New PR, living outside of Canada

[Kogorashi]

Hello canadavisa team!

I hope everyone is having a great holiday season.

I have a quick question in regards to my PR situation.

I landed in Toronto back in September as an Express entry skilled worker immigrant and obtained my SIN, opened a bank account, etc.

Due to personal reasons, I might need to leave next year for a year, a maximum of two to live outside of Canada.

This raises 2 questions:

1) I found contradicting information in regards to how long I can stay outside. Some sources say it's ~3 years out of 5 years, some sources say i can stay outside no longer than 6 months and have to come back after in order not to lose my PR status. Which is correct? Can i stay outside for ~3 years in a row or i have to come back every 6 months the same way it works in the US?

2) Am I considered a tax resident if I am not employed by a Canadian employer during my stay outside of Canada? Do I need to fill my returns and pay taxes on foreign income? Or i can obtain a non-residency status while being a PR?

I fell in love with Canada during these few months, but my current personal situation outweighs the benefit of staying here, so to keep the best of both worlds, id like to retain my PR status in order to come back in a year or two and settle for good.

Thank you!

 

[armoured]

1) I found contradicting information in regards to how long I can stay outside. Some sources say it's ~3 years out of 5 years, some sources say i can stay outside no longer than 6 months and have to come back after in order not to lose my PR status. Which is correct? Can i stay outside for ~3 years in a row or i have to come back every 6 months the same way it works in the US?

...

I fell in love with Canada during these few months, but my current personal situation outweighs the benefit of staying here, so to keep the best of both worlds, id like to retain my PR status in order to come back in a year or two and settle for good.

The residency obligation is that you must spend two years of every five in Canada - or during your first five years, easiest to calculate that you must spend less than 1095 days outside Canada (just different way of expressing the same thing). This is calculated from your date of first landing during first five, at any date of examination looking backwards after that.

There is no requirement about no longer than six months as in USA.

So you can depart and come back. Be aware that many in your situation return or depart, and then have trouble returning in sufficient time to remain compliant with the residency obligation. That's where it gets tricky. But no problem if you depart for a year or so and then return.

Importnat to note: in practical terms, many many cases where PRs return just before the start of the last two year period. Technically, nothing wrong with that - but since that means that to remain compliant they must also remain in Canada with no or little travel. For many, that restriction on travel is incompatible with their lifestyle - work, personal needs, family matters, etc - and then can create problems with renewing their PR card in a timely manner, creating other problems (some of which might be inconveniences for one person and massive constraints on work/life/family matters etc(.

One example being - if your pr card is expired and you can't renew it because of out of compliance, you can't for the most part board a flight to Canada, and only returning through USA is practical - for those who can travel through USA it's an inconvenience, for those who can't, basically not feasible to return (without applying for a PRTD which could result in losing PR status). Another matter is you can't sponsor a spouse if you're not in compliance. ETc.

Probably the vast majority of cases / questions posed in the residency obligation forum (this one) are either or some combination of those two issues - stayed abroad overlong (some a little, some a LOT), and dealing with the issues of being out of compliance or close to out of compliance.

But if you do actually just depart for a year or so and return and then reside in CAnada full-time after that, no issues.

(Not an expert on tax issues - separate matter entirely)

 

[Sreehari]

I first landed in Canada on 20 May 2018 and left on 28 May 2018. I received my PR card at my friends home and then I never travelled to Canada after that as I got a job in Malaysia. My PR card expiry is 27 Sept 2023.

If I travel to Canada now, will I be admitted as I don't have a chance to live 730 days in Canada in the five years from 20 May 2018 or 5 years ending 27 Sept 2023.

If I'm admitted, can I travel in and out freely until 27 Sept 2023? Will my RO be examined only when I apply for renewal of card?

If I travel now and am admitted, will I be able to sponsor my wife if I meet other criteria? Will the RO checked if I put in an application for my wife's PR?

 

[scylla]

I first landed in Canada on 20 May 2018 and left on 28 May 2018. I received my PR card at my friends home and then I never travelled to Canada after that as I got a job in Malaysia. My PR card expiry is 27 Sept 2023.

If I travel to Canada now, will I be admitted as I don't have a chance to live 730 days in Canada in the five years from 20 May 2018 or 5 years ending 27 Sept 2023.

If I'm admitted, can I travel in and out freely until 27 Sept 2023? Will my RO be examined only when I apply for renewal of card?

If I travel now and am admitted, will I be able to sponsor my wife if I meet other criteria? Will the RO checked if I put in an application for my wife's PR?

Five years from May 20, 2018 is the period for which you need to meet RO. So you do not meet the residency requirement.

You can travel freely but RO may be examined again each time you re-enter Canada. Since you don't meet RO, there's always some chance you may be reported each time you re-enter Canada.

Yes, RO will be checked if you apply to sponsor your spouse for PR. Only sponsor your spouse if you meet RO. So you'll need to move to Canada and wait until you've lived in Canada for 2 years before you'll be able to sponsor your spouse for PR.

 

[Sreehari]

Five years from May 20, 2018 is the period for which you need to meet RO. So you do not meet the residency requirement.

