Any new information on the latest announced travel restrictions please post here

[armoured]

It is the law; it's an order under the Quarantine Act. I'm not sure why you think it's any different.

Agree. The simple analogy is third-party liability insurance for your car: you have to buy it from a private company; the benefit applies mostly to other people (or society); you are required under the law to do it whether you want it or not; pricing is often not 'fair' from the perspective of people paying it (i.e. they think they're never going to get into an accident and most in fact do not); and it absolutely does not matter if you think driving is essential or not (as some people in rural communities complain, driving is more essential in some places than others), you still have to pay it. (Of course like any analogy it's imperfect but I think it's a useful analogy)

Not everything that is perceived as unfair (or even is unfair) is a human rights violation. That's not how rights work (in Canada, anyway).

I think it would be great if they gave at least partial refunds for those that are allowed not to stay the full three days, and made some other changes - I don't think anyone is claiming that this policy is ideal or has been well planned or administered. Personally I think it was rolled out mostly due to political pressure - primarily the provinces blaming the feds for not being more strict - and without the detailed analysis to show it was fully necessary in the form it was implemented.

Anyway, complaints about aspects of it don't invalidate it legally, and it's far more likely it will be changed as the covid numbers change than due to to these (from what I can tell specious and doomed to fail) legal challenges.

 

[canuck78]

Agree. The simple analogy is third-party liability insurance for your car: you have to buy it from a private company; the benefit applies mostly to other people (or society); you are required under the law to do it whether you want it or not; pricing is often not 'fair' from the perspective of people paying it (i.e. they think they're never going to get into an accident and most in fact do not); and it absolutely does not matter if you think driving is essential or not (as some people in rural communities complain, driving is more essential in some places than others), you still have to pay it. (Of course like any analogy it's imperfect but I think it's a useful analogy)

Not everything that is perceived as unfair (or even is unfair) is a human rights violation. That's not how rights work (in Canada, anyway).

I think it would be great if they gave at least partial refunds for those that are allowed not to stay the full three days, and made some other changes - I don't think anyone is claiming that this policy is ideal or has been well planned or administered. Personally I think it was rolled out mostly due to political pressure - primarily the provinces blaming the feds for not being more strict - and without the detailed analysis to show it was fully necessary in the form it was implemented.

Anyway, complaints about aspects of it don't invalidate it legally, and it's far more likely it will be changed as the covid numbers change than due to to these (from what I can tell specious and doomed to fail) legal challenges.

The rates are calculated based on 3 day occupancy. If refunds are available you would need to be charged higher daily rate for the 1-2 days. People also have to remember like any hotel there is a check out time. If you get you results in the afternoon you may have already past the check out time. Before anyone complains about the check out times there are cleaning crews that come a certain times and have to do a thorough clean well beyond normal hotel cleaning. They already have a set schedule and can't come in later in the day/night and get the room ready for another occupant.

 

[canuck78]

Why not invite your significant other up in the paid room for some one on one TIME until you're room expires instead lol. Instead of wasting a good covid free room. #IJS

You are essentially proving that people still don't understand quarantine. Even once you get your covid results and they are negative you could still get covid. Although you are allowed to leave the quarantine hotel you must continue your quarantine at home and must remain separate from your spouse.

 

[armoured]

The rates are calculated based on 3 day occupancy. If refunds are available you would need to be charged higher daily rate for the 1-2 days.

You're right, and while I didn't get into the details and complexities of potentially overbooking and the issues you raise, etc, that's why I said only partial refund.

But given the level of outrage I suspect someone would call it a warcrime that they didn't get refunded on a strictly pro-rated basis.

 

[canuck78]

I wouldn't call it ' abuse of people ' but could easily come up with different words like dishonest.

The Hotels in my area call it a ' flat rate ' and many of the quarantined travelers receive their negative covid test result from the health authority
within 24hours. Then they are free to leave and finish quarantine at their own residence. Just can't understand why the hotels will not refund some
of their exorbitant fees? Hope the travelers leave a ' good review ' on how they were treated.

Because the fees are based on the 3 days. One of the big fees will be a deep clean of the room. If a person only remained for 1 day the daily rate would be much higher. Every hotel would then need to adjust their fees if you remained for 1 day, 2 days or 3 days and each would have their own daily rate. Can imagine the confusion that this would cause.

 

[canuck78]

It is an abuse in a sense it is forced on people who say they don't want it and don't need it. A customer has to know what they are paying for and has a right to decline an offer.

A person always has the choice not to travel to Canada. If your choice is to decline the offer you are essentially saying you don't want to travel to Canada.

 

[canuck78]

You are not making sense. Breaking the law and being fined and punished is a different thing and you can't compare it to that hotel quarantine thing. If they want to keep it , they have to make it fare. People shouldn't be booking for more than one day at a time or get refunded.It can create hardship on people who absolutely need to travel..If I just decided to book a random hotel room for 24 hours with 3 meals, how much would it cost? Doubt more than 200.

You aren't booking a normal hotel so you can't compare regular hotel rates and quarantine hotel rates.

