Housing crisis in Canada

[YVR123]

Yeah, and Vancouver examples I provided are not even houses. They're just small apartments which you can hardly live in a humane way.

There was no possibility to compare a Vancouver house which usually starts from 1.5 to 2 million dollars, with a house either in Montreal or Halifax. The price difference, and what you get for that price are ridiculous.

There are many "not even houses" that are listed from 1.5 to 2 million dollars. Those are nice condos clsoer to or in downtown or the West End.

Those smaller apartments are fine for a couple or single person. But most will need at least a 2 bedroom unit if they have kids.

 

[Glaber]

There are many "not even houses" that are listed from 1.5 to 2 million dollars. Those are nice condos clsoer to or in downtown or the West End.

Those smaller apartments are fine for a couple or single person. But most will need at least a 2 bedroom unit if they have kids.

The message I'm trying to convey here is that Vancouver housing market is a terrible choice not only for low-income families but also for middle class families since they'll never be able to afford any form of housing there and live as renters in bad conditions to the end of their days.

While on the other hand, living a decent life in house with a garden, with your own garrage is possible for middle class, even for low-income groups in some really nice cities such as Montreal and Halifax. Actually it's possible in any major city in Canada except Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa, Calgary, and that's an appealing factor for new immigrants like me.

I really feel bad when I watch some amateur youtuber says "we recently immigrated here, and we're paying 1900CAD-2200CAD rent for this apartment." People can take a mortgage with that kind of money and have a nice house in a nice Canadian city, instead of throwing it into the garbage can every month.

We can't change the housing market, but we can make smarter choices that works better for ourselves.

 

[YVR123]

The message I'm trying to convey here is that Vancouver housing market is a terrible choice not only for low-income families but also for middle class families since they'll never be able to afford any form of housing there and live as renters in bad conditions to the end of their days.

While on the other hand, living a decent life in house with a garden, with your own garrage is possible for middle class, even for low-income groups in some really nice cities such as Montreal and Halifax. Actually it's possible in any major city in Canada except Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa, Calgary, and that's an appealing factor for new immigrants like me.

I really feel bad when I watch some amateur youtuber says "we recently immigrated here, and we're paying 1900CAD-2200CAD rent for this apartment." People can take a mortgage with that kind of money and have a nice house in a nice Canadian city, instead of throwing it into the garbage can every month.

We can't change the housing market, but we can make smarter choices that works better for ourselves.

That's totally a factor on where a new immigrate will start his/her life.

With fully remote work being a possibility for some careers/jobs, they could even settle in a village and work from home.

 

[Canadaforever350]

The message I'm trying to convey here is that Vancouver housing market is a terrible choice not only for low-income families but also for middle class families since they'll never be able to afford any form of housing there and live as renters in bad conditions to the end of their days.

While on the other hand, living a decent life in house with a garden, with your own garrage is possible for middle class, even for low-income groups in some really nice cities such as Montreal and Halifax. Actually it's possible in any major city in Canada except Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa, Calgary, and that's an appealing factor for new immigrants like me.

I really feel bad when I watch some amateur youtuber says "we recently immigrated here, and we're paying 1900CAD-2200CAD rent for this apartment." People can take a mortgage with that kind of money and have a nice house in a nice Canadian city, instead of throwing it into the garbage can every month.

We can't change the housing market, but we can make smarter choices that works better for ourselves.

Halifax is dealing with its own housing problems and the local Atlantic people are fed up with others moving into the area and inflating housing prices. Lots of recent incidents of crime against people moving into the Halifax area (slashing tires, egg throwing, etc.) since the locals are being outbid by immigrants/central or western Canadians. Plus Halifax has hurricanes and brutal snowfalls, its not the ideal place to live year round but the summers are beautiful out there.

At the end of the day, people could care less about the housing crisis. Buy what you can afford, rent if that's what you want. Housing prices will continue going up, there is no end to this. It is to the benefit of home owners to see prices continue going up and the government has taken the side of increasing real estate prices as being the new norm.

