Unique situatio. need advice!!

[valenti]

Hi, I will be proposing to my girl this July and i have a bunch of questions. We want to live in Ontario Canada.

Here's the facts:

I an a permanent resident (green card) in the USA. I've lived in Florida for about 15 years.
I am a citizen of Belarus.
I am 23 years old and hold an AA degree (dunno if that's relevant).
I have no criminal record and am healthy.

She is a Canadian citizen residing in Ontario.
She is 18 years old and a college student.

We want to get married sometime next year.


Does the fact that i have a Belarusian citizenship matter? will it slow down the application or make it more complex? Will the country of Belarus be involved?
(if so sending paper work back and forth overseas sounds lengthy)

I'm thinking that it might be better for me to get a U.S. citizenship first (later get dual citizenship in Canada) so that i can later go back and forth between the states and Canada and Belarus wouldn't even be involved.
But that will lengthen the processes by 5 months since i would have to wait for the U.S. naturalization app to go through first. Is it worth it? Can i apply for both US citizenship AND the Canadian visa at the same time?

Now from what i hear the only way to apply is if we are already married. The problem for us is that i live in the states and she lives in Canada. I would not want to live apart for the duration of the app.
So it would probably be best to get married right away in July and apply and then if we want after everything goes through have our ceremony. Of course if i go the US citizen rout i will first have to wait for that app to go through and THEN we would get married and start the Canadian app, lengthening the process. Will there be problems with immigration wondering why im applying to Canada when i JUST became a US citizen?

Now proving that the relationship and marriage is legitimate; If we were to get married and apply, would there be issues with proving its real if we hold off on the ceremony?
" err yeah we're married but have no wedding pictures...."

we have plenty of emails and pictures to prove the relationship but what if we don't have a ceremony yet?


If we get married in the states, she will then go back to Canada to do a semester of college and i will work in the states and we would apply Outland. Then after everything goes through we could have our ceremony and move to Canada. <---- (general "plan") good, bad? pitfalls?


Finally is the fact that she is a college student with no income an issue since she will be my sponsor? Will she need a steady, documented source of income to be a sponsor?

Thank you soo much for all your help. I really need your advice/thoughts. Thanks again.

 

[parker24]

Welcome! I'll just answer the questions that I found answers to! Or that I know!

Does the fact that i have a Belarusian citizenship matter? will it slow down the application or make it more complex? Will the country of Belarus be involved?
(if so sending paper work back and forth overseas sounds lengthy)

Your Visa Office would be in Poland, and it's actually a bit -faster- than US. Poland averages at 7 months (second stage) whereas US averages at 11 months. This is on the CIC website. (http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/times/perm/fc-spouses.asp#europe)

Now from what i hear the only way to apply is if we are already married. The problem for us is that i live in the states and she lives in Canada. I would not want to live apart for the duration of the app.
So it would probably be best to get married right away in July and apply and then if we want after everything goes through have our ceremony. Of course if i go the US citizen rout i will first have to wait for that app to go through and THEN we would get married and start the Canadian app, lengthening the process. Will there be problems with immigration wondering why im applying to Canada when i JUST became a US citizen?

I think you should just not try for US citizenship, it seems like doing that is going to make it A LOT more complicated. You CAN stay with her in Canada, but you WILL NOT be able to work or study while in Canada. Just drive to the border.. or fly haha.. and say you are visiting. Don't pack like you're moving though. You're visiting, plain and simple. You can get married in Canada, and apply that way. You can still apply as Outland even if you are in Canada. Just keep extending your visitors record. I'm not sure if Belrus is visa-exempt, if so, you won't have a problem getting a visitors record/visa.

Now proving that the relationship and marriage is legitimate; If we were to get married and apply, would there be issues with proving its real if we hold off on the ceremony?
" err yeah we're married but have no wedding pictures...."

we have plenty of emails and pictures to prove the relationship but what if we don't have a ceremony yet?


If we get married in the states, she will then go back to Canada to do a semester of college and i will work in the states and we would apply Outland. Then after everything goes through we could have our ceremony and move to Canada. <---- (general "plan") good, bad? pitfalls?

Like I said before, you can get married in Canada, take photos and then volia apply! Just remember you need medical and FBI clearance as well. Be sure to go over the application checklist several times!


Finally is the fact that she is a college student with no income an issue since she will be my sponsor? Will she need a steady, documented source of income to be a sponsor?

No, that's fine. But she does need to show how she will support you. She will need her Option C for the 2011 tax year. You can call Canada Revenue Agency for that for free

Thank you soo much for all your help. I really need your advice/thoughts. Thanks again.

I hope that helped!

 

[sakamath]

My views:

- Do not marry just because it would make it easier for you to come to Canada. Marry only because you love the person and intend to live together for the rest of your lives. If at all you do marry in July, have a proper marriage with a proper ceremony (and pictures etc too). Otherwise, it would be very difficult for you to prove that yours was not a 'Marriage of Convenience".

- You would still have to deal with Belarus if you lived in Belarus when you were older than 18. You need a Police Clearance Certificate (pcc) from each country where you lived for more than 6 months since you were 18. If this is applicable to you, you would need a PCC from Belarus. Check the Belarus embassy in US if they can help get you one.

