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Post Graduate Permit Refused, School and CIC giving conflicting info

kiarash8

Newbie
Dec 1, 2015
3
0
Hi everyone

Im going to give you a very short background to avoid confusion. I'm currently a permanent resident in canada (Since August 2013) and my girlfriend moved to Toronto to live with me from England last year (September 2014). After getting a study permit and finishing her 1 year course, she applied for a post graduate work permit (PGWPP) in July. We just received a letter yesterday refusing her work permit, and the reason of refusal is very confusing to me. this is their reply:

Foreign Students in Canada are eligible for work permit for post graduation employment only if they have engaged in full time studies for at least eight months at a:

a public post-secondary institution, such as a college, trade/technical school, university or CEGEP (in Quebec), or

a private post-secondary institution that operates under the same rules and regulations as public institutions, or

a private secondary or post-secondary institution (in Quebec) offering qualifying programs of 900 hours or longer leading to a diplôme d’études professionnelles (DEP) or an attestation de spécialisation professionnelle (ASP), or

a Canadian private institution authorized by provincial statute to confer degrees but only if you are enrolled in one of the programs of study leading to a degree as authorized by the province and not in all programs of study offered by the private institution.


My GF contacted her school (Bryan College, Toronto) and they said that they are a private college that operates under the same rules and regulations as public institutions (fulfilling the second option in the list). they also gave me a certificate which states that that it is hereby certified that the above noted career college has been registered under the private career colleges act, 2005. but I'm not sure if this actually is the same thing that CIC wants from my gf or is it a different type of act that is unrelated to her case.

can anyone tell me how do I know if for sure if her college is qualified or not? CIC says they're not and the college are saying that they are. I called CIC to ask for more information and they said they cannot help me if I don't understand the rules and I have to seek immigration consultation. I told them I do understand them I just don't know how to find the list of acceptable schools or rules that they have to regulate under. and they sent me a totally irrelevant link directing me to the "determine your eligibility" page of post graduation work permit program.

Any advice on this will be much appreciated.

Also, theres another paragraph on this letter that is misleading too:

After considering all the circumstances of your case, it has been determined that you are not a person whose employment will create or maintain significant employment, benefits or opportunities for Canadian citizens or permanent residents.

This paragraph did not make any sense to me since there is no mention of this requirement (creating opportunity or significant employment for Canadians) in the "determine your eligibility" page of post graduate work permit program. Also I found out that there are other PGWP applications that have been refused for different reasons than mine (such as insufficient proof that the program of study is successfully completed) and this paragraph is still in their letter. is this just a paragraph that they write in every person that is refused for a PGWP? or is it actually an additional reason to refuse her application?



Many thanks in advance
 

scylla

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Jun 8, 2010
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Whatever CIC has told you is the right answer. It's not up to the school whether they are recognized or not and whether their programs qualify for a PGWP. That decision rests entirely with CIC. We tell international students posting to this forum to avoid private schools like the plague for this specific reason (plus the level of education private institutions offer is typically substandard). Your girlfriend is out of luck. If she wants to work, she needs to find an employer willing to offer her a full time job and able to obtain an approved LMIA so that she can apply for a closed work permit. Alternatively, she can go back to school for another year (picking a public college this time) to actually qualify for a PGWP. I suppose she could also look into the Working Holiday Visa / IEC program - although that doesn't open up until sometime next year and a spot is far from guaranteed. She should apply to restore her status immediately and change her status to visitor to remain in Canada legally. If she hasn't already - she must also stop working immediately.

The paragraph that doesn't make sense to you effectively indicates that your girlfriend doesn't qualify for an open work permit under any other criteria. It goes in every work permit refusal letter (i.e. it's just standard text).

For anyone else reading this - please, please, please stay away from private colleges. As I said just the other day, they are garbage.
 

kiarash8

Newbie
Dec 1, 2015
3
0
Thank you for that information.

one important question still remains, how do I check if a private school is qualified under the rules that CIC is looking for? I know now that her school is probably not qualified, but how do we know which school is ? is there a list of schools that I can check online? because they clearly mention that they accept the ones that operate under the same rules of a public institute. So I would like to find out how to differentiate between private schools that are qualified and those that are not but can't find any information on this by searching online.
 

evanstp9

Hero Member
Nov 27, 2012
367
27
She had to graduate from a designated institution, in order to qualify for the PGWP.

The list can be found here: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/study/study-institutions-list.asp


If that college is not listed there (meaning does not have a DLI number, it's a waste of time and money).

