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Current work permit about to expire. Implied status?

Bcboundboy

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profiler said:
I'm amused that you're still following the idea of using a forum as a reason why something cannot happen, and a tv series as (assumed) evidence of that.
That is so funny, you saying on a forum, that forums can't be trusted.... so giving advice that can lead to people getting deported. On the bright side, you're telling them you can't be trusted with that :)

@OP: Note that an IEC cannot be extended or renewed, so rules that exist for other permits do not necessarily apply. As you'll remember from applying, and arriving, IEC has their own sets of rules around timescales, insurance, etc, and officers are not always familiar with them. When in doubt, be safe, and avoid doing things that can get you deported, like working illegally.
 

CDNPR2014

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So, there is nothing from IRCC or in legislation that states this explicitly? Just a youtube/tv series and a Brit expat forum?

My wife's spousal has an expiry date as well. There is a time limit also built into it. The OWP is the same.
IRCC website clearly states IEC is NOT extendable and gives information about what to do if you want to stay in canada as a worker. If an IEC work permit expires, a person needs to apply for a work permit again, most likely through another program.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/work/extend/iec.asp

The website also clearly states that if a person is applying for a new type of work permit (which the spousal OWP is), they can NOT continue working under the conditions of their expired permit. the application only gives them the right to stay in canada under implied status.

applying to EXTEND a work permit gives a person the right to continue working.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/helpcentre/answer.asp?qnum=188&top=17

I have applied for a new work permit. Can I stay in Canada if my work permit expires?

Yes. You can stay in Canada, and may be able to keep working, under what's called implied status. That means the law implies you are a temporary resident. The implied status lasts until Citizenship and Immigration Canada (CIC) decides on your new permit application. However, you must respect the following requirements:

If you applied for another work permit

You must stay in Canada and meet the conditions of your original work permit. If you applied for a work permit extension before your work permit expired, you can keep working under the same conditions as your existing permit until CIC decides on your application unless you have applied to extend your stay under another category.

If you applied for a different kind of permit

You cannot do any of the activities allowed by the original work permit. For example, you may have come to Canada as a worker and then applied for a study permit. If so, you must stop working once your work permit expires. After that, you cannot work or study until you get a new permit.


an IEC and a spousal OWP are NOT the same thing. They are different classes of work permits and are not equal, therefore switching from an IEC to a spousal OWP does not give someone the right to continue working while they wait for the spousal OWP.
 

profiler

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CDNPR2014 said:
IRCC website clearly states IEC is NOT extendable and gives information about what to do if you want to stay in canada as a worker. If an IEC work permit expires, a person needs to apply for a work permit again, most likely through another program.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/work/extend/iec.asp

The website also clearly states that if a person is applying for a new type of work permit (which the spousal OWP is), they can NOT continue working under the conditions of their expired permit. the application only gives them the right to stay in canada under implied status.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/helpcentre/answer.asp?qnum=188&top=17

I have applied for a new work permit. Can I stay in Canada if my work permit expires?

Yes. You can stay in Canada, and may be able to keep working, under what's called implied status. That means the law implies you are a temporary resident. The implied status lasts until Citizenship and Immigration Canada (CIC) decides on your new permit application. However, you must respect the following requirements:

If you applied for another work permit

You must stay in Canada and meet the conditions of your original work permit. If you applied for a work permit extension before your work permit expired, you can keep working under the same conditions as your existing permit until CIC decides on your application unless you have applied to extend your stay under another category.

If you applied for a different kind of permit

You cannot do any of the activities allowed by the original work permit. For example, you may have come to Canada as a worker and then applied for a study permit. If so, you must stop working once your work permit expires. After that, you cannot work or study until you get a new permit.


an IEC and a spousal OWP are NOT the same thing. They are different classes of work permits and are not equal.
OK, well that was why I asked, right? And BTW, I did not imply nor state that IEC could be extended. the OWP granted to inlanders cannot for sure.

I am glad you used credible sources, and not another forum or a tv series !:)
 

CDNPR2014

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I am glad you used credible sources, and not another forum or a tv series !:)
I wouldn't knock advice gained from Border Security. It gives some great advice for border crossings and tricks for dealing with the border. Everything that happens there is real, and the CBSA agents talk about real laws/requirements. Had I known about that show, and watched it, I am pretty confident I would never have gotten an exclusion order back in the day. I definitely learned my mistakes from watching that show since then.
 

profiler

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CDNPR2014 said:
I wouldn't knock advice gained from Border Security. It gives some great advice for border crossings and tricks for dealing with the border. Everything that happens there is real, and the CBSA agents talk about real laws/requirements. Had I known about that show, and watched it, I am pretty confident I would never have gotten an exclusion order back in the day. I definitely learned my mistakes from watching that show since then.
Yeah? I guess we (my friends and I) would be forever banned from travel based on that show... And my wife would have been sent home the first visit too....