- I believe, your visa office would NOT be Poland. The visa office should be at the normal place of residence (which is US, in your case).

 

[Swede]

- I believe, your visa office would NOT be Poland. The visa office should be at the normal place of residence (which is US, in your case).

By virtue of his citizenship, Poland would be the default office to process his application. However, if he's lived in the US for more than one year he can choose to have the application processed there if he would want to. Picking the faster office is attractive, but if an interview is required, typically he'd have to do it at the office where the application is being processed.

 

[valenti]

First i want to thank you all for all the input/advice

Do not marry just because it would make it easier for you to come to Canada. Marry only because you love the person and intend to live together for the rest of your lives. If at all you do marry in July, have a proper marriage with a proper ceremony (and pictures etc too). Otherwise, it would be very difficult for you to prove that yours was not a 'Marriage of Convenience".

Of-course I am marrying her because i love her. We have been talking about settling down in Canada when the time comes for us to be married, that is why i wish to make this a quick and painless process.
We want to have a wedding reception/ceremony-like party a couple months after July. Not your conventional preacher marrying a bride in a white dress type of ceremony. More of a family and friends (formal party) but no white dresses or limo-es or the "usual" stuff.
Will the fact that our ceremony is not conventional hinder the process in anyway?

- I believe, your visa office would NOT be Poland. The visa office should be at the normal place of residence (which is US, in your case).
By virtue of his citizenship, Poland would be the default office to process his application. However, if he's lived in the US for more than one year he can choose to have the application processed there if he would want to. Picking the faster office is attractive, but if an interview is required, typically he'd have to do it at the office where the application is being processed.

Just to confirm, since i am a permanent resident in the U.S. I can choose on the application to have it processed in Buffalo correct? I've heard different answers. All i have to do is choose it on the application and it will go to Buffalo?
I just don't want to go to Poland for a potential interview.

 

[parker24]

First i want to thank you all for all the input/advice


Of-course I am marrying her because i love her. We have been talking about settling down in Canada when the time comes for us to be married, that is why i wish to make this a quick and painless process.
We want to have a wedding reception/ceremony-like party a couple months after July. Not your conventional preacher marrying a bride in a white dress type of ceremony. More of a family and friends (formal party) but no white dresses or limo-es or the "usual" stuff.
Will the fact that our ceremony is not conventional hinder the process in anyway?

Nope. Ours was not totally traditional/conventional either. There was about 8 people there, not including myself, my husband or the pastor. There was no reception either. There have been several people who got married in court with two witnesses and got PR. Just make sure you have some photos of the ceremony, even just three works

 

[OhCanadiana]

Hi, I will be proposing to my girl this July and i have a bunch of questions. We want to live in Ontario Canada.

Congratulations!!! Hopefully she doesn't see this so it stays a surprise

Here's the facts:
Does the fact that i have a Belarusian citizenship matter? will it slow down the application or make it more complex? Will the country of Belarus be involved?
(if so sending paper work back and forth overseas sounds lengthy)

If you lived in Belarus more than 6 months after you were 18 years old, you'll need to get a Police Certificate from them - instructions at http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/security/police-cert/europe/belarus.asp. Note that CIC must receive the certificate within 3 months of the date it was issued so you'll have to time this carefully to coordinate the various certificates you'll need (the FBI takes 2-3 months to process theirs, but it is dated just a couple days before you receive it)

As a green card holder, you have no barriers to choosing to have Buffalo VO process your application. Parker24 provided the link so you can see the relative timings of the visa offices but consider that: if an interview is necessary you'll have to travel to your visa office (would you rather go to one in the US or Belarus?), if you need to submit information you'll need to mail it to the visa office, and in the end you'll need to get your visa and confirmation of permanent residency from them via mail after mailing them your passport. Combining that with the fact that you've lived in the US for 15 years already, and that if they need to verify your history Belarus would send your file temporarily to the US and then it would go back to Belarus, and the fact that Buffalo is fast enough, honestly, I'd just apply through Buffalo.

 

[OhCanadiana]

<breaking post into parts because it's too long!>

I'm thinking that it might be better for me to get a U.S. citizenship first (later get dual citizenship in Canada) so that i can later go back and forth between the states and Canada and Belarus wouldn't even be involved.
But that will lengthen the processes by 5 months since i would have to wait for the U.S. naturalization app to go through first. Is it worth it? Can i apply for both US citizenship AND the Canadian visa at the same time?

Having the US citizenship means you'll have additional freedom to move in the future, and can give it to your future kids. You can also sponsor your wife if she wants/needs to become a US PR in the future. It does mean that you will be on the hook for US taxes for ever.* You can deduct taxes you pay to Canada so you may not need to pay anything extra - or not. It depends on relative tax rates for your specific income and holdings.

As you plan this out, consider that you can submit your naturalization application 90 days before the 5 years are up - see page 22 of http://www.uscis.gov/files/article/M-476.pdf so you could start applying now and have completed the process before you move to Canada. FWIW, it's faster to naturalize in the US than it is to sponsor a spouse for PR in Canada so it shouldn't impact your move to Canada if you do the processes in parallel. Therefore, if your mind is made up re moving back to Canada there's no real pro to waiting until you are a US citizen.

