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Outland Sponsor: Proof of Severing Ties with Country of Study

wha2do

Newbie
Sep 12, 2019
3
0
Hi community,

My husband (PA, Kenyan citizen) and I (Canadian citizen) applied for outland PR from China in February 2019, submitted medical July 2019, gave biometrics August 2019, and now (Sept) our application is currently in Hong Kong.

This week, we received a procedural fairness letter from Hong Kong stating the following:

I have reviewed all documentation and information submitted in support of your immigration application. I have concerns that you are not coming to Canada to establish permanent residence and your sponsor is not prepared to reside in Canada when you become a permanent resident. In particular, I noted that you and your sponsor intend to continue with your studies in China and will establish in Canada permanently until year 2022. You are unable to submit reliable evidence to support the plan provided by you and your sponsor concerning her intention to re-establish herself in Canada once you are issued an immigrant visa. I have concerns that you are unable to submit reliable evidence to demonstrate that your sponsor has made efforts or is in the process of a) severing her ties to her current place of normal residence and b) reestablishing her permanent residency in Canada.

I, therefore, have concerns that you do not meet the requirements as stated under subsection 70(1)(b) and your sponsor does not meet the requirements of a sponsor under subsection 130(2) of the Immigration Regulations. Consequently, I have concerns that you do not meet the requirements of a member of the family class under subsection 12(1) of the Immigration Act. I would like to give you an opportunity to respond to this information.

You are advised to submit substantial proof of your sponsor’s genuine intent to return to Canada, including but not limited to:
- credible evidence of your and your sponsor’s plans to establish yourself and your family in Canada;
- credible evidence that you and your sponsor have severed, or have begun to severe, your ties to China (e.g. withdrawal from your studies, termination of lease, evidence of transition of financial interests and assets from China to Canada, sales or confirmed shipment of furniture, transition of financial interests from China to Canada, disposal of other assets, etc.).

Note that the measures listed above are not exhaustive, and that you may show other forms of evidence that you AND your sponsor have both made significant efforts and arrangements to settle yourselves in Canada, for the purpose of establishing and living there permanently.


Our current situation is that I'm only doing a postgraduate course in China, fully funded by the China Scholarship Council, with expected graduation date in June 2021. My husband was originally going to receive the same scholarship but it fell through last minute, so our original date of 2022 should now be 2021 (although I'm afraid that may not help much either). Otherwise all our assets and friends/family are in Canada.

It's just that we applied earlier thinking that the "intent to move to Canada" was respective of the 2/5 years residence obligation to maintain PR status. We did not realize that the move had to be immediate upon receipt of PR visa or even beforehand.

The whole reason why we are in China is to take the opportunity of the fully funded education in order to improve our chances of job search in Canada, and also to be together.

We're really in a catch right now, because we have a newborn (born in Canada this year!) with us, and so I do not want to go through the cost, time, energy, pain of having to reapply for the PR closer to my expected graduation date (I'll have thesis and defense at that time too, hence why we applied earlier). Yet, it's also not worth it to withdraw from my studies and research responsibilities without even getting an acceptance for PR for my husband.

Any experience or advice would be super helpful!
My questions right now are:
1. Would explaining our intended move in 2021 be valid?
2. Or is "intent to return to Canada" to move immediately, and so would I need to withdraw from my studies?


Thank you!

Sincerely,
Stressed

-

Edit #1:
I consider myself a "factual resident of Canada" given my current study abroad situation. Does that count towards residing in Canada if I'm only away temporarily like this?
 
Last edited:

YVR123

VIP Member
Jul 27, 2017
7,378
2,869
You are NOT temporyarily away. You are not living in Canada while studying for you post grad degree (I don't believe you can be done in a few months). So you are NOT residing in Canada.
You should have waited till you are ready or close to be ready to apply. I have seen other cases that IRCC requested proof of intend to move right after PR is approved. Not to wait 2 or 3 years.
 

Hurlabrick

Champion Member
Sep 4, 2016
2,358
575
Ottawa, ON
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
23-06-2016
AOR Received.
12-07-2016
File Transfer...
23-08-2016
Med's Done....
08-06-2016
Passport Req..
21-12-2016
VISA ISSUED...
24-12-2016
LANDED..........
11-04-2017
1. Would explaining our intended move in 2021 be valid?
No. Still waaaaayyyyy too far in the future as far as IRCC are concerned

2. Or is "intent to return to Canada" to move immediately, and so would I need to withdraw from my studies?
Intent to return is either immediate or certainly within a couple of months of approval. They expect you to be making concrete plan to return within months at the time you orig8nally apply.

I doubt they would believe you now if you promise to withdraw from your studies. I suggest you need to chalk this one up to experience and either withdraw you app now (if you can) or accept the refusal, then reapply again when you are either back in Canada or you can both PROVE 8ntention to return to Canada within say 3 - 6 months at most.