Food for thought :).
 

CDNPR2014

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Yeah? I guess we (my friends and I) would be forever banned from travel based on that show... And my wife would have been sent home the first visit too....

Food for thought :).
yep, probably since crossings depend on the specific agent you meet at crossing and how you answer their questions. if they don't like your answers, they don't let you in. if they think there is a chance you'll stay longer than allowed or work, then they'll put a kabash on that in a second. some agents are more lenient than others - and it's easier to have "red flags" jump out when you are crossing by land. when you enter canada by air and you have a return ticket, then it is less likely "red flags" will pop out immediately or a person is sent to secondary.
 

profiler

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CDNPR2014 said:
yep, probably since crossings depend on the specific agent you meet at crossing and how you answer their questions. if they don't like your answers, they don't let you in. if they think there is a chance you'll stay longer than allowed or work, then they'll put a kabash on that in a second. some agents are more lenient than others - and it's easier to have "red flags" jump out when you are crossing by land. when you enter canada by air and you have a return ticket, then it is less likely "red flags" will pop out immediately.
And crossing with meat products, etc. Yeah we for sure would never be able to travel again. Good thing that it's only tv... otherwise I wouldn't be married :).
 

CDNPR2014

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And crossing with meat products, etc. Yeah we for sure would never be able to travel again. Good thing that it's only tv... otherwise I wouldn't be married :).
as someone who received an exclusion order - what happens on that show is not "only tv". it's real life. those people's experiences were real and mine would have been much different had i known the "right" things to say, what to not have with me and most importantly, that there is an option for a person to "withdraw their application for entry".
 

Rob_TO

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profiler said:
So, there is nothing from IRCC or in legislation that states this explicitly?
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/work/iec/arrival.asp
Prepare for arrival – International Experience Canada

Check the expiry date shown under the “Valid until” box.
Your work permit will not be valid beyond:
-the amount of time indicated in the agreement between Canada and your country,
-the expiry date of your passport,
-the expiry date of your health insurance, or
-the end date of your work contract (Young Professionals and International Co-op (Internship) participants).

Staying in Canada
You may be able to stay in Canada as a tourist after your work permit expires. Complete the Come to Canada tool to find out if you are eligible to extend your stay.
You must do this while your work permit is still valid.


IEC is a special category of OWP that is done via agreement between Canada and the country of applicant. As such they can not be extended under implied status by switching to a regular OWP.

This would also provide a huge loophole for everyone to simply work in Canada under IEC for a couple more months. Simply submit a paper application for regular OWP (which they don't qualify for) the day before IEC expires, and continue working under implied status until formal rejection of OWP is received. This is not the intention of how IEC is supposed to operate.
 

Aslaug

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Mar 22, 2017
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Interesting reading, thanks all.

I'll be re-entering Canada from Australia on the 27th March, with my IEC visa expiring on the 10th April 2017. I'll have my AOR, IMM5710E Open work permit copy, copy of the legislaton and associated paperwork ready for immigration to ask any questions.

My consultant has referred me to section 186 u of the regulation:

A temporary resident must apply to extend their period of authorized stay before it ends. If they have done so, their period of authorized stay as a temporary resident is extended by law until a decision is made [R183(5)]. Such a person is considered to have implied status as a temporary resident during that period.

If a temporary resident applies for renewal of their work or study permit and their permit expires before a decision is made, paragraph 186(u) and section 189 of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (IRPR) (the right to continue working or studying under the same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as the person remains in Canada.

I'll keep you posted on what immigration says.
 

Rob_TO

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Aslaug said:
Interesting reading, thanks all.

I'll be re-entering Canada from Australia on the 27th March, with my IEC visa expiring on the 10th April 2017. I'll have my AOR, IMM5710E Open work permit copy, copy of the legislaton and associated paperwork ready for immigration to ask any questions.

My consultant has referred me to section 186 u of the regulation:

A temporary resident must apply to extend their period of authorized stay before it ends. If they have done so, their period of authorized stay as a temporary resident is extended by law until a decision is made [R183(5)]. Such a person is considered to have implied status as a temporary resident during that period.

If a temporary resident applies for renewal of their work or study permit and their permit expires before a decision is made, paragraph 186(u) and section 189 of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (IRPR) (the right to continue working or studying under the same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as the person remains in Canada.

I'll keep you posted on what immigration says.
You are not applying to renew your IEC. You are applying for an entirely new different class of open work permit, one that is not under a special agreement between Canada and your home country.

