Canadian Marrying Immigrant on Overstayed Visa

[Miraclejj]

Have spent a lot of time looking for answers and this forum has been the most helpful. If anyone could help me I would greatly appreciate it. Here is the story.

"Alex" was 26 when he came to Toronto from Poland on a Visitor Visa in February 2015 with his uncle's family. He was turned around at the airport for insufficient funds and sent back to Poland. He returned to Toronto in June with sufficient funds. He told CIC he was attending a family function, and was granted a 2 week stay in Canada, and had a notice stapled to his passport that he was required to report to Canadian Immigration authorities in two weeks time prior to his departure.

He never showed up. There is anecdotal evidence that he managed to gain a visitors visa, but if true he never had it extended. He has been working illegally and under the table as an unskilled labourer in Canada for 4 years. He joined a social group in Toronto populated by many young ladies, and reached out to several hoping to find a Canadian wife.

My daughter Sarah was the lucky one chosen. She was a 20-year-old college student at the time. Alex began asking her if she wanted to get married about 3 months after they met. With his passport about to expire this year, Alex finally sealed the deal this week when he presented her with a diamond ring in a proposal she accepted.

While deeply suspicious of his intentions, we have helped Alex with many things over the last 3.5 years including work, medical care, etc. Our pleas to our daughter that she is too young to get married, and that committing to someone who has been breaking the law for 4 years is not the ideal way to start married life, have fallen on deaf ears.

Alex looked at different avenues to gain Canadian residency but without success. He is uneducated, has no technical or trade skills, and has minimal English language skills. On the "point system" he was not even close.

I was shocked to learn that Canada is totally onside with Alex's plans, and that his 4 years of working illegally and paying no taxes will pose no barrier to gaining permanent resident status in Canada... provided he marries a Canadian girl.

I am trying to understand what my daughter Sarah is up against when it comes to Alex being able to gain residency status and legally work in Canada (and get a health card/drivers license). From reading this great forum my understanding is that once they get married, that Sarah can start his inland spousal sponsorship application immediately. And I understand he does not have to leave Canada, provided they are married, and the inland sponsorship application is underway.

Sarah has been employed for about 2 months in a job that pays $40K a year. She still lives at home. I am assuming after they get married, they will get an apartment. Sarah has a student loan she is repaying and really couldn't afford to support them both living in expensive Toronto, so I am assuming that Alex will continue to work illegally until he gets his open work permit.

If Alex is caught working illegally during the inland sponsorship process, what would happen to that application?

How long does the inland spousal sponsorship usually take front to back?

I am assuming that if married no interview would be required to determine the legitimacy of the relationship?

If Alex was discovered in Canada before the marriage for over staying his visa and/or illegally working, would he be removed from Canada even though he was engaged and a marriage was upcoming?

If he was removed for overstaying his visa and/or working illegally could they then try the outland sponsorship path?

There is so much uncertainty that Sarah is up against that she is stressed out. Despite being 100% opposed to their plans, I don't want to feed her disinformation, and would like for her to at least have the facts. We have been to a couple of immigration consultants, but because his exact status with CIC is fuzzy... not sure if he is under a current removal order or deportation order... they couldn't help us much.

If anyone here has answers to any of these questions I would be eternally grateful.

The other major issue that both you and Sarah need to weight heavily is that once Alex gained PR status, your daughter will be financially responsible to pay back any social assistance that Alex might get for 3 years. Not even a divorce will relieve Sarah from this responsibility. Well, what I am saying is that from what you described here about this "Alex", there probably would be a fat chance that he would be a huge burden for your daughter. If Sarah was my daughter, I would try everything within my power to stop this nonsense.

 

[zardoz]

Just wanted to add, as a Canadian citizen, she would only get 90 days in Poland without explicitly applying for a visa, which may well not be granted.
Contrary to popular belief, Canadians have no automatic right to just "go and stay" in other countries.

https://ottawa.msz.gov.pl/en/consular_information/visa/

Canadian citizens

Canadian citizens are allowed to enter and remain in Poland without a visa for up to 90 days within a six months period no matter what the purpose of the visit is (tourism, study, work, business, etc.). A work permit might be required to work legally in Poland even if a visa is not required.

