Parents and Grandparents Sponsorship 2021

[Sensible]

Permission to

**Update:

Here’s the link to google sheet.. please update accordingly:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JGDauKCsJZOZ3G5yPwHx7CBvKz4pXyffvCi4h9YX8Vs/edit?usp=sharing

Hi all, I know we all have been trying since long and we all are frustrated because of the system. Could you please pm me your
- email
- for how long you are PR or citizen
- for how many years are you trying ?

Helping Crish Malabar for the info, so he can start the legal fight.

Thank you!

Edit** - I’ll be creating an excel sheet for this and will post the link. Please stay tuned!!
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JGDauKCsJZOZ3G5yPwHx7CBvKz4pXyffvCi4h9YX8Vs/edit?fbclid=IwAR1qZ5go-6j-s6uAQi39kNFconOhYPg9kOPk-1FOZz9WETSUxOZPGgpr57k#gid=0

Hi, What is this excel sheet about? please let me know - I would be interested in expressing my views about the lottery system not working

 

[pgpapply]

Hi, I need some advise on the PGP 2021 online application regarding uploading photos. I have a hard copy of the Photo taken from a Photo Studio which has the Photo Studio stamp and all the required information. I also have the digital print of the same photo in good resolution (say, PhotoFront.jpg image)

Questions:
(1) Should I upload the good resolution digital image (in jpg format) of the face side (say, PhotoFront.jpg) and upload a scanned copy (in either jpg or pdf format) of the backside of the photo (say, PhotoBack.pdf) to the online application?

OR

(2) Should I scan (in either jpg or pdf format) and upload front side of the original hard copy of the photo (say PhotoFront.pdf) and then scan the backside containing parent name and photo studio information and upload that (say, PhotoBack.pdf) separately to the online application?

OR

(3) Should I scan (in either jpg or pdf format) the front side of the original hard copy and the backside containing parent name and photo studio information and upload them as a single file (say, Photo.pdf) to the online application?

 

[Aspiring Canadian]

To be realistic, only $500 deposit will also stop those ones who are submitting EOI for fun

This is such a good idea. This would have potentially given 100s of actually applicants a chance all these years. 500 deposit and weighted lottery based on the number of years taxes filed and preciously applied would be such an easy tweak and much more fair

 

[PhdStream]

Thanks for detail Info

Glad you find it useful, best of luck!!!

 

[PoutineLover]

When we ask for changes to the system, I propose they be similar to this.
Quoting a post I'd written around the beginning of this year.

Been shadowing this thread and quietly reading the exchanges here. I can try and understand both sides of the conversation here.

I moved to Canada in 2017, and didn't have enough of a 3 year history last year for sponsorship. This is my first time sponsoring. I haven't got an invite yet, and TBH I don't expect to receive one as it's already been 3 days since they started inviting.

In my opinion, I think the lottery system is inherently unfair as many keep trying year-after-year with no guarantee of being able to sponsor. Whereas another person can apply just once or twice, and then get invited just by sheer "luck". Now, most of you I think would agree that no modern state can be allocating resources on the basis of just "luck". There has to be a better system in place.

I do believe that something like an EE type system would be the best in this case. It should take into account the following factors -

1. Age of parents (older parents should be given priority)
2. Earning of the sponsor (Earning more does mean there's a lower chance of them being dependent on government benefits)
3. Number of times the sponsor has tied (having a person try repeatedly without success only adds to frustration, and can also lead to them looking at other countries in the long run - Canada will lose precious human capital this way)
4. Whether they own a property (shows responsibility & whether they can care for their parents)
5. A pool of potential sponsors should be made this way, and the sponsors keep updating their incomes based on NOAs, which would then adjust their position in the queue. Every year, the Government pulls out the highest ranked candidates based on their scores, and issues them the invitations. The points can be updated in real-time since they have the dates of birth of the parents/grandparents, NOA numbers, and when the profile was created in the sponsorship bank.

This will dilute the inherent unfairness in the lottery system where resources are allocated by "luck" and other factors will begin to play a part; as they should in any fair system.