I would try to make sure the US citizenship process finishes up first so you can wrap up your interviews and ceremony with minimum worries and while you are a resident of the same district. You can check the naturalization timing for your field office for N-400 (naturalization form) at https://egov.uscis.gov/cris/processTimesDisplayInit.do and timing for Canadian spousal sponsorship at http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/times/perm-fc.asp (step 1 is currently 90 days and then step 2, which is sequential, for Buffalo takes 11 months for 80% of the cases - see http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/times/perm-fc.asp; and even the fastest 20% of the cases take 5 months to complete so you are looking at 7-8 months minimum - see http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/case-processing-speed-at-visa-offices-step-2-t102206.0.html)

*well, for ever ends 10 years after you give up US citizenship if you decide to do so (unless you spend essentially no time in the US after renouncing your citizenship when different rules apply...but I figure if you're applying for US citizenship before moving, it's not to give it up shortly thereafter)

 

[OhCanadiana]

First i want to thank you all for all the input/advice


Of-course I am marrying her because i love her. We have been talking about settling down in Canada when the time comes for us to be married, that is why i wish to make this a quick and painless process.
We want to have a wedding reception/ceremony-like party a couple months after July. Not your conventional preacher marrying a bride in a white dress type of ceremony. More of a family and friends (formal party) but no white dresses or limo-es or the "usual" stuff.
Will the fact that our ceremony is not conventional hinder the process in anyway?

No, you'll just have to explain why you split it up in two (assuming you have plenty of evidence of your relationship to date). Plenty of people have had civil weddings first and then receptions.

Just to confirm, since i am a permanent resident in the U.S. I can choose on the application to have it processed in Buffalo correct? I've heard different answers. All i have to do is choose it on the application and it will go to Buffalo?
I just don't want to go to Poland for a potential interview.

Yes, 100% correct.

Conclusive proof:

"Applicants for Permanent Residence
You must select the visa office that serves your country of nationality or the country where you have been legally admitted for at least one year."
Source: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/offices/apply-where.asp

 

[valenti]

Thank you so much, this is a great relief knowing that i can apply through Buffalo and that an unconventional ceremony/reception is not a problem as long as there is substantial proof of relations.

About the U.S. citizenship: the main reason i wanted to have it is because I wanted to ensure that my application would be processed in Buffalo, and also later down the road we would like to live the winter months in Florida but i guess i don't really need citizenship for that. And now that I know that I can choose Buffalo as a U.S. PR I think i will just forgo the US citizenship. It will make things a whole lot simpler.

Again thank you all so much.

[for the sponsorship application]
Can anyone give me some examples how my wife (full time college student, no job) can show that she can support me? is her getting a job the only option?

 

[OhCanadiana]

Thank you so much, this is a great relief knowing that i can apply through Buffalo and that an unconventional ceremony/reception is not a problem as long as there is substantial proof of relations.

About the U.S. citizenship: the main reason i wanted to have it is because I wanted to ensure that my application would be processed in Buffalo, and also later down the road we would like to live the winter months in Florida but i guess i don't really need citizenship for that. And now that I know that I can choose Buffalo as a U.S. PR I think i will just forgo the US citizenship. It will make things a whole lot simpler.

Again thank you all so much.

[for the sponsorship application]
Can anyone give me some examples how my wife (full time college student, no job) can show that she can support me? is her getting a job the only option?

Since she is just sponsoring you, she is exempt from minimum income requirement (see below). However, she will have to show what plan you have to ensure you don't end up on welfare (e.g., savings, your job, offers from family and friends to stay with them, ... whatever your plan is). And, of course, she will be sig I g - and responsible for - the undertaking.

"5.33. Exception to minimum necessary income requirement
The ability to meet the minimum income requirement is mandatory, unless the sponsor is sponsoring a spouse, common-law partner, conjugal partner or a dependent child where the child has no dependent children of their own. This exception also applies to persons under the age of 18 whom the sponsor intends to adopt in Canada."
Source: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/ip/ip02-eng.pdf

 

[parker24]

I want to point out, even if you are a US citizen, since you lived in Belarus for longer than 6 months, you will need a background check with the police there.

 

[rjessome]

I want to point out, even if you are a US citizen, since you lived in Belarus for longer than 6 months, you will need a background check with the police there.

No he doesn't. He's 23 and lived in the US for the last 15 years. He only requires a police certificate from Belarus if he lived there for 6 months or more after the age of 18.

And there is one error throughout this thread I want to clear up. To be eligible to apply for permanent residence in a country other than your country of citizenship, you must have been legally ADMITTED to that country for at least one year. That does not mean that you have to live there for a year, just been legally allowed to reside there for at least a year. For example, someone with a student permit for the US for 4 years, arrives in the US, two weeks later marries a Canadian. They have only lived in the US for 2 weeks but they can still apply through the Buffalo visa office since they have been legally ADMITTED for at least a year.