Op25:
Asha earned a 2-year MSc from the University of Toronto. During her studies she worked part-time at a private laboratory on an Off-Campus Work Permit. Upon graduation she applied for and received a Post-Graduation Work Permit and has been working at the same laboratory full-time for the past 6 months.

Eligible work experience under the Post-Graduation Stream of the CEC must occur after graduation. Work performed on an Off-Campus Work Permit (during studies) does not count under the CEC.

Asha would need to work full-time for another 6 months before she will qualify for the CEC.

 

[jes_ON]

As you already point out, CIC does not specifically address eligibility of work experience gained during the post-graduation transition from an off-campus work permit to PGWP. In some places it seems to indicate that the experience is eligible, in others it does not.

Most people on this board report that the CIC helpline person tells them that the work has to be performed while on the PGWP.

Unless/until CIC clarifies its position on this transitional period, it is just safer to work the extra 2-3 months and then apply.

OP 25:
www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/op/op25-eng.pdf

One additional reference that suggests "Yes, it counts":

OP 25, p. 11:

Note: A temporary resident permit (TRP) confers temporary resident status and as such,
applicants who obtained their qualifying work experience or post-secondary credentials while
in Canada on a TRP are eligible to apply for CEC. These applicants are eligible as long as
their work and/or studies were authorized. Applicants who are inadmissible cannot be
granted permanent residence as members of the CEC class.

 

[zhddz]

Thank you very much for your response with such detailed reference.

The problem is that I have already lost my job. In order to work for another 2 months, I have to find a new job. That will significantly delay my application submition date.

For the helpline, do you mean CIC call center? (1-888-242-2100) I stop trusting them. They gave me the wrong answer once, and wasted me lots of money and time.

Does someone know what is R87.1(2)? The reference in the square bracket? I would like to read that. Where can I find it?

 

[zhddz]

Hello, jes_ON: Where is your second half of the post. After I replied, it is gone...

 

[jes_ON]

it just repeated yours, so I removed it.

 

[shah0076]

hello,zhddz
I am also on your boat exactly same i graduate 2011 April started work 2011 May i got PGWP 2011 July went to home 2011 Oct- 2011 Nov again start same position on 2011 Dec- till Now so can you tell me now am i eligible to apply now plz i will wait for your early reply thank you

 

[seton]

Does someone know what is R87.1(2)? The reference in the square bracket? I would like to read that. Where can I find it?

Here is the section in the act (R87.1)

87.1 (1) For the purposes of subsection 12(2) of the Act, the Canadian experience class is prescribed as a class of persons who may become permanent residents on the basis of their experience in Canada and who intend to reside in a province other than the Province of Quebec.
Marginal note:Member of the class

(2) A foreign national is a member of the Canadian experience class if
(a) they
(i) have acquired in Canada within the 24 months before the day on which their application for permanent residence is made at least 12 months of full-time work experience, or the equivalent in part-time work experience, in one or more occupations that are listed in Skill Type 0 Management Occupations or Skill Level A or B of the National Occupational Classification matrix, and have acquired that work experience after having obtained
(A) a diploma, degree or trade or apprenticeship credential issued on the completion of a program of full-time study or training of at least two years’ duration at a public, provincially recognized post-secondary educational or training institution in Canada,
(B) a diploma or trade or apprenticeship credential issued on the completion of a program of full-time study or training of at least two years’ duration at a private, Quebec post-secondary institution that operates under the same rules and regulations as public Quebec post-secondary institutions and that receives at least 50 per cent of its financing for its overall operations from government grants, subsidies or other assistance,
(C) a degree from a private, provincially recognized post-secondary educational institution in Canada issued on the completion of a program of full-time study of at least two years’ duration, or
(D) a graduate degree from a provincially recognized post-secondary educational institution in Canada issued on the completion of a program of full-time study of at least one year’s duration and within two years after obtaining a degree or diploma from an institution referred to in clause (A) or (C), or
(ii) have acquired in Canada within the 36 months before the day on which their application for permanent residence is made at least 24 months of full-time work experience, or the equivalent in part-time work experience, in one or more occupations that are listed in Skill Type 0 Management Occupations or Skill Level A or B of the National Occupational Classification matrix; and
(b) they have had their proficiency in the English or French language assessed by an organization or institution designated under subsection (4) and have obtained proficiencies for their abilities to speak, listen, read and write that correspond to benchmarks, as referred to in Canadian Language Benchmarks 2000 for the English language and Niveaux de compétence linguistique canadiens 2006 for the French language, of
(i) in the case of a foreign national who has acquired work experience in one or more occupations that are listed in Skill Type 0 Management Occupations or Skill Level A of the National Occupational Classification matrix,
(A) 7 or higher for each of those abilities, or
(B) 6 for any one of those abilities, 7 or higher for any other two of those abilities and 8 or higher for the remaining ability, and
(ii) in the case of a foreign national who has acquired work experience in one or more occupations that are listed in Skill Level B of the National Occupational Classification matrix,
(A) 5 or higher for each of those abilities, or
(B) 4 for any one of those abilities, 5 or higher for any other two of those abilities and 6 or higher for the remaining ability.
Marginal note:Application

