Query regarding PR Card renewal (Got PRTD on H&C grounds)
- Thread starter manish_canada
- Start date
If you have lived in Canada for all of that time, then you meet the residency requirement and don't need to apply under H&C.
RO has nothing to do with employment records or bank account statements. Although some can be used to support meeting PO. Your NOA, even credit card transactions, visits to family dr...etc are other options.
I have live in Canada for 3 years.. what I’m saying is how do I prove my RO when my employer would not give me employment records and my bank account as been closed.. so please what other document can I present
Hydro bills?
https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/application/application-forms-guides/guide-5529-applying-permanent-resident-travel-document.html
Supporting documents showing that you meet the residency obligation
- You must provide copies of 2 pieces of evidence that can show residency in Canada in the five (5) years immediately before the application, such as:
- employment records or pay stubs;
- bank statements;
- Canada Revenue Agency (CRA) Notice of Assessment for the five (5) years immediately before the application
- evidence that you received benefits from Canadian government programs;
- rental agreements;
- club memberships;
- or any other documents that prove you met your residency obligation.
I hadn’t noticed club memberships, but if you are a member of a gym an invoice might work.
Edited spelling.
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I was surprised that OP closed all his bank accounts... Most people left but will keep bank account if they plan to return to Canada.
Having a gym membership doesn't mean that the PR was actually going to that gym; only that they had authority to go.
IMHO, one of the best pieces of evidence in meeting the R.O. is a bank statemnt (or a few, over a span of at least 730 days) showing `active' activity in the area where the PR resides. Showing activity at a local ATM, gas station, or other type of merchant, shows in-person use, verus a charge for buying something online.
I agree but almost anything could be said to not really prove anything. I provided lease and mortgage document with my spouse’s name on them but she could easily have moved out and we just not taken her off the paperwork.
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You should have some sort of employment records from filing taxes in Canada and tax records from at least 3 out of the past 5 years.
Following observations are in response to the @riversidedrive007 queries and are based on making a PR TD application by a PR who meets the Residency Obligation. This is, however, a tangent largely off-topic here, the topic being about PR TD relying on H&C.
@riversidedrive007 . . . If you do not currently meet the RO (that is, if you have been outside Canada more than 1095 days since July 2018), and thus are relying on H&C relief, that is a very different situation . . . which, in particular, in that case you will be dependent on whether the reason why you have been absent from Canada this long warrants H&C relief. Very different conversation if that is your situation.
Whether you are actually in compliance with the PR Residency Obligation, or not, is the most important element. If you have been IN Canada for more than 730 days in the last five years (or, stated otherwise, if you have been outside Canada for fewer than 1095 days in the last five years), you meet the RO and primary proof of this is your travel history.
Whether you currently meet the RO is not clear from your posts. It is not clear you understand how the RO applies to you, since you began your queries asking about how to make a H&C case, which is only for those PRs who are not complying with the PR RO. And other posts (in particular those I quote above) further suggest there may be some confusion about whether you meet the RO.
For example, you say you have been a PR since 2010, so saying you have lived "in Canada for 3 years" does not say whether you meet the RO. It is how many days you have spent IN Canada during the last five years that matters (time in Canada prior to July 2018 is NOT relevant).
For the PR Travel Document application, in particular, what matters is how many days you have been IN Canada during the last five years, as of the day you make the application for a Travel Document.
SO . . . If you make the PR TD application this coming Tuesday, that is July 11, 2023, for example, to calculate whether you meet the RO you count the total number of days you have been IN Canada between July 11, 2018 and July 11, 2023. If that number, the number of days in Canada during this five year time period, adds up to at least 730 days you are in compliance with the RO.
Stated in terms of days absent: if the total number of days you have been outside Canada in this relevant five year time period is fewer than 1095, you are in compliance with the RO.
As long as you meet the RO, your PRIMARY PROOF of RO compliance will be documented by the travel history you report, which is the information you give in response to item 5.5 "Time Spent Outside Canada" . . . when you fill in the dates you left and entered Canada, the form will automatically count the number of days outside Canada. As long as that total is less than 1095, you are in RO compliance. This, which in effect is your testimony given with the understanding of the consequences for not telling the truth, comparable to testimony given under penalty of perjury, this evidence, based on your testimony, is your primary proof of being in RO compliance.
Additional Evidence or Proof to Show RO Compliance:
Beyond the travel history provided by the PR, the PR applying for a PR TD needs to provide additional information in the application itself which will facilitate IRCC cross-checking the PR's accounting of days in and days outside Canada; most notably here are the PR's address and work history, which for most is information that will corroborate the PR's travel history, but at the least it needs to be consistent with the travel history. It is also important because it documents the extent to which the PR has residential and employment ties in Canada.