I also believe that along with the sponsorship forms, a deposit of CAD 600 per person sponsored should be taken to desist people from unfair means. and irresponsibility of blocking positions even though they don't qualify. This deposit should be returned to them if -

1. They are successfully selected to sponsor, and
2. On submitting their forms the numbers claimed match with the NOAs deeming them eligible

The above will also encourage two things -

1. People will be made more truthful to the Government by disclosing all their income, as having a higher number in the NOA would better their chances of getting picked + add more revenue to the CRA (as a business owner, I know the number of people who have approached me offering services, but wanting to get paid in "cash" thereby encouraging a black/unaccounted for earnings which leads to a loss to the exchequer)
2. Duplicate applications will be discouraged. I know of a couple of people in my friend circle where 3 siblings are living in Canada and all 3 have submitted forms to sponsor their parents. That's thrice the chances of getting picked compared to only a single person applying. (In this case, there would be a CAD 1200 deposit charged from all 3 siblings, and if they get pulled out and don't sponsor blocking other people's ability, they are penalised by forfeiting their deposits)

I don't buy the argument that somehow having a points-based system like EE is unfair to anyone. It in fact encourages meritocracy! And meritocracy is the basis on which modern successful nations are built... not by allocating resources randomly...

https://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/threads/pgp-2020.646383/post-9109985

 

[PhdStream]

When we ask for changes to the system, I propose they be similar to this.
Quoting a post I'd written around the beginning of this year.



https://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/threads/pgp-2020.646383/post-9109985

First of all let me be clear there is no fair system at all.. any system discriminate one group of people and favor other. Below statements are just out of my curiosity, and my be for the shake of an argument, which I have organized as per the "factor" you have categorized

1. Age: why would Canada (and its majority of tax payer who has nothing to do with or no interest in PGP sponsorship) favor bringing old population and increase spending on health care, OAS (Note that parents and grandparents can apply for OAS, which is not a form of social assistant program that they can't take part), e.t.c;
2. Earning: with this factor, there is no relevance of MNI that the govt policy makers have setup for years. I believe, one has to earn enough, i.e., MNI+30%, to support their PGP. It really does not matter significantly how much more you earn than MNI. A loose example could be, it is enough if you can buy a decent winter jacket to keep your parents warm; price and brand of the jacket really does not matter.
3. #times and owning a properties requirement conflicts each other to some extent. When you own a property you enrolled to some 25 yrs of mortgage. Before 2-3 years back other than in big city, there was no different in owning a property vs renting it. I personally know many people, who did not bought a property and choose to rented because they were not sure if they can bring their parents. Some of them even moved to the US just for the sake of sponsoring parents (specially when they young with no kids or with pre-schooler) and some moved back to home after their kids get into high school. THB, I and my wife are thinking to setting a deadline to move back (its a long story) if we are unable to bring my in-laws;
4. How can deposit be 8 times more than the sponsorship fee itself, i.e., sponsorship fee is 75$ vs deposit of $600; something is missing here

Though lottery seems unreasonable to many, in my opinion it does not discriminate anyone and treats everyone equally, this is both the beauty and drawback of the system. Saying that, I think there are lot more improvement to be done, one being some kind of deposit as well as penalizing ($$) people who just submit EoI knowing they can't do that (there is a legal ground to do this, as all of us who submitted EoI signed confirming we meet requirement and understood everything regarding PGPS)

 

[saurez7777]

If a country, a government favored by the people, should have principles for the people, it is necessary to have a reasonable order. The previous methods, albeit flawed, had a somewhat sense of order. We reject this chaotic lottery method. This is a game, our parents are people, not objects to play, hurt our feelings, indefinitely delay or prevent our family reunion! Since the government wants to give some people a chance to play the lottery, why not give other people other options, for those who don't want to play this game? For example, waiting in line, or paying more to reduce the burden on the government, why not?

We refuse to play games, refuse to play with our parents who are older year by year...
Our parents have been in the lottery for 7 years! We really don’t understand why this lousy lottery is playing the destiny of our family! Time after time, loss and emotional hurt, why is it so difficult for our family to reunite? Isn't 7 years enough? This is not fair!

