Pre-PR Credit Time

[RajGill]

Seems we need to discuss, how the Pre--PR credit time is counted. As i came to Canada in 2009 and recieved PR on 2014. Would it be possible for me to take credit of 2012,2013 stay as 1 year.

If CIC looks back into past 5years from application, then I have already lost 2012 from Pre- Credit time.

Will appreciate, all of yours input.

 

[Wash an]

Thats my findings so far. Feel free to add. It's coming down to the interpretation of the law.

1. Canada Visa is a well known immigration and citizenship forum and lawyer is credible as well. I don't think they can afford NOT to implement the recent changes into their calculator. If you look at the wording at the start of their page, it clearly says that

"Did you know that Canada's citizenship laws have changed, and that permanent residents now have a quicker and easier pathway to Canadian citizenship? This calculator allows you to gauge when you may be eligible to apply for Canadian citizenship under the new laws."

which means that they HAVE updated the calculator on their website after the bill passed regardless of the effective date hence credible to use.

http://www.canadavisa.com/citizenship-wizard.html

2. CIC news letter also doesn't mention about the 5 year Pre-Credit time limit. Wording is

"C-6 will also:

• Allow permanent residents who had spent time in Canada on temporary status, such as on a work or study permit, to count up to 365 days of this temporary status towards the residency requirement."

https://www.cicnews.com/2017/06/bill-c6-become-law-june-19-changing-canada-citizenship-act-069243.html

3. This news letter also confirms that they have updated their Citizenship Calculator according to the new law. Wording is

"A new law, a new calculator
With C-6 to become law on June 19, readers can find out if they are eligible to apply for Canadian citizenship under the new law by completing the CanadaVisa Citizenship Calculator."

https://www.cicnews.com/2017/06/bill-c6-become-law-june-19-changing-canada-citizenship-act-069243.html

4. Comparison of the old and new law also doesn't mention about the 5 year time limit for Pre-Credit. Wording is

"Previous act: Time spent in Canada prior to becoming a permanent resident did not count towards the physical presence requirement for citizenship.

New act: Applicants may count each day they were physically present in Canada as a temporary resident or protected person before becoming a permanent resident as a half-day toward meeting the physical presence requirement for citizenship, up to a maximum credit of 365 days."

https://www.cicnews.com/2017/06/bill-c6-passed-giving-immigrants-smoother-pathway-canadian-citizenship-069248.html

5. CIC website also doesn't mention about the 5 years pre-credit time limit. 3/5 rule is mentioned separately and pre-PR credit rule is mentioned separately. Again the wording is

"Previous Citizenship Act: Time spent in Canada prior to becoming a permanent resident did not count towards the physical presence requirement for citizenship.

Citizenship Act with Bill C-6 Amendments: Applicants may count each day they were physically present in Canada as a temporary resident or protected person before becoming a permanent resident as a half-day toward meeting the physical presence requirement for citizenship, up to a maximum credit of 365 days."

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/news/2017/06/bill_c-6_receivesroyalassent0.html

6. Full text from the bill (which passed on June 17) in the house of commons say that

"(7) Section 5 of the Act is amended by adding the following after subsection (1):

Length of physical presence — calculation

(1.‍001) For the purpose of subparagraph (1)‍(c)‍(i), the length of physical presence is calculated in the following manner:

(a) for every day during which the person was physically present in Canada as a temporary resident or protected person under the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act before becoming a permanent resident, the person accumulates half of a day of physical presence, up to a maximum of 365 days; and

(b) for every day during which the person has been physically present in Canada since becoming a permanent resident, the person accumulates one day of physical presence."

http://www.parl.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/bill/C-6/third-reading

 

[_MK_]

Your time spent in Canada pre and post PR needs to be within the last 5 years from the date of your application.
If you read the following, for (1)‍(c)‍(i), you need 1095 in the last 5 years. And then it explains how you calculate it from days within that last 5 years.

(2) Subparagraph 5(1)‍(c)‍(i) of the Act is replaced by the following:
(i) been physically present in Canada for at least 1,095 days during the five years immediately before the date of his or her application, and

(1.‍001) For the purpose of subparagraph (1)‍(c)‍(i), the length of physical presence is calculated in the following manner:

(a) for every day during which the person was physically present in Canada as a temporary resident or protected person under the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act before becoming a permanent resident, the person accumulates half of a day of physical presence, up to a maximum of 365 days; and

(b) for every day during which the person has been physically present in Canada since becoming a permanent resident, the person accumulates one day of physical presence."

 

[RajGill]

This create extra confusion as nobody has clear answer to this as no clear guidelines how this law will be worded. Not yet sure I will have any benefit if pre-pr time as this way i lost 2012 and will be loosing 2013 eventully to complete 6months from 2012. Seems like catch up gain but then again you loose

 

[dpenabill]

This create extra confusion as nobody has clear answer to this as no clear guidelines how this law will be worded. Not yet sure I will have any benefit if pre-pr time as this way i lost 2012 and will be loosing 2013 eventully to complete 6months from 2012. Seems like catch up gain but then again you loose

There really is no doubt about this issue. None.

Only time present in Canada during the five years immediately preceding the date of the application will count. Whether a day counts as a full day, for time after landing, or whether a day gets half day credit, for time prior to landing, only days within the five relevant years count.

Insinuations or arguments to the contrary are totally unfounded.

 

[RajGill]

But i tried putting days in calendar shared here by any using that i am being eligible by Aug 2017. Even i talked to lawyer and they are not even sure about this.

Dpenabill - could you please refer me to applicable guidelines.