 

[canuck78]

Yea, we know not everyone likes to follow the rules and some just don't care.

I've been in touch with some of the quarantine hotels and they tell me no one has come back with a positive covid test result. If they did, they're not sure
what to do? Just contact the health authority and wait for further instructions.

If this is true this is extremely disturbing that public health appears to MIA and is not verifying that those with positive tests are not going into government quarantine or an empty home/airbnb. Was also under the impression that public health was supposed to be vetting people's quarantine plans before leaning the hotels since many are still confused about how to quarantine properly

 

[canuck78]

See this as the only relevant thread here.

Been trying to look at Pet Policy during the hotel quarantine phase - don't seem to find anything besides booking a hotel that is 'pet friendly'.

Does anyone have experience in bringing a pet in when they come to Canada during the hotel quarantine phase? Does the pet have to go through a separate set of procedures? And is there any way possible for me to take our cat from my wife before she goes into the hotel mandated quarantine?

Tried searching their website - there's nothing specific regarding it.

Would call the hotels and ask about their pet policies. I know minks were able to get covid but unaware of the research about whether pets can transmit covid. CBSA can provide guidelines about bringing pets into Canada. I know in some countries you need to leave your pet in quarantine even before covid.

 

[canuck78]

You're right, and while I didn't get into the details and complexities of potentially overbooking and the issues you raise, etc, that's why I said only partial refund.

But given the level of outrage I suspect someone would call it a warcrime that they didn't get refunded on a strictly pro-rated basis.

Think there will be complaints if some sites gets their results faster than others, lots of confusion if there was a change in daily rate and you only got a partial refund, etc. Think the government is trying to keep things consistent and fair and although it appears like it is an easy situation do deal with it actually isn't.

 

[armoured]

For comparison, here is Australian reporting.

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/australia-hotel-quarantine-system/index.html

There will be complaints about any approach. Not saying this is better or worse, but it definitely is much more strict. (And also, some say, more unfair)

Note the main difference in Oz: a strict cap on arrivals. Due to this, some can't get tickets and/or are paying exorbitant flight costs.

 

[armoured]

Think there will be complaints if some sites gets their results faster than others, lots of confusion if there was a change in daily rate and you only got a partial refund, etc. Think the government is trying to keep things consistent and fair and although it appears like it is an easy situation do deal with it actually isn't.

Yes, I overall agree. I think it would still be useful (perception-wise) to provide a partial refund, even if it was government mandating to say you get $100 per day back, period, no more, no less.

But overall: I'm not claiming it's easy. I'm also not claiming it couldn't be done better or improved upon.

And there's a clear political issue here, of what the public is willing to accept, as well as what steps the government can practically take given the structure of industry, and the provinces and opposition sniping at them for every step they take (even if in some cases they would do exactly the same thing in the position of the feds and just want to divert attention from their own failures). As it is they're dealing with claims they're not doing enough (never doing enough), but also exaggerated and specious arguments that it constitutes abuse, human rights violations, and I'm sure someone somewhere is actually claiiming it's a war crime.

And it's also not clear that this is where attention / government resources should be devoted (i.e. if efforts in other areas wouldln't be better.) Clearly the actual follow-up on how much travellers have actually followed the isolation rules is a major weakness - but to a large degree, the resources/responsibility to do this is something the provinces would have to undertake.

Everyone has their preferred solution, even where impractical. I'd personally prefer something closer to (what I understand) to be the South Korean approach: flat rate, you stay until you test clean, no refunds (of any kind), no surcharges if you need to stay longer - and VERY strict follow-up on isolation rules later. You get the room you get assigned, period - room facilities are bed, shower, internet and TV - and you get the food you get. (Probably they could allow those who want to pay a LOT more possiblity to upgrade).

BUT: I don't think that's practical or politically feasible in Canada. And South Korea doesn't have to contend with many land border crossings (effectively zero b/c only land border is with North Korea).

 

[steaky]

That's a nice place!....Almost 5-star and not cheap for the thrifty traveler.
I would expect steak, lobster, and champagne for a quarantine room.

According to vid, you would need pay extra for those food items!

 

[Western Mountain Man]

According to vid, you would need pay extra for those food items!

There are many good restaurants with take out options near by and I wonder if
the quarantine hotels allow for delivery like they do in other countries?

I've stayed at the Fairmont previously and it wouldn't be my first choice because there are presently 17 available now.

 

[Western Mountain Man]

If this is true this is extremely disturbing that public health appears to MIA and is not verifying that those with positive tests are not going into government quarantine or an empty home/airbnb. Was also under the impression that public health was supposed to be vetting people's quarantine plans before leaning the hotels since many are still confused about how to quarantine properly

The public health authority is in contact with the quarantine hotels on a daily basis as the covid test results are being processed and
they are aware of the travelers quarantine plans after landing. The hotels I have been in contact with have told me there have been
no positive test results come back for the quarantined travelers. That's good !

I don't know of any special ' government quarantine hotels ' for covid positive travelers in this area?
Sure seems like there is a political agenda behind this 3-day quarantine program.... Probably do more harm than good!