My fiance was refused visitor's visa

[nenasalas]

My fiance is from Mexico so naturally he requires a visitor's visa if he would like to visit me here in Canada. He was rejected when we applied in March which was quite surprising not to mention heart breaking and disappointing, as he already has a 10 year Visa for the USA. I have to leave Canada every time I want to see him.

Now he simply would like me to move to Mexico instead and look at our options in the USA as well. He has a great degree ..he is well educated and hard working, the most law abiding citizen I have ever known and we thought we had proved everything we needed to for him to come visit for possibly 2 weeks. Application was denied with the mention that they did not believe he would return to Mexico at the end of his trip. This surprised us both tremendously. He was devastated and we spent the entire night crying together on the phone.
We then decided that we would simply travel to the USA to see one another as required but as you can imagine this is quite expensive on both our parts.
The most surprising thing was the complete generalization that seemed to be attached to the rejection...that it is just assumed that a Mexican will try to illegally stay in the Country. I know this to be a complete and utter generalization as neither one of us are those types of people. We would NEVER try to do something so stupid as to risk our lives together. It really took us both aback quite a bit.

We are getting married in NY state due to this fact as well. I wanted so badly to marry him here with my friends and family but now we have settled on doing it in the USA because no matter what we love each other to an insane degree and this cannot change.

So we provided everything we could and everything required on the checklist. Rejected due to; limited jobs in his country and because he has family LEGALLY in Canada somewhere else altogether (as well as some family LEGALLY living in the USA) (his mother and sister who he supports live in Mexico a long with many more).
Isn't there even a process where immigration or some party cannot verify that the person has returned home ...on the very flight that they say they will be on?
He goes to the USA to be with me all the time...and we both return to our home countries - why? Because we obey the laws and want to do it all the right and legal way.
Any one have any helpful advice? Probably not but I have to try before I really consider moving away from my home Country.

 

[lellen]

Hi,

I just have a question, where do you intend to live after you get married? You call him your "fiance", that means you're going to get married and live together, right? I'm going to assume this is correct.

I am assuming that if he mentioned in his application that he is engaged to a Canadian woman, then the officer would assume he would get married to her and stay living with her. Which is exactly what you should do anyway... sponsor him once you get married in NY, or sponsor him now as a conjugal partner (which is what people who haven't been able to get married or become common-law couples for situations out of their control -like visas being denied- do).

I know what you mean about the generalization, I've had that happen to people I know without even a single reason for them to want to stay in Canada.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

When visa officers review a TRV app, they look at a person's ties to their home country, such as family, job, home, assets, school enrollment etc. These home country ties must always be considered much stronger than any Canada ties to be approved.

Unfortunately for you guys, a spouse/partner/fiance is pretty much always considered to be the strongest tie there is. When that spouse is a Canadian citizen or PR living in Canada, it almost always means the TRV will be denied.

If you want him to come live with you in Canada, then you will need to sponsor him for PR once you are married.

 

[mikeymyke]

I think the reasons for his refusal provided seemed valid (in the eyes of the officer reviewing his file), because he does have family members residing in Canada, which leads to the impression that he will want to stay in Canada with them, this is called a "pull factor". It seems unfair, but since CIC does not have the ability to read people's minds, they have to simply evaluate the application based on risk factors, and pull factor is one of them. Unfortunately, luck does play a bit of a role because an officer can be "easy" or "difficult" on your application.

You didn't mention anything about what he does for a living, so I'm guessing CIC was correct in saying he has limited job prospects. They might assume that his job is not stable or secure enough for him to need to return to Mexico for.

A TRV's risk factors such as poor travel history, lack of money, etc, some you can address (money, travel history), some you cannot (family living abroad), so you just have to hope you can address as much risk factors as you can.

I agree with canuck_in_uk that being married/engaged to a Canadian will make it difficult to be approved for a TRV, but that's not always the case, as you can see in my signature, my wife, who comes from a country even more "high risk" than Mexico, and already married to me, was approved for a MULTIPLE ENTRY TRV for the life of her passport. We addressed all of her risk factors with lots and lots of documents, and I think this helped her go from "slim chance of approval" to "best possible TRV result".

I personally think that a TRV applicant who is a fiance is more high risk than one who is a spouse, because there's a good chance the fiance will want to use the TRV to get married in Canada, and file an inland application so that he/she can remain in Canada until the PR application is complete. I know this is technically allowed by CIC, but it's something border officers frown upon because a TRV is supposed to be a temporary stay, but marrying in Canada and filing inland with a TRV makes it seem like you're using the TRV as a way to stay permanently. So maybe because of the fact that he's your fiance that might have factored into the officer's decision even if it's not listed in the reasons for rejection. And based on what you're telling us how because he can't get a TRV here, you have no choice but to marry in NY, and that you "really wanted him to marry here", it would seem like you were trying to get him to come here on a TRV to get married and they foresaw that, so they denied him.

 

[ashconnor]

Unfortunately for you guys, a spouse/partner/fiance is pretty much always considered to be the strongest tie there is.

That's funny because on another thread I was told that my relationship to my wife doesn't count for anything. Our marriage wasn't a good enough 'compelling reason to return'.