 

[screech339]

Since you landed as PR in 2014, you can qualify at minimum 2016. Two years as PR and 1 year credit as pre-PR credit going back 2012 (2 years prior to landing, each pre-PR days counts as half day). You can only claim max 1 year total of pre-PR credit towards citizenship. Even though the application looks back as far as 2011 (5 years prior to application), you cannot use 2011 towards citizenship.You will have 3 years (2 year PR and 1 year pre-PR credit) qualification in 2016.

 

[RajGill]

Since you landed as PR in 2014, you can qualify at minimum 2016. Two years as PR and 1 year credit as pre-PR credit going back 2012 (2 years prior to landing, each pre-PR days counts as half day). You can only claim max 1 year total of pre-PR credit towards citizenship. Even though the application looks back as far as 2011 (5 years prior to application), you cannot use 2011 towards citizenship.You will have 3 years (2 year PR and 1 year pre-PR credit) qualification in 2016.

We are in 2017 mid now so itsmesn half of 2012 is lost and i cant take credit so need to accumulate more days as PR

 

[screech339]

Oh right. Silly me. You could claim as far back as 2012. 5 years from 2017. But you landed in 2014. So you can still claim pre-pr. For each full day as pr, you lose 0.5 day credit. Since you landed in 2014. You should be able to qualif with 3 full year in 2017 with extra 1 year credit. Totally 4 years over 5 years.

If you waited until 2018. You will lose 2012 pre pr credit.

 

[RajGill]

Oh right. Silly me. You could claim as far back as 2012. 5 years from 2017. But you landed in 2014. So you can still claim pre-pr. For each full day as pr, you lose 0.5 day credit. Since you landed in 2014. You should be able to qualif with 3 full year in 2017 with extra 1 year credit. Totally 4 years over 5 years.

If you waited until 2018. You will lose 2012 pre pr credit.

My other concern is do they go back month by month when take 5 yrs is consideration from date of application? Fir instance is i submit my application in sept 2017 will they count 1095 days till from sep 2012. This way i loose 3 months credit right way

 

[screech339]

My other concern is do they go back month by month when take 5 yrs is consideration from date of application? Fir instance is i submit my application in sept 2017 will they count 1095 days till from sep 2012. This way i loose 3 months credit right way

Yes. But why are you concerned. You got 3 years as PR assuming you landed Sept 2014.

 

[RajGill]

Yes. But why are you concerned. You got 3 years as PR assuming you landed Sept 2014.

Because I moved to states and yet have to make 2 yrs post PR and its few weeks. Thats why want to know what credit i could count on from my pre-PR stay years 2012 and 2013

 

[screech339]

Because I moved to states and yet have to make 2 yrs post PR and its few weeks. Thats why want to know what credit i could count on from my pre-PR stay years 2012 and 2013

You needed to be more clear that you have left Canada 2 years as PR while living in US. This would make a different. Anytime left outside Canada would have to be make up for it inside Canada. You need to qualify as PR minimum of 2 years inside Canada in order to max out your pre-PR credit. Assuming you landed 2014, stayed until 2015, left Canada since and now 2017. You only got 1 year as PR to qualify. Using your pre-PR credit, you can only max 1 year towards citizenship going back 2012 assuming you file it this year. That leave you with 2 year total qualification. It's not enough. Since you need an extra 1 year as PR towards citizenship, you need to come back inside Canada for 1 year. But since you are depending on your pre-PR credit to qualify, you will need to stay even longer than 1 year to compensate for losing your half day credits. So by 2018, you got 2 years in as PR but you lost some 2012 credit. You need to compensate every day inside Canada for every 2 days lost in pre-PR days. So it is likely that you got around (guessing) 1.5 years to stay inside Canada to compensate your time outside Canada and lost pre-PR days.

 

[RajGill]

You needed to be more clear that you have left Canada 2 years as PR while living in US. This would make a different. Anytime left outside Canada would have to be make up for it inside Canada. You need to qualify as PR minimum of 2 years inside Canada in order to max out your pre-PR credit. Assuming you landed 2014, stayed until 2015, left Canada since and now 2017. You only got 1 year as PR to qualify. Using your pre-PR credit, you can only max 1 year towards citizenship going back 2012 assuming you file it this year. That leave you with 2 year total qualification. It's not enough. Since you need an extra 1 year as PR towards citizenship, you need to come back inside Canada for 1 year. But since you are depending on your pre-PR credit to qualify, you will need to stay even longer than 1 year to compensate for losing your half day credits. So by 2018, you got 2 years in as PR but you lost some 2012 credit. You need to compensate every day inside Canada for every 2 days lost in pre-PR days. So it is likely that you got around (guessing) 1.5 years to stay inside Canada to compensate your time outside Canada and lost pre-PR days.

Thanks for detailed response , I am only lacking 50 days to make 2 yrs post PR thats few weeks. But, my fear is loosing 2012 pre-PR credit time of 6months to add on. But if they look back past 5yrs, then I cant count on 2012 time and no body even lawyers have no clear explanation on this till CIC updates its calculator not sure when it would be? Any dates on this?

 

[_MK_]

Thanks for detailed response , I am only lacking 50 days to make 2 yrs post PR thats few weeks. But, my fear is loosing 2012 pre-PR credit time of 6months to add on. But if they look back past 5yrs, then I cant count on 2012 time and no body even lawyers have no clear explanation on this till CIC updates its calculator not sure when it would be? Any dates on this?

They wont look back past the 5 year mark from the date of application. Whats the hurry anyways. Just a few more months wait in either case before you are eligible to apply. Unless you plan to move out of Canada, stop stressing.
It doesnt matter if you had been living in Canada as a student/tourist/refugee/etc for 50 years. I repeat, physical presence requirement would only count for days spent in Canada in the last 5 years from the date of application.

I think Canadavisa made a mistake in their calculator implementation which has resulted in all these people asking/assuming misleading/wrong things.