 

[canuck78]

I'm still in the process of getting my PR. While waiting for it outside of Canada, I'm doing my research about housing costs in various provinces and cities. I initially wanted to settle in Vancouver due to its relatively warm climate and beautiful nature, but now I realized that owning a home in Vancouver, Toronto or even in Ottawa is near-impossible except you're really rich. It feels like Vancouver and surrounding areas are for two groups. Extremely rich, and servants who'll pay almost all their wage to their post-medieval landLORDs for a right to 'live' there as long as their LORDs.. I mean landLORDs allow them to do so. We can debate how this problem can be solved? What caused it? How can we prevent it? for days if you'd like, but since we're not politicians in the Canadian parliement, it is nothing but a waste of breath for all of us.

I found that while a small studio apartment near Vancouver where you shit and eat in the same room costs 400k CAD, it's actually possible to buy an entire house with a garden, and a small garrage near cities like Montreal and Halifax. (Edmonton, Winnipeg, Saskatoon are relatively affordable too but I have no interest to live in these cities) Now I'm really considering to change my landing city just because of the ongoing housing crisis in Vancouver, Toronto and Ottawa. I don't wanna pay someone else's mortgage to make them richer and be treated like shit to the end of my days as a renter.

Here are some examples I randomly picked in the last 5 minutes(All are 10minutes drive to downtown at max):

Vancouver apartment for 370k CAD (1+1 small apartment)
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23595299/310-2012-fullerton-avenue-north-vancouver
Vancouver apartment for 399k CAD (1+1 small apartment)
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23656959/210-270-w-1st-street-north-vancouver

Montreal house, literally a short walk away from downtown Montreal with special car park and garden for 299k CAD
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23697501/1150-rue-duvernay-longueuil-le-vieux-longueuil-montréal-south#view=neighbourhood

Montreal house,with large garden and a car park for 280k CAD
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23687664/10385-av-audoin-montréal-montréal-nord

Halifax house with large garden and a car park for 299k CAD
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23669036/212-school-street-dartmouth-dartmouth#view=neighbourhood

Affordability can’t be the only consideration because housing prices are lower in some areas due to lower salaries and more limited job opportunities. Would not pick where you want to live by housing prices alone. The one exception would be lower wager jobs that can be found everywhere although minimum wage and taxes are different in every province.

 

[canuck78]

Halifax is dealing with its own housing problems and the local Atlantic people are fed up with others moving into the area and inflating housing prices. Lots of recent incidents of crime against people moving into the Halifax area (slashing tires, egg throwing, etc.) since the locals are being outbid by immigrants/central or western Canadians. Plus Halifax has hurricanes and brutal snowfalls, its not the ideal place to live year round but the summers are beautiful out there.

At the end of the day, people could care less about the housing crisis. Buy what you can afford, rent if that's what you want. Housing prices will continue going up, there is no end to this. It is to the benefit of home owners to see prices continue going up and the government has taken the side of increasing real estate prices as being the new norm.

Think the government has started to see that there will be negative longterm consequences if they can’t slow the housing price increases. Action should have happened a long time ago and would have been easier to do. Waiting so long has created a much harder problem to solve. Many countries are in a similar situation.

 

[canuck78]

Yeah, and Vancouver examples I provided are not even houses. They're just small apartments which you can hardly live in a humane way.

There was no possibility to compare a Vancouver house which usually starts from 1.5 to 2 million dollars, with a house either in Montreal or Halifax. The price difference, and what you get for that price are ridiculous.

Remote work may allow people to move elsewhere but the jobs available in the most expensive cities weren’t available in the other cities. Quebec’s economy was in severe trouble for around 20 years which is why housing costs are still relatively affordable and prices are skyrocketing after being pretty flat for a very long time. When it comes to Vancouver there is limited land to build on and people want to live there for the lifestyle. It doesn’t all come down to housing costs for everyone.

 

[YVR123]

Remote work may allow people to move elsewhere but the jobs available in the most expensive cities weren’t available in the other cities. Quebec’s economy was in severe trouble for around 20 years which is why housing costs are still relatively affordable and prices are skyrocketing after being pretty flat for a very long time. When it comes to Vancouver there is limited land to build on and people want to live there for the lifestyle. It doesn’t all come down to housing costs for everyone.

Agree on that. And rent is just the cost of the lifestyle chosen. It's not really throwing money away.

