Landed as PR, now left Canada for long term period

[usthb]

Dear All,

Landed as PR in Jan 2018 in British Columbia. Stayed approx. 4 months.
During this time frame in Canada, I managed to :
- Receive PR card for myself and accompanying family
- Obtain Health Card and Social Security Number for all family
- Prepare and send application to receive child benefits (pending application status at the time we left).

Due to personal reasons, family and I needed to leave Canada and return to country of origin. This is where we are now and it is also expected that we stay in country of origin for a while (between 1 to 2 years, of course without overstaying abroad; we do not want to compromise our eligibility / requirement of residency and physical presence in Canada as PR - in this respect we are well aware of the applicable rules). We returned our apartment / lease so we do not have an address in Canada at this point.

My questions:

- What do I need to do in terms of informing Canadian organisms / various agencies that we are now staying outside of the country / not resident. Some examples I can think of:

- Inform Health Services that we are not residing in the country/ province anymore?
- Inform Child Benefit Organism of the same / abort or defer application?
- What else? inform CIC ?

Thanks if you could provide a sort of "check list" so we "check out" from Canada properly...

Appreciate any insight
Regards

 

[canuck78]

Those are the major two. If you have already received your child benefit you will have to pay that back so cancel ASAP. Since you didn't remain in BC for 6 months you were not entitled to MSP. If you used the services you could be asked to repay the province.

 

[mats]

Dear All,



Thanks if you could provide a sort of "check list" so we "check out" from Canada properly...

Appreciate any insight
Regards

If your objective is to claim the non resident status and thereby not pay taxes then you should inform CRA too, I think. Please look up that on CRA website.

 

[canuck78]

Just wanted to confirm that you do have to file taxes in 2019 for 2018 while you were in Canada.

 

[usthb]

Those are the major two. If you have already received your child benefit you will have to pay that back so cancel ASAP. Since you didn't remain in BC for 6 months you were not entitled to MSP. If you used the services you could be asked to repay the province.

Are you serious about this? I had to undergo a serie of very costly analysis (CT Scans, ultrasound, blood analysis etc.) as emergency patient while being holder of MSP healthcard. Do you mean I have to pay this back? Where was this stated? Noone did inform me about it.
I did receive BC healthcard after clearing regular 2 months wait time. So how can I be non illegible and receive an MSP card both at the same time?

 

[usthb]

If your objective is to claim the non resident status and thereby not pay taxes then you should inform CRA too, I think. Please look up that on CRA website.

I basically did not earn any income while residing in Canada, I brought savings with me when landing as PR and I used this as the financial resource to live in Canada. In short my initial wealth did not increase (on a side note: it even went dramatically down).
So without any income earned, not even sure what money I would owe to the government then; I suspect that if I am to fill for taxes in this case, it would be more for the sake of being compliant and satisfy the administrative formality.

Having said that, obviously, If I could claim to be not tax resident (<6 month stay), I would be more than happy to get rid of that burden.

Now I understand that the matter sort of interfere with MSP (<6 month stay means reimburse medical costs).
Can someone throw some light ?

Thanks

 

[usthb]

Just wanted to confirm that you do have to file taxes in 2019 for 2018 while you were in Canada.

Not if I am considered as non tax resident through 2018 on ground that my stay did not exceed 6 month.
Or am I mistaking?

 

[mats]

I basically did not earn any income while residing in Canada, I brought savings with me when landing as PR and I used this as the financial resource to live in Canada. In short my initial wealth did not increase (on a side note: it even went dramatically down).
So without any income earned, not even sure what money I would owe to the government then; I suspect that if

Thanks

No income earned means no tax to be paid but better check with an accountant or tax filing company.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

Are you serious about this? I had to undergo a serie of very costly analysis (CT Scans, ultrasound, blood analysis etc.) as emergency patient while being holder of MSP healthcard. Do you mean I have to pay this back? Where was this stated? Noone did inform me about it.
I did receive BC healthcard after clearing regular 2 months wait time. So how can I be non illegible and receive an MSP card both at the same time?

Very serious. It is clearly stated on the MSP website that you must meet the residency requirement of 6 months/year to qualify for coverage. This is to prevent people from doing what you have essentially done: come to Canada for a short time, use the healthcare system and leave.

 

[usthb]

Very serious. It is clearly stated on the MSP website that you must meet the residency requirement of 6 months/year to qualify for coverage. This is to prevent people from doing what you have essentially done: come to Canada for a short time, use the healthcare system and leave.