You can travel freely but RO may be examined again each time you re-enter Canada. Since you don't meet RO, there's always some chance you may be reported each time you re-enter Canada.

Yes, RO will be checked if you apply to sponsor your spouse for PR. Only sponsor your spouse if you meet RO. So you'll need to move to Canada and wait until you've lived in Canada for 2 years before you'll be able to sponsor your spouse for PR.

Thank you! If I travel in Jan 2022 with a plan to stay inside Canada for 730 days straight (trying to be under the radar), will I be subject to RO check for:

1. Driving License Application
2. University Application
3. Any other such incidental unavoidable interaction with government agencies?

 

[scylla]

Thank you! If I travel in Jan 2022 with a plan to stay inside Canada for 730 days straight (trying to be under the radar), will I be subject to RO check for:

1. Driving License Application
2. University Application
3. Any other such incidental unavoidable interaction with government agencies?

No. None of the above will trigger a check.

The only thing that will trigger a check is renewing your PR card before you meet RO or trying to sponsor your spouse before you meet RO.

 

[diadem27]

Five years from May 20, 2018 is the period for which you need to meet RO. So you do not meet the residency requirement.

You can travel freely but RO may be examined again each time you re-enter Canada. Since you don't meet RO, there's always some chance you may be reported each time you re-enter Canada.

Yes, RO will be checked if you apply to sponsor your spouse for PR. Only sponsor your spouse if you meet RO. So you'll need to move to Canada and wait until you've lived in Canada for 2 years before you'll be able to sponsor your spouse for PR.

Our timelines are exactly the same as mentioned here. However while outside, we have a new addition to our family. Hence there are few followup questions I seek advise on. Please help to clarify (if can):
1. What visa we should look for to bring our child into Canada ?
2. Our SIN cards are already with us. How we can ensure the medical & schooling for the child ?
3. As you have already answered, to refrain from sponsorship unless RO is met (basically stay away from IRCC). In that case should we try to sponsor the child only once RO is met ? in that case since we need to stack up our stay inside Canada (so no outbound travels), how we can ensure the child visa remains effective during this period, while at the same time we ensure his medical & education coverage.
4. Since this is a clear RO breach (in our case due to some personal circumstances prevails out of COVID situation), by the time we may get 730 days stack up, what will be the hardships/effects of staying with expired PR card ? Should we apply for its renewal once RO is met and wait until then ?
5. Will there be any trouble with expired PR card in day to day dealings like leasing, banking (mortgage etc), working, filing taxes, availing medical facilities etc.
6. In our case we are defaulting RO with around 10 months (factored the time by when we will be actually inside Canada, if all goes well), while we travel to Canada, by any means can we be denied entry due to observation by IO that we are certainly defaulting on RO ?
7. We are based out in Singapore since the last 7 years, alternatively rather than deferring renewal (until RO is met), if we buy a house and choose to involve an attorney for petition on H&C grounds, should an investment makes our petition strong since it depicts our intentions to stay & settle in Canada are strong & RO was defaulted due to the COVID situation (which we will explain in petition).

Appreciate maximum prompt inputs, so accordingly we can initiate our plan to travel, as I already have an offer in Canada, however with all the above uncertainties, we are unable to decide.

Thanks !

 

[scylla]

Our timelines are exactly the same as mentioned here. However while outside, we have a new addition to our family. Hence there are few followup questions I seek advise on. Please help to clarify (if can):
1. What visa we should look for to bring our child into Canada ?
2. Our SIN cards are already with us. How we can ensure the medical & schooling for the child ?
3. As you have already answered, to refrain from sponsorship unless RO is met (basically stay away from IRCC). In that case should we try to sponsor the child only once RO is met ? in that case since we need to stack up our stay inside Canada (so no outbound travels), how we can ensure the child visa remains effective during this period, while at the same time we ensure his medical & education coverage.
4. Since this is a clear RO breach (in our case due to some personal circumstances prevails out of COVID situation), by the time we may get 730 days stack up, what will be the hardships/effects of staying with expired PR card ? Should we apply for its renewal once RO is met and wait until then ?
5. Will there be any trouble with expired PR card in day to day dealings like leasing, banking (mortgage etc), working, filing taxes, availing medical facilities etc.
6. In our case we are defaulting RO with around 10 months (factored the time by when we will be actually inside Canada, if all goes well), while we travel to Canada, by any means can we be denied entry due to observation by IO that we are certainly defaulting on RO ?
7. We are based out in Singapore since the last 7 years, alternatively rather than deferring renewal (until RO is met), if we buy a house and choose to involve an attorney for petition on H&C grounds, should an investment makes our petition strong since it depicts our intentions to stay & settle in Canada are strong & RO was defaulted due to the COVID situation (which we will explain in petition).

Appreciate maximum prompt inputs, so accordingly we can initiate our plan to travel, as I already have an offer in Canada, however with all the above uncertainties, we are unable to decide.

Thanks !