If someone isn't sure where he/she will live long term, it's better to rent first. Instead of paying the cost of buy and selling in short term.
Most of the first few years (if not longer) for mortgage is interest anyway.

 

[Glaber]

Job opportunuties usually don't change for most of the occupations from one city to another. As an accountant I can confidently say that my occupation is needed even in remote villages in the far north. Finding a job in any major city shouldn't be an issue. At least finding one in Montreal is neither easier nor harder than finding one in Vancouver. Same goes for chefs, healthcare workers, salespeople, barbers etc. Smaller cities obviously have less vacant jobs, but they also have less competition for those jobs.

Only spesific jobs like maritime engineers, petrolium engineers, some IT jobs must seek employment in certain cities due to the nature of their jobs. If your occupation is limiting you to Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa and Calgary. Well, I think you should settle in those cities even though there is a massive housing crisis is going on.

I'd like to clarify one thing though. I'm not saying people should go settle in a remote village and live with polar bears or anything like that. All I'm saying is there are other major cities in Canada with relatively affordable housing markets, which you can still enjoy a vibrant city life, and have all the amenities you can possible have in Vancouver, but live in your own house for the same money people rent a small 1 room apartment in North Vancouver. Everyone is free to decide whatever they like, but that's my opinion on this matter.

 

[scylla]

Job opportunuties usually don't change for most of the occupations from one city to another. As an accountant I can confidently say that my occupation is needed even in remote villages in the far north. Finding a job in any major city shouldn't be an issue. At least finding one in Montreal is neither easier nor harder than finding one in Vancouver. Same goes for chefs, healthcare workers, salespeople, barbers etc. Smaller cities obviously have less vacant jobs, but they also have less competition for those jobs.

Only spesific jobs like maritime engineers, petrolium engineers, some IT jobs must seek employment in certain cities due to the nature of their jobs. If your occupation is limiting you to Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa and Calgary. Well, I think you should settle in those cities even though there is a massive housing crisis is going on.

I'd like to clarify one thing though. I'm not saying people should go settle in a remote village and live with polar bears or anything like that. All I'm saying is there are other major cities in Canada with relatively affordable housing markets, which you can still enjoy a vibrant city life, and have all the amenities you can possible have in Vancouver, but live in your own house for the same money people rent a small 1 room apartment in North Vancouver. Everyone is free to decide whatever they like, but that's my opinion on this matter.

The only thing with Montreal is that it's pretty important to be fluent in French. You can still make a go of it without that but the opportunities available will be much more limited. Also impacts quality of living.

Of course you were just using Montreal as an example. Halifax was another example you used and the French bit wouldn't apply there.

 

[Western Mountain Man]

Halifax is dealing with its own housing problems and the local Atlantic people are fed up with others moving into the area and inflating housing prices. Lots of recent incidents of crime against people moving into the Halifax area (slashing tires, egg throwing, etc.) since the locals are being outbid by immigrants/central or western Canadians. Plus Halifax has hurricanes and brutal snowfalls, its not the ideal place to live year round but the summers are beautiful out there.

At the end of the day, people could care less about the housing crisis. Buy what you can afford, rent if that's what you want. Housing prices will continue going up, there is no end to this. It is to the benefit of home owners to see prices continue going up and the government has taken the side of increasing real estate prices as being the new norm.

I care about the housing crisis and so do all my neighbours.

The government would like newcomers to populate less dense areas, but this is Canada and most people are not accustomed to adverse weather conditions, wild animals, fires, language barriers, isolation, etc. The mountains and lakes always look beautiful in the photo's.

A city lot close to me just sold for 1.4M and now the newcomers are going to build a castle. I'm sure they don't have any concerns about our local community or the housing crisis. Doesn't surprise me that some are not happy.

 

[steaky]

Just a note to the 2 "Vancouver" apartments. They are in North Vancouver and were both built in 1970s.
North Van and Vancouver are connected with 2 bridges . The one to DT Vancouver is called Lion's gate bridge. During peak hours, crossing the bridge can take over an hour (instead of 10 min). But North Van is a nice city. Careful with older strata condo is for the extra cost owners need to pay for fixing and maintaing these buildings.