Unacceptable statement. I landed in Canada to settle, and I needed to quit due to personal unexpected reason - FACT OF LIFE. Wisdom mandate to stick to statement/facts. You seem to insinuate that I did come to Canada to intentionally take advantage / abuse the system. There is a judgment of intention here and implication that the situation I went through was sort of - constructed -. Could you prove it?

Furthermore either you did not read my post well or there is something else. I did say that I was admitted as EMERGENCY patient. Ironically, is that so that emergency should be planned in advance and adequately so it does not occur as an offense to the system which is supported by tax payers?

I read the MSP website and this is what it says:

QUOTE
A person must be a B.C. resident to qualify for medical coverage under MSP. A resident is a person who meets all of the following conditions:

• must be a citizen of Canada or be lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence;
• must make his or her home in B.C.; and
• must be physically present in B.C. at least six months in a calendar year, or a shorter prescribed period.*

* Eligible B.C. residents (citizens of Canada or persons who are lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence) who are outside B.C. for vacation purposes only, are allowed a total absence of up to seven months in a calendar year.
UNQUOTE

I do not see where it is stated that when I loose eligibility for coverage, it applies with RETROACTIVE EFFECTS consequence of which that I will have to make reimbursements. Furthermore, what you state would also mean that I have been CONDITIONALLY enrolled into MSP, so anyone who gets sick and is not sure about his plan to reside in the country or not - should immediately and as humanly as possible hold back from going to hospital and get a private plan to cover emergency care.

I for sure will seek for further advice, I wonder what can explain the too many flaws in the reasoning here if not a logic of denouncing abuse to the system that went one step too far.

 

[canuck78]

Unacceptable statement. I landed in Canada to settle, and I needed to quit due to personal unexpected reason - FACT OF LIFE. Wisdom mandate to stick to statement/facts. You seem to insinuate that I did come to Canada to intentionally take advantage / abuse the system. There is a judgment of intention here and implication that the situation I went through was sort of - constructed -. Could you prove it?

Furthermore either you did not read my post well or there is something else. I did say that I was admitted as EMERGENCY patient. Ironically, is that so that emergency should be planned in advance and adequately so it does not occur as an offense to the system which is supported by tax payers?

I read the MSP website and this is what it says:

QUOTE
A person must be a B.C. resident to qualify for medical coverage under MSP. A resident is a person who meets all of the following conditions:

• must be a citizen of Canada or be lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence;
• must make his or her home in B.C.; and
• must be physically present in B.C. at least six months in a calendar year, or a shorter prescribed period.*

* Eligible B.C. residents (citizens of Canada or persons who are lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence) who are outside B.C. for vacation purposes only, are allowed a total absence of up to seven months in a calendar year.
UNQUOTE

I do not see where it is stated that when I loose eligibility for coverage, it applies with RETROACTIVE EFFECTS consequence of which that I will have to make reimbursements. Furthermore, what you state would also mean that I have been CONDITIONALLY enrolled into MSP, so anyone who gets sick and is not sure about his plan to reside in the country or not - should immediately and as humanly as possible hold back from going to hospital and get a private plan to cover emergency care.

I for sure will seek for further advice, I wonder what can explain the too many flaws in the reasoning here if not a logic of denouncing abuse to the system that went one step too far.

It is to prevent people from coming into the country and using tons of medical care without contributing to the tax base. This is the case in all of the provinces. All depends on whether the provinces wants to seek reimbursement. People could arrive seeking complex surgery and a long hospital stay and then return to their home country forever.

 

[canuck78]

One of the reason there is a waiting period for the most popular provinces for immigration.

 

[vensak]

Unacceptable statement. I landed in Canada to settle, and I needed to quit due to personal unexpected reason - FACT OF LIFE. Wisdom mandate to stick to statement/facts. You seem to insinuate that I did come to Canada to intentionally take advantage / abuse the system. There is a judgment of intention here and implication that the situation I went through was sort of - constructed -. Could you prove it?

Furthermore either you did not read my post well or there is something else. I did say that I was admitted as EMERGENCY patient. Ironically, is that so that emergency should be planned in advance and adequately so it does not occur as an offense to the system which is supported by tax payers?