If you intend to stay in Poland for more than 90 days, you will need a visa or a resident permit.

 

[scylla]

The other major issue that both you and Sarah need to weight heavily is that once Alex gained PR status, your daughter will be financially responsible to pay back any social assistance that Alex might get for 3 years. Not even a divorce will relieve Sarah from this responsibility. Well, what I am saying is that from what you described here about this "Alex", there probably would be a fat chance that he would be a huge burden for your daughter. If Sarah was my daughter, I would try everything within my power to stop this nonsense.

This is a biggie. Potentially tens of thousands of dollars.

 

[zardoz]

The other major issue that both you and Sarah need to weight heavily is that once Alex gained PR status, your daughter will be financially responsible to pay back any social assistance that Alex might get for 3 years. Not even a divorce will relieve Sarah from this responsibility. Well, what I am saying is that from what you described here about this "Alex", there probably would be a fat chance that he would be a huge burden for your daughter. If Sarah was my daughter, I would try everything within my power to stop this nonsense.

This could easily be 10k+ per year.

 

[scylla]

Just wanted to add, as a Canadian citizen, she would only get 90 days in Poland without explicitly applying for a visa, which may well not be granted.
Contrary to popular belief, Canadians have no automatic right to just "go and stay" in other countries.

https://ottawa.msz.gov.pl/en/consular_information/visa/

Canadian citizens

Canadian citizens are allowed to enter and remain in Poland without a visa for up to 90 days within a six months period no matter what the purpose of the visit is (tourism, study, work, business, etc.). A work permit might be required to work legally in Poland even if a visa is not required.

If you intend to stay in Poland for more than 90 days, you will need a visa or a resident permit.

She could apply for a Working Holiday Visa to Poland as a way to live there temporarily. This would allow her to live there for 12 months.

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/canadians/international-experience-canada.html

 

[zardoz]

She could apply for a Working Holiday Visa to Poland as a way to live there temporarily. This would allow her to live there for 12 months.

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/canadians/international-experience-canada.html

Agreed, that would be a possibility. It's still a formal application for resident status.

 

[Eveslm]

The other major issue that both you and Sarah need to weight heavily is that once Alex gained PR status, your daughter will be financially responsible to pay back any social assistance that Alex might get for 3 years. Not even a divorce will relieve Sarah from this responsibility. Well, what I am saying is that from what you described here about this "Alex", there probably would be a fat chance that he would be a huge burden for your daughter. If Sarah was my daughter, I would try everything within my power to stop this nonsense.

Big one here

 

[BabyCat]

Scylla,

Thanks again. You seem very knowledgeable. I appreciate you taking the time to respond.

I found a folder that my daughter keeps on Alex's immigration file. Turns out that he was given a temporary resident visa that expired Jan 31, 2016. So he did deal with his order to appear to immigration authorities within two weeks of arriving and prior to his first ordered departure date. Nevertheless he has still overstayed his visa by 3 years. But I discovered that CIC has his current address, and they have made no contact with him personally, by telephone, or by mail... so they obviously are not too bothered about his overstaying his temporary resident visa by 3 years.

Just curious what CIC would do with an application from Sarah in 2020 for an inland spousal sponsorship. I get the feeling from you that CIC will have no real interest in what Alex has been doing in Canada for the previous 4 years. Seems like their prime question will be whether the relationship is legitimate, and because Sarah and Alex have 4 years of photos and text dialogues, they will discover it is legitimate... and Sarah will wait her 12 months and Alex will gain his PR.

As a life long Canadian it seems unreal to me that none of Alex's previous shenanigans will be held against him. He lied on his temporary visa application by saying he was unemployed when he was working full time. He has been illegally working full time the entire time he has been in Canada. He has declared none of that income and paid no income taxes. But if I understand you correctly none of that will factor in.