(3) For the purposes of subsection (2),
(a) full-time work is equivalent to at least 37.5 hours of work per week;
(b) any period of self-employment or unauthorized work shall not be included in calculating a period of work experience;
(c) the foreign national must have had temporary resident status during their period of work experience and any period of full-time study or training;
(d) the foreign national must have been physically present in Canada for at least two years of their full-time study or training;
(e) any period during which the foreign national was engaged in a full-time program of study or training in English or French as a second language — and any period of full-time study or training in respect of which study or training in English or French as a second language amounted to most of the full-time study or training — shall not be included in calculating the period of full-time study or training;
(f) any period of study or training during which the foreign national was a recipient of a Government of Canada scholarship or bursary, or participated in an exchange program sponsored by the Government of Canada, a purpose or condition of which was that the foreign national return to their country of origin or nationality on completion of their studies or training shall not be included in calculating the period of full-time study or training; and
(g) in the case of a foreign national whose work experience is referred to in both subparagraphs (2)(b)(i) and (ii), the foreign national must obtain a proficiency in the English or French language that corresponds to the benchmarks required for the skill type, as set out in subparagraph (2)(b)(i) or (ii), in which the foreign national has acquired most of their work experience.
Marginal noteesignated organization

(4) The Minister may designate organizations or institutions to assess language proficiency for the purposes of this section and shall, for the purpose of correlating the results of such an assessment by a particular designated organization or institution with the benchmarks referred to in subsection (2), establish the minimum test result required to be awarded for each ability and each level of proficiency in the course of an assessment of language proficiency by that organization or institution in order to meet those benchmarks.
Marginal note:Conclusive evidence

(5) The results of an assessment of the language proficiency of a foreign national by a designated organization or institution and the correlation of those results with the benchmarks in accordance with subsection (4) are conclusive evidence of the foreign national’s proficiency in an official language of Canada for the purposes of this section.

Source: http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/page-35.html

As such, the Act (which is ultimately the official document) says that the work experience must be acquired after completing the diploma. The Act does not explicitly mention either the Off Campus Work Permit or Post-Graduate Work Permit, but the CIC interpretation of both is implied (and simplified for layman purposes).

Note that this also raises other technicalities - for example you can apply for a PGWP when you meet the requirements to graduate, but haven't received your degree. Since the Act is explicit that you should have obtained the degree/diploma, there is a chance that your PGWP could be issued before a convocation ceremony is finished and you actually receive your degree/diploma.

I maintain what I said in other threads - it just isn't exceedingly clear. The way the Act is written is fairly explicit about "obtaining a degree", but does not address the actual work permit it was attained on. CIC interpretation explicitly mentions the OCWP (with a "during your studies" caveat), which is reasonable given that they aren't assessing work experience during your education which covers the major use of the OCWP.

I think once you apply and can demonstrate that your experience was after obtaining your degree, you are meeting the criteria set out by the Act. Ultimately the Act trumps any CIC guidance on the matter and is defensible in court.