Housing crisis in Canada

[GandiBaat]

Just a note to the 2 "Vancouver" apartments. They are in North Vancouver and were both built in 1970s.
North Van and Vancouver are connected with 2 bridges . The one to DT Vancouver is called Lion's gate bridge. During peak hours, crossing the bridge can take over an hour (instead of 10 min). But North Van is a nice city. Careful with older strata condo is for the extra cost owners need to pay for fixing and maintaing these buildings.

Just to add, a lot of people from north van take a ferry called "seabus" to travel to downtown. It departs usually every 15 minutes or so and takes about 10-15 minutes to cross water. Pretty comfy. It leaves you right in the middle of downtown. On a good day you can reach vancouver in 15-20 mins via seabus. On a bad day 30 mins. On a really bad day, Seabus is suspended.

 

[steaky]

Supply is the biggest issue. Compare prices of Calgary and Toronto / Vancouver. Calgary has flat plains and a reserve of land for 30 years of expansion. Toronto and Vancouver have real and artificial barriers for expansion of land. Real in terms of geography and artificial in terms of NIMBYism, Green Belt, ALR. This is why Calgary house prices remain sane and Vancouver / Toronto go insane.

There are not enough buyers in Calgary to drive up the prices. Most people want to live in Vancouver or Toronto (first port of entry to Canada from international).

 

[steaky]

Job opportunuties usually don't change for most of the occupations from one city to another. As an accountant I can confidently say that my occupation is needed even in remote villages in the far north. Finding a job in any major city shouldn't be an issue. At least finding one in Montreal is neither easier nor harder than finding one in Vancouver. Same goes for chefs, healthcare workers, salespeople, barbers etc. Smaller cities obviously have less vacant jobs, but they also have less competition for those jobs.

Only spesific jobs like maritime engineers, petrolium engineers, some IT jobs must seek employment in certain cities due to the nature of their jobs. If your occupation is limiting you to Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa and Calgary. Well, I think you should settle in those cities even though there is a massive housing crisis is going on.

I'd like to clarify one thing though. I'm not saying people should go settle in a remote village and live with polar bears or anything like that. All I'm saying is there are other major cities in Canada with relatively affordable housing markets, which you can still enjoy a vibrant city life, and have all the amenities you can possible have in Vancouver, but live in your own house for the same money people rent a small 1 room apartment in North Vancouver. Everyone is free to decide whatever they like, but that's my opinion on this matter.

Why are you keep on saying there is massive housing crises in Calgary? Certainly there are homeless in Calgary. Homelessness is not an issue in Montreal?

 

[GandiBaat]

There are not enough buyers in Calgary to drive up the prices. Most people want to live in Vancouver or Toronto (first port of entry to Canada from international).

Calgary is a city of 1.3 million people and its growing. It has more people than vancouver proper. Its not the lack of buyers in Calgary. Its the proper planning and sprawl of suburbs that keeps the city housing prices in check.

 

[canuck78]

Calgary is a city of 1.3 million people and its growing. It has more people than vancouver proper. Its not the lack of buyers in Calgary. Its the proper planning and sprawl of suburbs that keeps the city housing prices in check.

Prices would be increasing if the city was growing as fast as you say. Calgary’s economy is keeping it’s real estate prices in check.

 

[canuck78]

Supply is the biggest issue. Compare prices of Calgary and Toronto / Vancouver. Calgary has flat plains and a reserve of land for 30 years of expansion. Toronto and Vancouver have real and artificial barriers for expansion of land. Real in terms of geography and artificial in terms of NIMBYism, Green Belt, ALR. This is why Calgary house prices remain sane and Vancouver / Toronto go insane.

Toronto has few artificial barriers which is why Hamilton and Barrie have now essentially become GTA suburbs. People are forced to purchase so far out of the GTA due to prices not due to lack of housing stock. Currently there is certainly a lack of supply but many are not wanting to move during the pandemic. Prices did not keep on going up for around 20 years at the rate it did purely due to lack of supply. They went up because borrowing is so cheap plus a large number of people (residents in Canada, companies and international investors) started investing in real estate because returns were so good. Putting in policies that will favour first time purchasers versus investors and Canadian buyers would help the issue but if interest rates remain low it will be very hard to control prices. There are certain new developments in the GTA where many homes are owned by international buyers. Certain developers have gone after mostly Chinese buyers. That is not the primary issue but certainly doesn’t help the situation. You can build as many houses as you want but if people can’t afford to purchase then it doesn’t matter. In places like the GTA many never moved up from their starter homes and instead stayed and renovated because there isn’t much stock between a small condo and a 1-1.5 million dollar home. “Missing middle” is a huge issue. When most get mortgages monthly payment is what they look at. Due to low interest rates many are able to carry larger mortgages. If interest rates had been higher that would have controlled the rate of price growth substantially. Greater Van has always been a special market because of the Rockies. One of the reasons condos were common in Vancouver way before the rest of Canada. They had recognized that they needed a more dense housing stock.

 

[Western Mountain Man]

Prices would be increasing if the city was growing as fast as you say. Calgary’s economy is keeping it’s real estate prices in check.

Who wants to live in Calgary ?
Well, maybe if you like to attend the ' Stampede ' .

 

[GandiBaat]

Who wants to live in Calgary ?
Well, maybe if you like to attend the ' Stampede ' .