Then, additionally, the PR applying for a PR TD must submit a small amount of "supporting" documentation, and all that is required, for this in particular, is just two pieces of evidence which show the PR had "residency" in Canada sometime during the relevant five year period.
@YVR123 referenced, linked, and quoted the essential instructions regarding this.
These two pieces of evidence do not, in themselves, need to "prove" the PR met the RO. They need to SHOW the PR was residing in Canada, had in fact "residency" in Canada (not just residency status, but had IN FACT residence in Canada). These documents are required to support the PR's information in the application, noting (again) that it is the information in the application itself which shows the PR was IN Canada more than 730 days within the preceding five years.
Just about any document should suffice as long as it shows you had an address, a place you were living in Canada, OR shows you had employment in Canada, OR otherwise shows you were engaged in activity consistent with living in Canada, during the period of time your travel history locates you IN Canada. So, yep, a document that shows membership in a club in Canada at some point in the previous five years will suffice as one of the pieces of evidence to be submitted. Just about any billing to your name at your address in Canada (at the time of the billing, and of course during the relevant five years) would suffice as the other piece of evidence.
If you really do not have any such documents available, a rather unusual situation to say the least, you could submit a supplemental explanation of the reasons why you do not have such documents in hand (someone abroad on holiday might not have such documents for example), and perhaps include in the supplemental explanation a more detailed accounting of your days and life in Canada, information which could be cross-checked or verified.
How Important Are These Pieces of Evidence Showing Residency?
How important just two pieces of evidence showing residency in Canada will be, in processing the PR TD application, will vary depending on the PR's situation and history. A PR who has clearly settled in Canada, and who has been living and working in Canada for three of the preceding four years, who just happened to lose their PR card while traveling abroad, is not likely to encounter a problem. A PR cutting-it-close, not really all that well settled in Canada, for whom IRCC might question the completeness or accuracy of the PR's reported travel history, the quality of the supporting evidence could be important, and if not available, the explanation better be a good one, and not just true but believable as well.
Leading to . . . going well off-subject . . . but a tangent in need of clarification. In particular, for emphasis, the supporting pieces of evidence do NOT need to prove the PR met the RO. The PR's travel history does that . . . so long as the PR's travel history is considered accurate and complete. The supporting pieces of evidence showing residency are just that, SUPPORTING evidence that corroborates the PR's travel history, work history, and address history.
Thus, even though some evidence is stronger or better than other evidence, which comes up in the posts by @Tubsmagee and @Ponga, UNLESS the PR's situation and history are such that there are questions about the accuracy or completeness of the PR's reported travel history, the quality or persuasiveness of the pieces of evidence submitted probably matters LITTLE, as long as they are credible/reliable and in some way corroborate the PR was living in Canada during the relevant time, that should suffice.
Obviously, or it should be obvious anyway, if the visa office perceives any cause to doubt the PR's information, travel history looming large front and center, they can (and we see that they do) contact the PR with a request for more evidence. That's where the discussion about the quality or strength of the evidence comes into play, and the prospect of having to submit more evidence more fully documenting the claimed period of time in Canada.
@riversidedrive007 . . . If you do not currently meet the RO (that is, if you have been outside Canada more than 1095 days since July 2018), and thus are relying on H&C relief, that is a very different situation . . . which, in particular, in that case you will be dependent on whether the reason why you have been absent from Canada this long warrants H&C relief. Very different conversation if that is your situation.
Meeting Residency Obligation
Whether you are actually in compliance with the PR Residency Obligation, or not, is the most important element. If you have been IN Canada for more than 730 days in the last five years (or, stated otherwise, if you have been outside Canada for fewer than 1095 days in the last five years), you meet the RO and primary proof of this is your travel history.
Whether you currently meet the RO is not clear from your posts. It is not clear you understand how the RO applies to you, since you began your queries asking about how to make a H&C case, which is only for those PRs who are not complying with the PR RO. And other posts (in particular those I quote above) further suggest there may be some confusion about whether you meet the RO.
For example, you say you have been a PR since 2010, so saying you have lived "in Canada for 3 years" does not say whether you meet the RO. It is how many days you have spent IN Canada during the last five years that matters (time in Canada prior to July 2018 is NOT relevant).
For the PR Travel Document application, in particular, what matters is how many days you have been IN Canada during the last five years, as of the day you make the application for a Travel Document.