Sorry, I am sure this is not what you want to hear!
 
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zardoz

VIP Member
Feb 2, 2013
13,298
2,167
Canada
Category........
FAM
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
16-02-2013
VISA ISSUED...
31-07-2013
LANDED..........
09-11-2013
This case is another concrete example of IRCC clamping down on the use of citizen sponsorship of a spouse for PR but potentially intending it as a "visitor visa" instead.

Either demonstrably start the process of abandoning China or reapply when you are actually ready to return to Canada.
 
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wha2do

Newbie
Sep 12, 2019
3
0
No. Still waaaaayyyyy too far in the future as far as IRCC are concerned



Intent to return is either immediate or certainly within a couple of months of approval. They expect you to be making concrete plan to return within months at the time you orig8nally apply.

I doubt they would believe you now if you promise to withdraw from your studies. I suggest you need to chalk this one up to experience and either withdraw you app now (if you can) or accept the refusal, then reapply again when you are either back in Canada or you can both PROVE 8ntention to return to Canada within say 3 - 6 months at most.


Sorry, I am sure this is not what you want to hear!
Thank you so much for your advice. Very helpful and empathetic!
We did all the paperwork ourselves, and, even with all the research ahead of time, we misunderstood how immediate this move had to be. We applied early because of the impending workload (baby, school, etc) we anticipated and thought this made sense. Completely naive!
We stayed in Canada from January to July this year for the baby, and I did my postgrad research work at home during that time. My degree is awarded in China, but my advisor has been very flexible with my traveling back and forth.

Now my questions are:
What is the difference between withdrawing and getting refused?
ie. Would it impact our application if we were to apply again next year?
Would we have to redo my husband's medical and biometrics and get the PCCs again?
(I should be finished with my studies in June 2021, so I think we would apply in June 2020. )
 

canuck_in_uk

VIP Member
May 4, 2012
31,553
7,204
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
06/12
Thank you so much for your advice. Very helpful and empathetic!
We did all the paperwork ourselves, and, even with all the research ahead of time, we misunderstood how immediate this move had to be. We applied early because of the impending workload (baby, school, etc) we anticipated and thought this made sense. Completely naive!
We stayed in Canada from January to July this year for the baby, and I did my postgrad research work at home during that time. My degree is awarded in China, but my advisor has been very flexible with my traveling back and forth.

Now my questions are:
What is the difference between withdrawing and getting refused?
ie. Would it impact our application if we were to apply again next year?
Would we have to redo my husband's medical and biometrics and get the PCCs again?
(I should be finished with my studies in June 2021, so I think we would apply in June 2020. )
There won't be a difference whether you withdraw or get refused. Either way, IRCC will more heavily scrutinize your proof of intent to return.

Medicals are only valid for a year, so yes. Biometrics are valid for several years, so no. PCCs, yes for China and maybe for other countries.
 
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Hurlabrick

Champion Member
Sep 4, 2016
2,358
575
Ottawa, ON
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
23-06-2016
AOR Received.
12-07-2016
File Transfer...
23-08-2016
Med's Done....
08-06-2016
Passport Req..
21-12-2016
VISA ISSUED...
24-12-2016
LANDED..........
11-04-2017
+1 what Canuck said.

Only difference between wthdraw and refuse is that you MAY get some (ie not all) of your money back). But at this late stage, I cant be certain.
 

canuck_in_uk

VIP Member
May 4, 2012
31,553
7,204
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
06/12
+1 what Canuck said.

Only difference between wthdraw and refuse is that you MAY get some (ie not all) of your money back). But at this late stage, I cant be certain.
As they have already received a PFL, they are beyond the point of any refund for the processing fees. They will only get the RPRF back, whether they withdraw or are refused.
 
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Hurlabrick

Champion Member
Sep 4, 2016
2,358
575
Ottawa, ON
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
23-06-2016
AOR Received.
12-07-2016
File Transfer...
23-08-2016
Med's Done....
08-06-2016
Passport Req..
21-12-2016
VISA ISSUED...
24-12-2016
LANDED..........
11-04-2017
As they have already received a PFL, they are beyond the point of any refund for the processing fees. They will only get the RPRF back, whether they withdraw or are refused.
I did wonder if that made it too late to get any of the processing money back...
 

wha2do

Newbie
Sep 12, 2019
3
0
Thank you, everyone, for your advice and feedback. Our family really appreciates it!
Just an update:
We decided to provide a letter of apology/explanation regarding our circumstances and why we made the mistake of applying too early. In doing so, we also requested to withdraw our application (if at all still possible). Waiting to hear back from Hong Kong right now!
Now that we know this information, we hope to apply again at a more appropriate date. Hope this misunderstanding on our part won't affect our future application.
And hope our situation and your answers to our questions are able to help someone else in need.
Thank you!