You forgot seabus which connected Vancouver and North Vancouver via Londsdale Quay and Waterfront Station.

 

[steaky]

I'm still in the process of getting my PR. While waiting for it outside of Canada, I'm doing my research about housing costs in various provinces and cities. I initially wanted to settle in Vancouver due to its relatively warm climate and beautiful nature, but now I realized that owning a home in Vancouver, Toronto or even in Ottawa is near-impossible except you're really rich. It feels like Vancouver and surrounding areas are for two groups. Extremely rich, and servants who'll pay almost all their wage to their post-medieval landLORDs for a right to 'live' there as long as their LORDs.. I mean landLORDs allow them to do so. We can debate how this problem can be solved? What caused it? How can we prevent it? for days if you'd like, but since we're not politicians in the Canadian parliement, it is nothing but a waste of breath for all of us.

I found that while a small studio apartment near Vancouver where you shit and eat in the same room costs 400k CAD, it's actually possible to buy an entire house with a garden, and a small garrage near cities like Montreal and Halifax. (Edmonton, Winnipeg, Saskatoon are relatively affordable too but I have no interest to live in these cities) Now I'm really considering to change my landing city just because of the ongoing housing crisis in Vancouver, Toronto and Ottawa. I don't wanna pay someone else's mortgage to make them richer and be treated like shit to the end of my days as a renter.

Here are some examples I randomly picked in the last 5 minutes(All are 10minutes drive to downtown at max):

Vancouver apartment for 370k CAD (1+1 small apartment)
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23595299/310-2012-fullerton-avenue-north-vancouver
Vancouver apartment for 399k CAD (1+1 small apartment)
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23656959/210-270-w-1st-street-north-vancouver

Montreal house, literally a short walk away from downtown Montreal with special car park and garden for 299k CAD
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23697501/1150-rue-duvernay-longueuil-le-vieux-longueuil-montréal-south#view=neighbourhood

Montreal house,with large garden and a car park for 280k CAD
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23687664/10385-av-audoin-montréal-montréal-nord

Halifax house with large garden and a car park for 299k CAD
https://www.realtor.ca/real-estate/23669036/212-school-street-dartmouth-dartmouth#view=neighbourhood

You can still land in Vancouver and use connecting flights to Winnipeg, Edmonton and Saskatoon. You don't have to deal with the housing crises in Vancouver. Besides, don't have to be rich in one's country in order to own an apartment in Vancouver.

 

[Canadaforever350]

I care about the housing crisis and so do all my neighbours.

The government would like newcomers to populate less dense areas, but this is Canada and most people are not accustomed to adverse weather conditions, wild animals, fires, language barriers, isolation, etc. The mountains and lakes always look beautiful in the photo's.

A city lot close to me just sold for 1.4M and now the newcomers are going to build a castle. I'm sure they don't have any concerns about our local community or the housing crisis. Doesn't surprise me that some are not happy.

I've probably mentioned it before but the housing crisis is a 50/50 issue for Canadians. Half benefit from the crisis and would like to continue (like who doesn't like 6 figure tax free gains year over year) while the other half can't get in/afford the rise to upgrade/stuck renting. It sucks for the next generation but new immigrants are able to buy in this housing market and bringing ample money from their home countries. I personally know a lot of Indians who sold land in India and brought that money here to buy real estate. It's really a 50/50 issue and as evident by the last election, flipping houses can get you elected as an MP and housing affordability isn't a big election issue for GTA ridings.

 

[GandiBaat]

Not as simple as not enough housing built. Low interest rates, speculation, foreign ownership (and access to the same housing stock as Canadians vs places like Australia that limits to new builds), allowing housing to become such a large portion of GDP, lending practices that encouraged purchases with minimal deposit over decades, etc. all contributed to the problem. Just increasing housing stocks will not solve the problem.

Supply is the biggest issue. Compare prices of Calgary and Toronto / Vancouver. Calgary has flat plains and a reserve of land for 30 years of expansion. Toronto and Vancouver have real and artificial barriers for expansion of land. Real in terms of geography and artificial in terms of NIMBYism, Green Belt, ALR. This is why Calgary house prices remain sane and Vancouver / Toronto go insane.