Well, 1.3 million people living in Calgary can tell you who wants to live in Calgary.
BTW, that number is more than that of vancouver proper (nor including likes of Pitts Meadow or Surrey).

 

[Western Mountain Man]

Well, 1.3 million people living in Calgary can tell you who wants to live in Calgary.
BTW, that number is more than that of vancouver proper (nor including likes of Pitts Meadow or Surrey).

Yea, been there a few times.
It was 90 degrees outside and everyone was wearing cowboy boots and jeans.

The correct name for one of the Vancouver municipalities is ' Pitt Meadows . '

 

[GandiBaat]

Prices would be increasing if the city was growing as fast as you say. Calgary’s economy is keeping it’s real estate prices in check.

Calgary went from 988K to 1.23M from 2006 to 2016. Total growth of 0.242M people
Metro Vancouver went from 2.19M to 2.46M from 2006 to 2016. Total growth of 0.27M people

Lets leave percentage wise growth because we assume most of the growth was due to immigration or migration. Calgary, in absolute term grew quite a bit even when you compare entire Metro Vancouver which is actually a combination of 4-5 cities.

In this decade, Calgary has seen a price movement of 100-250K in all types of homes.

Greater Vancouver? I will leave this here:

 

[steaky]

Toronto has few artificial barriers which is why Hamilton and Barrie have now essentially become GTA suburbs. People are forced to purchase so far out of the GTA due to prices not due to lack of housing stock. Currently there is certainly a lack of supply but many are not wanting to move during the pandemic. Prices did not keep on going up for around 20 years at the rate it did purely due to lack of supply. They went up because borrowing is so cheap plus a large number of people (residents in Canada, companies and international investors) started investing in real estate because returns were so good. Putting in policies that will favour first time purchasers versus investors and Canadian buyers would help the issue but if interest rates remain low it will be very hard to control prices. There are certain new developments in the GTA where many homes are owned by international buyers. Certain developers have gone after mostly Chinese buyers. That is not the primary issue but certainly doesn’t help the situation. You can build as many houses as you want but if people can’t afford to purchase then it doesn’t matter. In places like the GTA many never moved up from their starter homes and instead stayed and renovated because there isn’t much stock between a small condo and a 1-1.5 million dollar home. “Missing middle” is a huge issue. When most get mortgages monthly payment is what they look at. Due to low interest rates many are able to carry larger mortgages. If interest rates had been higher that would have controlled the rate of price growth substantially. Greater Van has always been a special market because of the Rockies. One of the reasons condos were common in Vancouver way before the rest of Canada. They had recognized that they needed a more dense housing stock.

Returns were so good? No, for international investors, certain percentage of their gross sales of their home are to be withhold and taxed. In comparison, there are other overseas jurisdictions doesn't require those sellers to withhold and pay tax when they sold their home. Even the Canadian rental market, the tenancy is so lenient to the tenants....

 

[RocketCity]

Who wants to live in Calgary ?
Well, maybe if you like to attend the ' Stampede ' .

Why wouldn't you? Sure it gets cold, but that just means a longer skiing/snowboarding season. Calgary is great if you love the outdoors.

 

[canuck78]

Calgary went from 988K to 1.23M from 2006 to 2016. Total growth of 0.242M people
Metro Vancouver went from 2.19M to 2.46M from 2006 to 2016. Total growth of 0.27M people

Lets leave percentage wise growth because we assume most of the growth was due to immigration or migration. Calgary, in absolute term grew quite a bit even when you compare entire Metro Vancouver which is actually a combination of 4-5 cities.

In this decade, Calgary has seen a price movement of 100-250K in all types of homes.

Greater Vancouver? I will leave this here:

You can’t put up this chart and talk about Calgary’s growth and not mention that it was a period of record high oil prices. To have an accurate picture you need the past 5 years so you can see what happened after oil prices went down and continued to be low. Growth was driven by oil prices and the well paid jobs attached to oil (some without many skills or education). Home prices did go down and then went flat and many left Calgary (or Alberta) when the well paying oil jobs and the jobs dependent on the high paying jobs disappeared.

 

[canuck78]

Returns were so good? No, for international investors, certain percentage of their gross sales of their home are to be withhold and taxed. In comparison, there are other overseas jurisdictions doesn't require those sellers to withhold and pay tax when they sold their home. Even the Canadian rental market, the tenancy is so lenient to the tenants....

International investors or numbered companies registered abroad aren’t paying capital gains taxes in Canada. International investors also may just be parking money in real estate for various reasons from having cash in a safe and predictable country to money laundering. Foreign investors may also put ownership in a family member’s name as their primary residence if they have status in Canada.

 

[steaky]

International investors or numbered companies registered abroad aren’t paying capital gains taxes in Canada. International investors also may just be parking money in real estate for various reasons from having cash in a safe and predictable country to money laundering. Foreign investors may also put ownership in a family member’s name as their primary residence if they have status in Canada.

Surely anyone aren't paying capital gain taxes especially if they incurred a capital loss. In addition to fluctuations in currency exchange rates, they might get furher losses. International investors may also be buying up real estate for various reasons from a family member studying in Canada to having idea to immigrate, vacation/holiday or return to the country for retirement ... if they have status in Canada.