1. TRV. Note that there is no guarantee the TRV will be approved and processing can take some time. If you haven't applied for the TRV already, suggest you do that asap.
2. The child will be able to go to school with TRV status but most likely will not qualify for provincial health care coverage until PR is approved. You should purchase private medical insurance to cover the child until they become a PR.
3. Correct, you should not try to sponsor the child until you meet RO. The child will enter Canada on a TRV and will likely be approved for a six month visit. Towards the end of this six month visit, you will apply for an extension from within Canada to request a longer stay. You will keep having to apply for extensions until the child becomes a PR.
4. I'm not sure I undersand this question. You should not apply to renew your PR cards until you meet RO.
5. There might be in some cases. You should indicate which province you will be living in. Working should not be an issue since you have SINs. But I believe some people have had issues getting provincial health care coverage.
6. You won't be denied entry but there is always some chance you could be reported at the border for failing to meet RO. If you have 10 months remaining on your PR card validity, I would say the chances of that happening are probably on the very low side and you should have no issues entering.
7. To have a strong H&C case, you want to have one or more strong H&C reasons why you were forced to remain outside of Canada. Employment is generally not considered as a strong H&C reason for failing to meet RO. However let's say you are a single child and had to remain outside of Canada in your home country to take care of an aged and ailing parent - that could be a strong H&C reason with the right supporting evidence (e.g. hospitalization records, letters from doctors, etc.).

 

[steaky]

4. I'm not sure I undersand this question. You should not apply to renew your PR cards until you meet RO.

I will try to answer the question. One advice: Don't live in BC with an expired PR card. As seen in this forum, OP might face difficulty in obtaining BC services card (for enrolling the provincial health) and getting driver license.

 

[scylla]

I will try to answer the question. One word: Don't live in BC with an expired PR card. As seen in this forum, OP might face difficulty in obtaining BC services card (for enrolling the provincial health) and getting driver license.

I think Ontario can be problematic for health care coverage too.

 

[YVR123]

Our timelines are exactly the same as mentioned here. However while outside, we have a new addition to our family. Hence there are few followup questions I seek advise on. Please help to clarify (if can):
1. What visa we should look for to bring our child into Canada ?
2. Our SIN cards are already with us. How we can ensure the medical & schooling for the child ?
3. As you have already answered, to refrain from sponsorship unless RO is met (basically stay away from IRCC). In that case should we try to sponsor the child only once RO is met ? in that case since we need to stack up our stay inside Canada (so no outbound travels), how we can ensure the child visa remains effective during this period, while at the same time we ensure his medical & education coverage.
4. Since this is a clear RO breach (in our case due to some personal circumstances prevails out of COVID situation), by the time we may get 730 days stack up, what will be the hardships/effects of staying with expired PR card ? Should we apply for its renewal once RO is met and wait until then ?
5. Will there be any trouble with expired PR card in day to day dealings like leasing, banking (mortgage etc), working, filing taxes, availing medical facilities etc.
6. In our case we are defaulting RO with around 10 months (factored the time by when we will be actually inside Canada, if all goes well), while we travel to Canada, by any means can we be denied entry due to observation by IO that we are certainly defaulting on RO ?
7. We are based out in Singapore since the last 7 years, alternatively rather than deferring renewal (until RO is met), if we buy a house and choose to involve an attorney for petition on H&C grounds, should an investment makes our petition strong since it depicts our intentions to stay & settle in Canada are strong & RO was defaulted due to the COVID situation (which we will explain in petition).

Appreciate maximum prompt inputs, so accordingly we can initiate our plan to travel, as I already have an offer in Canada, however with all the above uncertainties, we are unable to decide.

Thanks !

Just to add, until your H&C for PR/PRTD is approved, it's risky to purchase a property.

BTW. I am a little confused. Are you a new PR? Were you away for the last 7 years or just 10 months? When did you first become a PR?

 

[diadem27]

Just to add, until your H&C for PR/PRTD is approved, it's risky to purchase a property.

BTW. I am a little confused. Are you a new PR? Were you away for the last 7 years or just 10 months? When did you first become a PR?

Thanks. Noted on the property purchase advise.
We Became PR in Jul 2018 and post our entry, collection of PR card & SINs we moved back to Singapore within a month.

 

[diadem27]

I think Ontario can be problematic for health care coverage too.

1. So are you suggesting, not just for the child but for us as well it may be a problem to avail coverage once PR card expire ?
2. Another question with regards to work, if we choose to form an incorporation for any business, will that can have any possible issues post expiry of PR card/PR status ?
3. Also one most important thing I just want to clarify, is living in Canada post your PR card expiry, in our case our PR status is also expired (as not met with RO & still staying to stack up days for RO), will this be considered as illegal ? What are the down side if ever IRCC find that out ? Also what are our options during that time ?

PS: By the time we will be inside Canada, we still got 14 months for renewal (so basically we are shorting with only 10 months in meeting RO).

Thanks for the prompt and insightful advices guys. Really appreciate that.

 

[armoured]

Thanks. Noted on the property purchase advise.
We Became PR in Jul 2018 and post our entry, collection of PR card & SINs we moved back to Singapore within a month.

When are your pr cards valid until?

 

[diadem27]

When are your pr cards valid until?

Aug 2023