I read the MSP website and this is what it says:

QUOTE
A person must be a B.C. resident to qualify for medical coverage under MSP. A resident is a person who meets all of the following conditions:

• must be a citizen of Canada or be lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence;
• must make his or her home in B.C.; and
• must be physically present in B.C. at least six months in a calendar year, or a shorter prescribed period.*

* Eligible B.C. residents (citizens of Canada or persons who are lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence) who are outside B.C. for vacation purposes only, are allowed a total absence of up to seven months in a calendar year.
UNQUOTE

I do not see where it is stated that when I loose eligibility for coverage, it applies with RETROACTIVE EFFECTS consequence of which that I will have to make reimbursements. Furthermore, what you state would also mean that I have been CONDITIONALLY enrolled into MSP, so anyone who gets sick and is not sure about his plan to reside in the country or not - should immediately and as humanly as possible hold back from going to hospital and get a private plan to cover emergency care.

I for sure will seek for further advice, I wonder what can explain the too many flaws in the reasoning here if not a logic of denouncing abuse to the system that went one step too far.

Yes it is kind of retroactive. As they look how many months did you spent physically in the residence of that year and if it is not enough they can start claiming the money back for that year.
For the purposes of a shorter stay, there are all kind of commercial health insurance available.
The problem is that most of those health expenses are paid by the taxes generated in the province. So they expect people to be there.
And if you are somewhere you either work, but if you do not work you are at least a customer (and you buy food and cloth and renting) and thus you pay back in the taxes.

On a margin of your personal health. Temporary decrease of your savings is to be expected for a period of first 1-3 years. That is usually the time when you first start with survival jobs and then you move on a more suitable job opportunity. It is also better if both parents work (if possible) as it helps to restart life in the new country faster.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

Unacceptable statement. I landed in Canada to settle, and I needed to quit due to personal unexpected reason - FACT OF LIFE. Wisdom mandate to stick to statement/facts. You seem to insinuate that I did come to Canada to intentionally take advantage / abuse the system. There is a judgment of intention here and implication that the situation I went through was sort of - constructed -. Could you prove it?

Furthermore either you did not read my post well or there is something else. I did say that I was admitted as EMERGENCY patient. Ironically, is that so that emergency should be planned in advance and adequately so it does not occur as an offense to the system which is supported by tax payers?

I read the MSP website and this is what it says:

QUOTE
A person must be a B.C. resident to qualify for medical coverage under MSP. A resident is a person who meets all of the following conditions:

• must be a citizen of Canada or be lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence;
• must make his or her home in B.C.; and
• must be physically present in B.C. at least six months in a calendar year, or a shorter prescribed period.*

* Eligible B.C. residents (citizens of Canada or persons who are lawfully admitted to Canada for permanent residence) who are outside B.C. for vacation purposes only, are allowed a total absence of up to seven months in a calendar year.
UNQUOTE

I do not see where it is stated that when I loose eligibility for coverage, it applies with RETROACTIVE EFFECTS consequence of which that I will have to make reimbursements. Furthermore, what you state would also mean that I have been CONDITIONALLY enrolled into MSP, so anyone who gets sick and is not sure about his plan to reside in the country or not - should immediately and as humanly as possible hold back from going to hospital and get a private plan to cover emergency care.

I for sure will seek for further advice, I wonder what can explain the too many flaws in the reasoning here if not a logic of denouncing abuse to the system that went one step too far.

You can consider it unacceptable all you want but it is the truth. Unless you return to Canada and complete the required physical residency, you will not qualify for coverage.

I never said you did it intentionally. I said that the rule is in place to prevent people from intentionally doing what you have done.

I read your post. Emergency or not, it doesn't matter.

If it wasn't retroactive, any person could come here for 3 months claiming to be settling while actually just planning to use healthcare and then leave.

 

[usthb]

What I consider not acceptable is your way of making the statement explicit or not and that is not going to change. This is one.
Second, unless said retro active effects/consequences are stipulated in the terms and conditions, communicated to and accepted by the signee / applicant as such - there is no reason whatsoever that I am subject to reimbursements which have not been communicated to me and agreed upon upfront. Specifically, these supposed retroactive effects are not stated in BC health care website, nor are they stipulated in the MSP application form I filled.
Regarding the justification that you seem to put forward, there are smarter way to prevent abuse from happening, for example increase the 2/3 month waiting period for enrollment to MSP - which I believe is in itself a sufficient and enough drastic safeguard - anything else is an overkill. Certainly not enroll client and let them learn (or be misinformed - this is yet to be sorted out) - after the facts - what the rules are when these same rules are stipulated nowhere except discussed confusingly on a forum of public and informal nature.