If the government sincerely cares about each of our families, please stop playing games! Please take the future of each family seriously. This is also our country’s reputation! Freedom, fairness and reasonableness, giving us a correct way and more choices, it isn't to force every family to participate in this gambling game and let a stupid game decide our lives! Where are our freedoms, our rights? We refuse to play, this is our life and family....because a country and it's government should be responsible and do what's right for it's people, rather than gamble with family's lives, with lottery games that determine the outcome!

Who of you are in the same boat and feel the same way we do? We need to get together and let this government hear our family voice, if they really care about family! Stop the gambling game for family!!!! Please join us fighting for our parents!!!

Instead of bashing the Canada, Canada is actually giving chance to some of us to reunite with our parents unlike other countries. Your chance will come, be patient.

 

[can2244]

Hi I have got police cetificate request. My question is what duration do i need it for? Would it be for 18 years of age till now or last 10 years of duration

 

[MuzafferQA]

Hi everyone. I am starting my application inviting my parents,
I know there is a link in the invite to create a account and upload forms, do i also need to create a account for my father and make him a primary applicant ?

 

[Canven84]

Hi everyone. I am starting my application inviting my parents,
I know there is a link in the invite to create a account and upload forms, do i also need to create a account for my father and make him a primary applicant ?

Yes, create the account with your father's email as he'll be the primary applicant. All documents (sponsor + applicant) will be submitted only to this account.

 

[MuzafferQA]

Yes, create the account with your father's email as he'll be the primary applicant. All documents (sponsor + applicant) will be submitted only to this account.

SO it will be just 1 account right? i dont have to create one for myself and upload documnets from mine as a sponsor?

 

[PhdStream]

Instead of bashing the Canada, Canada is actually giving chance to some of us to reunite with our parents unlike other countries. Your chance will come, be patient.

Its not bashing .. its a temporal frustration. A normal person would definitely gets pissed off if his/her life decision is based on a helm of a lottery draft. In my opinion, this kind of frustration will last few days, or even bit longer if this is the first 1-3 times.

I still remember when govt stopped PGP program sometime in 2010-11 just because they were not able to process and there were >160K applications in their backlog. I was not eligible on 2011 but in between 2011-14 I was eligible to sponsor my dad and mom, but was not able to apply. The turn around time back then was 15-17 years (for my country, not sure about other), between which most of PGP would not survive to unite with their sons/daughters in Canada. This was the main reason govt gave up, stopped PGP program and introduced much hyped "Super visa", govt really glorified this back in 2011/12. At that time I was really pissed. Then come a new IMM minister, who introduced paper based application with 5K cap, from I think 2014, where they ask us to fight with each other in FIFO race to mail our application on or after Jan 1, which was so not fair to those not living in GTA. After first try I gave up ... The govt, a new party on power this time, on 2016 did little by changing it to lottery system (I guess on year on 2018 or 19 it was again FIFO but online) but still there are so many flaws in the system.

However, a lot has been done so far

1. Cap increased from 5K ot 20K
2. Processing time reduced from 15+ years to 2 years
3. Online system to apply EoI and now to apply PR, this is so much convenient, though it is not accessible to some of us

As you said, hang on our chance will come. In the mean time enjoy your life, keep visit your parents or ask them to come here, and most importantly, work on backup plan what is you do not get it, at least think about different path that is possible to you and your family.

Best of luck to all of us!

 

[Canven84]

SO it will be just 1 account right? i dont have to create one for myself and upload documnets from mine as a sponsor?

Correct, only 1 account. The person to be sponsored is the principal applicant and they'll add in their application your sponsor forms.

Don't forget to add the "Use of Representative Form" if you are helping them with the application and you want to add your email so communications go to you instead.

 

[Dime]

Is there any tracking doc for people who have already applied?

 

[MuzafferQA]

Correct, only 1 account. The person to be sponsored is the principal applicant and they'll add in their application your sponsor forms.

Don't forget to add the "Use of Representative Form" if you are helping them with the application and you want to add your email so communications go to you instead.

Perfect. thank you so much. i was confused , tot i will have to create one as a sponsor and then for my father and add my mother into his account as dependant.
Guess this makes my work so much easier.