And knowing Alex... he will continue working full time during the 12 months it takes to process the inland spousal sponsorship... and although that is also illegal, if CIC takes zero interest in what he is doing, it might as well be legal.

It seems like this system really makes young ladies in Canada very vulnerable. Alex has flaunted the immigration rules of Canada since day one. He proposed to at least two other Canadian girls. He proposed to my daughter within 3 months of meeting her. She does his banking, got him his current job, drives him around town, and looks after his every need. His master plan of immigrating to Canada is working beautifully... all thanks to the very accommodating folks at CIC.

Boy do I feel like calling that immigration tip line.

BabyCat

 

[YamPower]

Boy do I feel like calling that immigration tip line.

BabyCat

I understand your concern but you have to let your daughter make her own mistakes (if this is one). If my mother got my fiancé deported I would never speak to her again.

 

[BabyCat]

YamPower,

What I have discovered is that the younger and the older often have very different ideas about the value of letting young people make their own mistakes. But I haven't called the tip line, and as tempting as it is, I don't plan to.

I could see through Alex's act within one month of my daughter meeting him. That is when I should have called the tip line. And the thought crossed my mind at the time, but I was utterly shocked that Sarah fell for Alex and his act. It was patently obvious to anyone who has been around the block what Alex was up too... but to Sarah it was true "luuuuuvvvvv."

BabyCat

 

[canuck_in_uk]

Scylla,

Thanks again. You seem very knowledgeable. I appreciate you taking the time to respond.

I found a folder that my daughter keeps on Alex's immigration file. Turns out that he was given a temporary resident visa that expired Jan 31, 2016. So he did deal with his order to appear to immigration authorities within two weeks of arriving and prior to his first ordered departure date. Nevertheless he has still overstayed his visa by 3 years. But I discovered that CIC has his current address, and they have made no contact with him personally, by telephone, or by mail... so they obviously are not too bothered about his overstaying his temporary resident visa by 3 years.

Just curious what CIC would do with an application from Sarah in 2020 for an inland spousal sponsorship. I get the feeling from you that CIC will have no real interest in what Alex has been doing in Canada for the previous 4 years. Seems like their prime question will be whether the relationship is legitimate, and because Sarah and Alex have 4 years of photos and text dialogues, they will discover it is legitimate... and Sarah will wait her 12 months and Alex will gain his PR.

As a life long Canadian it seems unreal to me that none of Alex's previous shenanigans will be held against him. He lied on his temporary visa application by saying he was unemployed when he was working full time. He has been illegally working full time the entire time he has been in Canada. He has declared none of that income and paid no income taxes. But if I understand you correctly none of that will factor in.

And knowing Alex... he will continue working full time during the 12 months it takes to process the inland spousal sponsorship... and although that is also illegal, if CIC takes zero interest in what he is doing, it might as well be legal.

It seems like this system really makes young ladies in Canada very vulnerable. Alex has flaunted the immigration rules of Canada since day one. He proposed to at least two other Canadian girls. He proposed to my daughter within 3 months of meeting her. She does his banking, got him his current job, drives him around town, and looks after his every need. His master plan of immigrating to Canada is working beautifully... all thanks to the very accommodating folks at CIC.

Boy do I feel like calling that immigration tip line.

BabyCat

A TRV has nothing to do with status in Canada. That does not mean that he had status until Jan 31st, 2016. It just means that he could board a plane to travel to Canada up to that date.

Don't sit back and be offended without doing anything. REPORT HIM. It will be investigated.

It doesn't make young ladies vulnerable. Your daughter is making her own bad choices.

 

[canuck78]

YamPower,

What I have discovered is that the younger and the older often have very different ideas about the value of letting young people make their own mistakes. But I haven't called the tip line, and as tempting as it is, I don't plan to.