SO . . . If you make the PR TD application this coming Tuesday, that is July 11, 2023, for example, to calculate whether you meet the RO you count the total number of days you have been IN Canada between July 11, 2018 and July 11, 2023. If that number, the number of days in Canada during this five year time period, adds up to at least 730 days you are in compliance with the RO.
Stated in terms of days absent: if the total number of days you have been outside Canada in this relevant five year time period is fewer than 1095, you are in compliance with the RO.
As long as you meet the RO, your PRIMARY PROOF of RO compliance will be documented by the travel history you report, which is the information you give in response to item 5.5 "Time Spent Outside Canada" . . . when you fill in the dates you left and entered Canada, the form will automatically count the number of days outside Canada. As long as that total is less than 1095, you are in RO compliance. This, which in effect is your testimony given with the understanding of the consequences for not telling the truth, comparable to testimony given under penalty of perjury, this evidence, based on your testimony, is your primary proof of being in RO compliance.
Additional Evidence or Proof to Show RO Compliance:
Beyond the travel history provided by the PR, the PR applying for a PR TD needs to provide additional information in the application itself which will facilitate IRCC cross-checking the PR's accounting of days in and days outside Canada; most notably here are the PR's address and work history, which for most is information that will corroborate the PR's travel history, but at the least it needs to be consistent with the travel history. It is also important because it documents the extent to which the PR has residential and employment ties in Canada.
Then, additionally, the PR applying for a PR TD must submit a small amount of "supporting" documentation, and all that is required, for this in particular, is just two pieces of evidence which show the PR had "residency" in Canada sometime during the relevant five year period.
@YVR123 referenced, linked, and quoted the essential instructions regarding this.
These two pieces of evidence do not, in themselves, need to "prove" the PR met the RO. They need to SHOW the PR was residing in Canada, had in fact "residency" in Canada (not just residency status, but had IN FACT residence in Canada). These documents are required to support the PR's information in the application, noting (again) that it is the information in the application itself which shows the PR was IN Canada more than 730 days within the preceding five years.
Just about any document should suffice as long as it shows you had an address, a place you were living in Canada, OR shows you had employment in Canada, OR otherwise shows you were engaged in activity consistent with living in Canada, during the period of time your travel history locates you IN Canada. So, yep, a document that shows membership in a club in Canada at some point in the previous five years will suffice as one of the pieces of evidence to be submitted. Just about any billing to your name at your address in Canada (at the time of the billing, and of course during the relevant five years) would suffice as the other piece of evidence.
If you really do not have any such documents available, a rather unusual situation to say the least, you could submit a supplemental explanation of the reasons why you do not have such documents in hand (someone abroad on holiday might not have such documents for example), and perhaps include in the supplemental explanation a more detailed accounting of your days and life in Canada, information which could be cross-checked or verified.
How Important Are These Pieces of Evidence Showing Residency?
How important just two pieces of evidence showing residency in Canada will be, in processing the PR TD application, will vary depending on the PR's situation and history. A PR who has clearly settled in Canada, and who has been living and working in Canada for three of the preceding four years, who just happened to lose their PR card while traveling abroad, is not likely to encounter a problem. A PR cutting-it-close, not really all that well settled in Canada, for whom IRCC might question the completeness or accuracy of the PR's reported travel history, the quality of the supporting evidence could be important, and if not available, the explanation better be a good one, and not just true but believable as well.
Leading to . . . going well off-subject . . . but a tangent in need of clarification. In particular, for emphasis, the supporting pieces of evidence do NOT need to prove the PR met the RO. The PR's travel history does that . . . so long as the PR's travel history is considered accurate and complete. The supporting pieces of evidence showing residency are just that, SUPPORTING evidence that corroborates the PR's travel history, work history, and address history.
Thus, even though some evidence is stronger or better than other evidence, which comes up in the posts by @Tubsmagee and @Ponga, UNLESS the PR's situation and history are such that there are questions about the accuracy or completeness of the PR's reported travel history, the quality or persuasiveness of the pieces of evidence submitted probably matters LITTLE, as long as they are credible/reliable and in some way corroborate the PR was living in Canada during the relevant time, that should suffice.
Obviously, or it should be obvious anyway, if the visa office perceives any cause to doubt the PR's information, travel history looming large front and center, they can (and we see that they do) contact the PR with a request for more evidence. That's where the discussion about the quality or strength of the evidence comes into play, and the prospect of having to submit more evidence more fully documenting the claimed period of time in Canada.
Your employer is required to provide an ROE. If your employer is refusing to cooperate, contact Service Canada.
No bank, no employment, no housing documents, are you living on the street? Maybe a detailed explanation as someone mentioned above, and a signed statement from someone else (friend, shelter worker, co-worker) who can attest to your being resident during this period.
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