 

[Jalex23]

I think the reasons for his refusal provided seemed valid (in the eyes of the officer reviewing his file), because he does have family members residing in Canada, which leads to the impression that he will want to stay in Canada with them, this is called a "pull factor". It seems unfair, but since CIC does not have the ability to read people's minds, they have to simply evaluate the application based on risk factors, and pull factor is one of them. Unfortunately, luck does play a bit of a role because an officer can be "easy" or "difficult" on your application.

I agree with Mikey.

OP gives a lot of sentimental argumentation but no specifics. When people say "I have given them all they requested" and then we go on detail on their applications we find that mistakes were made, wrong assumptions were made and/or they missed to mention something when telling their story. A well educated Mexican with several travels to the USA will almost always be given a TRV unless there is something "odd" in the application. So I would think there were mistakes in the applications.

Regardless canuck_in_uk is right, the best way to do this is with a sponsorship for PR. Why do you travel so much to the US when you could easily get married in Mexico and then use that certificate to start the Family Sponsorship application? The TRV would only be good for 2-3 travels, after that his crossing will be tougher and tougher most probably causing a refusal after the third year.

That's funny because on another thread I was told that my relationship to my wife doesn't count for anything. Our marriage wasn't a good enough 'compelling reason to return'.

And it was true. Also, you are not Canadian and she is so your case can't be compared in any sense.

I know what you mean about the generalization, I've had that happen to people I know without even a single reason for them to want to stay in Canada.

A VISA is requiered for countries that CAN'T BE TRUSTED, therefore ALL people attempting to get into that country will be considered as trying to illegally immigrate unless proven otherwise.

It is not about not having a reason to stay, it is about PROVING you have no reason to stay. If you can't prove it then you will be refused. That is the whole point of a Visa.

 

[lellen]

A VISA is requiered for countries that CAN'T BE TRUSTED, therefore ALL people attempting to get into that country will be considered as trying to illegally immigrate unless proven otherwise.

I have seen people who have absolutely absolutely NO reason at all to stay in Canada, with awesome jobs in their home country, good money, travelling here for just tourism, been refused. They sent all the necessary paperwork, everything. In my home country, because of this, people seem to have the idea that Canadian officers need to fill a quota of refused applications. I don't know if that's true or not, but to me it sounds ridiculous so I always tell them I don't think so... but a lot of people seem to be convinced of this. I know none of my friends want to even try to get a visa to Canada. It seems to be a matter of luck sometimes.

Defend them all you want, I think sometimes they can be a little unfair and in my eyes, they're missing out on more tourism for their country.

 

[Jalex23]

3. He has 10yrs USA visa. Thats a route mexican takes. They acquire visit visa to USA then Canada because USA immigration and citizenship is harder for them. Canada is easier for that. I saw several pakistani travel countries like malaysia, indonesia, singapore, nepal, thailand for visit to then apply for Canadian visit visa, they usually gets this visa because VO thinks this guy travels a lot. As soon as they come in Canada then refugee then taxi.

In this case the US Visa is a great argument for a Mexican. No it is not the same as the example posted. Mexicans prefer the US to Canada due to more latinos in the area, better wages and the proximity to Mexico. Canada is and always will be a second choice for Mexican immigrants. Canada is basically the emergency destination when the US has proven too tough to immigrate and it was abused before the Canadian Visa was imposed.

In fact now there are some propositions to fast track Mexicans with US Visa in their Canadian Visa process as CIC recognizes that once you have a US Visa immigrating to Canada is very low risk.

So that is why I think OP did some very bad mistakes in their application.

 

[nenasalas]

Yes I have posted on the side of emotions but also facts. So what if we stayed up all night crying? I fail to understand your point to that? Of course it is an emotional situation. This is the person I am going to marry so logically there would some emotions attached to the subject.

His degree is B.S. Electronic and Communications Engineer and he is currently employed as a Verification Engineer (software engineer)

For the rest of you that have been supportive and posted helpful information...thank you! I see some of you actually understand the situation. Much appreciated!

 

[karenirving]

I am in a similar situation. My fiance and I have been in a relationship for almost 6 years and we have a 3 year old son together. I came back to Canada with our son one year ago because i had an amazing job offer and had to jump on it. Things were tough for us in Panama financially, so we felt this was something I had to do for the benefit of our son.
Now, I am settled and we are hoping to apply for a visitor's visa specifically so we can get married here and begin the spousal sponsorship application. However, I read in this post that that may be the quickest way for my fiancee to be refused?
I was planning to be straight forward and honest about our intentions, send as much proof, letters, pictures and so on to validate our relationship as we can and tell Immigration Canada that we are specifically looking for him to come to Canada to marry me, spend some time with family and friends, spend some time with his son and myself, practice his English, speak with potential employers for whenever his paperwork does come through and to get to know the country he will be living in. If he is refused, I can return to Panama and get married there... but we were hoping to have him here for a few months instead of me in Panama for 5 days and a quick wedding with no relatives present.
Is this the EXACT opposite of what we should be doing?

 

[canuck_in_uk]

Is this the EXACT opposite of what we should be doing?

If you have a 3 year old son, I imagine you guys have lived together continuously for at least a year and are common-law. If so, start the sponsorship process ASAP. You really should have started it when you originally returned to Canada, as given Mexico's processing times, he would be near the end of the process by now.

He can definitely try for a TRV; some people do manage to get approval. However, given the fact that he clearly intends to remain in Canada permanently and has both a Canadian partner and a Canadian child, his chances of approval are low.