I feel sorry for her, but on the bright side, you're a PR, so you have other options available (sponsoring i.e.)

Good luck.
 

scylla

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Jun 8, 2010
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evanstp9 said:
She had to graduate from a designated institution, in order to qualify for the PGWP.

The list can be found here: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/study/study-institutions-list.asp


If that college is not listed there (meaning does not have a DLI number, it's a waste of time and money).

I feel sorry for her, but on the bright side, you're a PR, so you have other options available (sponsoring i.e.)

Good luck.
Even if the school has a DLI and appears on the list, this doesn't guarantee that a student who attends that school qualifies for a PGWP. The only thing the DLI list tells you is which schools CIC will issue a study permit for. To the best of my knowledge, no such online list exists for PGWPs. I have no idea how you differentiate between private schools which do and don't qualify for PGWPs. However it's entirely CIC's decision. The school has absolutely no say.
 

evanstp9

Hero Member
Nov 27, 2012
367
27
I had read somewhere that the DLI, which is as you mentioned for study permit eligibility, is also used for the PGWP in institution eligibility.

I cannot find the resource where I saw that at the moment, but I will post it as soon as I do.
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
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LANDED..........
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evanstp9 said:
I had read somewhere that the DLI, which is as you mentioned for study permit eligibility, is also used for the PGWP in institution eligibility.
It's not. Being a DLI is just one criteria the school has to meet - there are others as well. In support of this, we have seen a number of examples here where people were able to obtain study permits because the school had a DLI but then didn't qualify for a PGWP after completing their studies. There are plenty of private institutions on the DLI list that do not operate under the same rules and regulations as public institutions - and therefore don't qualify for PGWPs.
 

kiarash8

Newbie
Dec 1, 2015
3
0
Thank you everyone for sharing what you know. I'm not sure what our next action should be, and If we remain clueless until middle of next week we plan to seek help from immigration consultants, and the reason we haven't so far is the possibility of getting refused because of another ridiculous reason after wasting more time and money. I would definitely consider sponsoring her because we are in a serious relationship and I can't imagine living without her. but I'm not sure if it is the right idea to apply for sponsoring option right after getting refused for PGWP.

Is it possible to look for recommended immigration consultants in Toronto on this forum? or would that be advertising and is not allowed?
 

Neji

Newbie
Oct 1, 2015
6
0
scylla said:
Even if the school has a DLI and appears on the list, this doesn't guarantee that a student who attends that school qualifies for a PGWP. The only thing the DLI list tells you is which schools CIC will issue a study permit for. To the best of my knowledge, no such online list exists for PGWPs. I have no idea how you differentiate between private schools which do and don't qualify for PGWPs. However it's entirely CIC's decision. The school has absolutely no say.
Hi, Scylla! Been looking everywhere online about how to know if a school qualifies for a PGWP and I found this answer which, I believe, is right on the mark. However, I would like to ask if you have encountered here any cases of massage therapy graduates of private institutions getting refused of PGWP? Thanks!
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
96,930
22,889
Toronto
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
28-05-2010
AOR Received.
19-08-2010
File Transfer...
28-06-2010
Passport Req..
01-10-2010
VISA ISSUED...
05-10-2010
LANDED..........
05-10-2010
Neji said:
Hi, Scylla! Been looking everywhere online about how to know if a school qualifies for a PGWP and I found this answer which, I believe, is right on the mark. However, I would like to ask if you have encountered here any cases of massage therapy graduates of private institutions getting refused of PGWP? Thanks!
I would be surprised if a message therapy graduate from a private institute qualifies for a PGWP. I would assume they don't qualify.
 

Sonata95

Hero Member
Jul 23, 2008
260
4
scylla said:
I would be surprised if a message therapy graduate from a private institute qualifies for a PGWP. I would assume they don't qualify.
Hi All,

Is Message therapy graduate from a public university like mount royal university qualified for a PGWP?

Full-time
Between in-class, online and practicum courses, full-time students should anticipate approximately 30-40 hours of class time per week. Complete the Certificate in as little as 9 months and the Diploma in 18 months.

Link: http://www.mtroyal.ca/ProgramsCourses/ContinuingEducation/massage/schedcourses/index.htm

Thank you for your advise
 

MYBAI

Member
Jan 10, 2016
19
1
@ Scylia pls, im about to take a 2 yr massage therapy diploma course in a public school this Fall 2017 and im planning to apply for pgwp after. May I know why you assumed that this might not be given a pgwp? Is there any reason? Please I just want to know the reality at least it is still early. I will really appreciate uf you can give me some insights about it. Thankyou very much.