If caught working on an expired IEC, nobody will care what advice a lawyer or consultant gave you.
 

CDNPR2014

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Aslaug said:
Interesting reading, thanks all.

I'll be re-entering Canada from Australia on the 27th March, with my IEC visa expiring on the 10th April 2017. I'll have my AOR, IMM5710E Open work permit copy, copy of the legislaton and associated paperwork ready for immigration to ask any questions.

My consultant has referred me to section 186 u of the regulation:

A temporary resident must apply to extend their period of authorized stay before it ends. If they have done so, their period of authorized stay as a temporary resident is extended by law until a decision is made [R183(5)]. Such a person is considered to have implied status as a temporary resident during that period.

If a temporary resident applies for renewal of their work or study permit and their permit expires before a decision is made, paragraph 186(u) and section 189 of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (IRPR) (the right to continue working or studying under the same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as the person remains in Canada.

I'll keep you posted on what immigration says.
What you posted is NOT relavant to your situation since you are not applying for the same kind of work permit. IEC work permit and Spousal sponsorship OWP are not the same class and you can not work while you are waiting for your spousal OWP to arrive.

you seem to have missed what i posted and may want to read this for clarification. While you have the right to STAY in canada while your OWP application processes, you DONT have the right to continue working. As Rob mentioned you are NOT renewing your work permit or seeking to work under the same work permit conditions, you are applying for a NEW work permit under DIFFERENT Conditions!

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/helpcentre/answer.asp?qnum=188&top=17

I have applied for a new work permit. Can I stay in Canada if my work permit expires? <----- being allowed to STAY in canada is not the same as being able to continue WORKING on an expired work permit.

Yes. You can stay in Canada, and may be able to keep working, under what's called implied status. That means the law implies you are a temporary resident. The implied status lasts until Citizenship and Immigration Canada (CIC) decides on your new permit application. However, you must respect the following requirements:

If you applied for another work permit <------ this is referencing extending your work permit - which you are NOT doing

You must stay in Canada and meet the conditions of your original work permit. If you applied for a work permit extension before your work permit expired, you can keep working under the same conditions as your existing permit until CIC decides on your application unless you have applied to extend your stay under another category.

If you applied for a different kind of permit <----- this is what you ARE doing - you are applying for a DIFFERENT kind of permit

You cannot do any of the activities allowed by the original work permit. For example, you may have come to Canada as a worker and then applied for a study permit. If so, you must stop working once your work permit expires. After that, you cannot work or study until you get a new permit.


but good luck with telling CBSA what you can/can't do. That is for them to tell YOU! And they certainly are not going to care a consultant gave you a print out of rules pertaining to staying in canada as a temp visitor when you are seeking entry into canada 2 weeks prior to your current NON-EXTENDABLE work permit expires. as indicated above - THAT DOES NOT APPLY TO YOUR SITUATION!

I'd be very careful how you tread at the border - you are certainly going to have problems convincing them you are allowed to work while you wait for a new/NON-IEC work permit arrives. and if they think you will try to work illegally while you wait for your work permit to arrive, they will deny you entry and possibly even issue an exclusion order. let us know how that goes.
 

Aslaug

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Mar 22, 2017
8
1
Thanks CDNPR2014 for clarifying more concisely in one post. My sleep deprived brain is trying to get up to speed on it all.

Given the banter between Bcboundboy and profiler originally, it wasn't easy to follow, and I'll admit the tv reference deterred me initially.
Looks like I'll be having a few words with my consultant, and given I cant work, I'll be staying in Australia to visit for a month more before heading home.
 

Rob_TO

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Aslaug said:
Thanks CDNPR2014 for clarifying more concisely in one post. My sleep deprived brain is trying to get up to speed on it all.

Given the banter between Bcboundboy and profiler originally, it wasn't easy to follow, and I'll admit the tv reference deterred me initially.
Looks like I'll be having a few words with my consultant, and given I cant work, I'll be staying in Australia to visit for a month more before heading home.
Note that if you applied for PR INLAND, then it's a requirement that sponsor and applicant be living together inside Canada for the duration of PR processing. If you are outside Canada long enough that IRCC feels you are no longer residing here, they would have grounds to simply cancel your application.

Staying outside Canada for several months with an inland app in process, is incredibly risky.
 

Aslaug

Newbie
Mar 22, 2017
8
1
Rob_TO said:
Note that if you applied for PR INLAND, then it's a requirement that sponsor and applicant be living together inside Canada for the duration of PR processing. If you are outside Canada long enough that IRCC feels you are no longer residing here, they would have grounds to simply cancel your application.

Staying outside Canada for several months with an inland app in process, is incredibly risky.
Would you recommend not travelling at all during the PR process?