Any PRs from visa exempt countries - were you asked for PR card when flying?

[spyfy]

Simple. They want to catch more PRs that don't meet the RO, so allowing them to apply for eTA and board a flight would allow more PRs not meeting the RO to easily "sneak" back into Canada as a foreign national without having their RO violation detected.

Probably hit the nail on the head right there.

 

[methyl]

Regardless of whether the PR kept to their RO or not, they will still be admitted to Canada.
Sure it could make them easier to detect, I get the point, but what is the point of doing that at all for anybody who obtained PR recently, ie within the first xxx years from getting PR status for example?

ETA system could trivially be adjusted to give automatic approvals to recent PRs from visa-exempt countries, still on their first PR card. What could be the reason not to?
Surely nothing to do with RO.

 

[spyfy]

Regardless of whether the PR kept to their RO or not, they will still be admitted to Canada.

Only at the land border, though. If you are a PR but don't have a PR card or a PRTD, you can't travel to Canada on a plane at all.

Sure it could make them easier to detect, I get the point, but what is the point of doing that at all for anybody who obtained PR recently, ie within the first xxx years from getting PR status for example?
ETA system could trivially be adjusted to give automatic approvals to recent PRs from visa-exempt countries, still on their first PR card. What could be the reason not to?
Surely nothing to do with RO.

This would just move the problem. New PRs would get used to travel without a PR card and just their eTA. And then, after 3 years all of a sudden their eTA doesn't work anymore and they are stuck again and need a PR card. It just moves the problem by 3 years.

If your argument is "but new PRs have to wait for their PR cards and can't travel": Think about who is affected by that. If you are in Canada, that doesn't apply to you because you can just wait with landing until you travel (and then land on your return). If you are outside Canada, you can travel to Canada and land with your fresh CoPR. So the only people this "new PR eTA" would be useful for is those who don't think ahead or the very small number of people who can't find a 40 day window (current processing time) in which they don't leave the country (and which they could use to land and then wait for their card).

So all in all such a temporary eTA isn't really worth it. A general eTA option would be useful, but as Rob_TO pointed out, they probably don't want that to catch more RO breaches.

 

[methyl]

This would just move the problem. New PRs would get used to travel without a PR card and just their eTA. And then, after 3 years all of a sudden their eTA doesn't work anymore and they are stuck again and need a PR card. It just moves the problem by 3 years.

Well the cure for forgetfulness could to to make ETA for PRs a one-time authorization, same as PRTD. Basically replace PRTD with an ETA equivalent. And same as with ETA - if more proof or info is needed, it can be requested from the applicant whenever necessary.

Think about who is affected by that. If you are in Canada, that doesn't apply to you because you can just wait with landing until you travel (and then land on your return). If you are outside Canada, you can travel to Canada and land with your fresh CoPR. So the only people this "new PR eTA" would be useful for is those who don't think ahead or the very small number of people who can't find a 40 day window (current processing time) in which they don't leave the country (and which they could use to land and then wait for their card).

The affected number of people is much larger - if you are in Canada there is a large class of people that are without healthcare and without job/study permits on visitors permits. All these people will not sit around waiting for the next trip, they will land as soon as possible, and for 46 days they are locked out from leaving.

If we are talking about those outside of Canada - there are countless reports of people given only a month or less to land, due to medicals expiring. Many in this situation are forced to land ASAP and then head back home to settle effects - whether to sell property, wind down businesses, etc.

Another class - anybody who misplaced their PR card while on a trip. Amusingly, I even know such person personally. He was a PR under 5 years in Canada, practically never left Canada, was in Cuba on a week's vacation in a resort. Not speaking Spanish, the amount of trouble, time and expense he had to run through to arrange a PRTD was insane, having to travel far away to the capital, stay there for a number of days, not to mention being unable to stay in a resort and basically losing most of the vacation, and spending double the original planned amount on this whole trip.

I'm sure there are other important cases, excluding "inability to plan forward"

All of these cases are inconvenienced unnecessarily in the name of bureaucracy.

 

[spyfy]

Well the cure for forgetfulness could to to make ETA for PRs a one-time authorization, same as PRTD. Basically replace PRTD with an ETA equivalent. And same as with ETA - if more proof or info is needed, it can be requested from the applicatnt.

You are basically just reinventing the PRTD. With the only exception that one can apply for it online.

If you think the application procedure for a PRTD should be simplified, I couldn't agree more. It's ridiculous that for those who just left for some days (and are therefore not in question regarding RO) all they have to do is look it up in the database and print that thing. But in Europe for instance you have to go through a Visa Service Office which charges large amounts and take forever. I mean, seriously?

Such an electronic application is exactly what would've helped your friend in Cuba, too. Just go on Wifi, fill out the form and wait for some days. Easy peasy

So I'm all in for an electronic PRTD. Now we just gotta convince the government.

 

[pie_vancouver]

On the other hand I really don't see why PRs shouldn't be able to apply for an eTA. What would be so bad about that? Maybe I'm missing something here? Like what is the government's argument. It can't be that "all PRs must be treated equally" since we all know that US-citizen PRs don't need an eTA or a PR card to board.

ETA costs $7, if I'm a PR of Canada why would I pay $7 to return to Canada.

 

[methyl]

ETA costs $7, if I'm a PR of Canada why would I pay $7 to return to Canada.

The conversation is not about mandatory ETAs for PRs, this is about PRs from visa exempt countries without PR cards.
PRTD costs $50. Why wouldn't you pay $7 instead?

 

[pie_vancouver]

PRTD costs $50. Why wouldn't you pay $7 instead?

I would rather spend my money on food. $7 or $50 lol
Oh PRTD is for PR without PR card, either they wait for PR card before travelling or pay $50.
and also ROB answered it, eta is for foreign nationals not for citizens and PRs, easy for govt to detect who do not meet RO.

 

[Rob_TO]

ETA system could trivially be adjusted to give automatic approvals to recent PRs from visa-exempt countries, still on their first PR card. What could be the reason not to?
Surely nothing to do with RO.

One can be on their first PR card but in violation of the RO. All it takes is to spend your first 3 years outside Canada.

I agree there could be a kind of temporary travel document issued to every new PR automatically upon landing, with say a 3 months validity date on it or something, that would allow a new PR to travel without yet receiving first PR card and without the hassle of going through PR TD process.

However at the end of the day, IRCC doesn't really care that new PRs are sometime's inconvenienced while waiting for initial PR card. They already have a PR TD system in place to account for this. It's cheaper and easier to simply leave PR TD method as it is and not create a whole new program or system to allow new PRs to travel easier, so I doubt this kind of thing would be implemented.

 

[methyl]

Such an electronic application is exactly what would've helped your friend in Cuba, too. Just go on Wifi, fill out the form and wait for some days. Easy peasy

So I'm all in for an electronic PRTD. Now we just gotta convince the government.

Well the embassy still asked to provide countless documents proving that he resided in Canada all this time. Bank statements, utilities, etc.
Then he had to find a computer with an internet connection and a printer (and if you visited Cuba you'd know about the near-impossibility of finding something like this 5 years ago) and print a couple hundred pages from the scans that his family did.
If not for family still in Canada helping him and he lived alone he might as well gone back to his home country as the embassy wouldn't budge without

 

[andrews65]

Very interested in keeping this thread alive, and hearing reports from any new PRs who have travelled by plane to Canada without having to show their PR card, while having an eTA that still shows as valid on the IRCC site after the travel is complete .....

 

[methyl]

Very interested in keeping this thread alive, and hearing reports from any new PRs who have travelled by plane to Canada without having to show their PR card, while having an eTA that still shows as valid on the IRCC site after the travel is complete .....

If your ETA is still listed valid chances are you'll get "board".
But you're playing with fire as PR's ETA can be revoked literally any moment. You can risk it of course, but if you can't board what are you planning to do? Buy an expensive last minute ticket to a US border city and leg it across the border?
It's an expensive $$$$ lottery.

 

[axolotl]

I had to go back to Europe before receiving my PR card. I read from multiple posts that a PR needs to have his/her PR card or PRTD to be able to board a commercial airline. For this reason I asked someone to send me my PR card by post to Europe. It cost me about 18 CAD. It turned out to be an unnecessary cost.

Today I flew back to Canada, from Amsterdam to Toronto via Keflavik, with WOW Air. For both legs of the flight, I was allowed to board simply with my boarding pass and passport. No one asked for an ETA or a PR card.

 

[zardoz]

I'm wondering if you get an 'implied' eTA with the COPR that is set to automatically expire on the same date as the COPR. This might explain the somewhat random reports that we are hearing. It might not be "cancelled" but have a very limited life, explaining why some people get away with it.