I could see through Alex's act within one month of my daughter meeting him. That is when I should have called the tip line. And the thought crossed my mind at the time, but I was utterly shocked that Sarah fell for Alex and his act. It was patently obvious to anyone who has been around the block what Alex was up too... but to Sarah it was true "luuuuuvvvvv."

BabyCat

I would be tempted to call. A real relationship would weather trials and tribulations and perhaps a separation. Would suggest a prenup if she has more money than him. His uncle got deported. Deporting someone is actually pretty costly and labour intensive so CIC hopes people lose their job, need regular healthcare, miss their family, etc. and go home.

 

[YamPower]

YamPower,

What I have discovered is that the younger and the older often have very different ideas about the value of letting young people make their own mistakes. But I haven't called the tip line, and as tempting as it is, I don't plan to.

I could see through Alex's act within one month of my daughter meeting him. That is when I should have called the tip line. And the thought crossed my mind at the time, but I was utterly shocked that Sarah fell for Alex and his act. It was patently obvious to anyone who has been around the block what Alex was up too... but to Sarah it was true "luuuuuvvvvv."

BabyCat

She doesn't have the maturity or understanding of immigration to see through it. Alex would not be able to pull this off within the Polish community. That's why he proposed to other Canadian girls. He wants someone who doesn't know the system. At the end of the day, love, or the illusion of it, makes people do stupid things. Youth compounds that.

I question whether he's just in it for PR because he's stuck around for four years but because I know for a fact that that Polish men are notoriously stingy he will likely continue to take what he can get from her. Do you know of any gifts that he's given her over the years?

 

[scylla]

Scylla,

Thanks again. You seem very knowledgeable. I appreciate you taking the time to respond.

I found a folder that my daughter keeps on Alex's immigration file. Turns out that he was given a temporary resident visa that expired Jan 31, 2016. So he did deal with his order to appear to immigration authorities within two weeks of arriving and prior to his first ordered departure date. Nevertheless he has still overstayed his visa by 3 years. But I discovered that CIC has his current address, and they have made no contact with him personally, by telephone, or by mail... so they obviously are not too bothered about his overstaying his temporary resident visa by 3 years.

Just curious what CIC would do with an application from Sarah in 2020 for an inland spousal sponsorship. I get the feeling from you that CIC will have no real interest in what Alex has been doing in Canada for the previous 4 years. Seems like their prime question will be whether the relationship is legitimate, and because Sarah and Alex have 4 years of photos and text dialogues, they will discover it is legitimate... and Sarah will wait her 12 months and Alex will gain his PR.

As a life long Canadian it seems unreal to me that none of Alex's previous shenanigans will be held against him. He lied on his temporary visa application by saying he was unemployed when he was working full time. He has been illegally working full time the entire time he has been in Canada. He has declared none of that income and paid no income taxes. But if I understand you correctly none of that will factor in.

And knowing Alex... he will continue working full time during the 12 months it takes to process the inland spousal sponsorship... and although that is also illegal, if CIC takes zero interest in what he is doing, it might as well be legal.

It seems like this system really makes young ladies in Canada very vulnerable. Alex has flaunted the immigration rules of Canada since day one. He proposed to at least two other Canadian girls. He proposed to my daughter within 3 months of meeting her. She does his banking, got him his current job, drives him around town, and looks after his every need. His master plan of immigrating to Canada is working beautifully... all thanks to the very accommodating folks at CIC.

Boy do I feel like calling that immigration tip line.

BabyCat

Yes - you're right. As long as the relationship is genuine, the application process may very well go quite smoothly. I do expect they will look at the relationship more closely given how long he's been here without status and it's possible he may be called to an interview. However as previously mentioned, the relationship is quite a long one with your daughter which will support a positive outcome to sponsorship (IMO).

The reality is that your daughter is an adult and old enough to make her own decisions. Unfortunately it sounds like she has chosen to be in a relationship with someone who is a user/jerk. That's her choice and it isn't IRCC's role to relationship babysit.

 

[BabyCat]

canuck_in_uk

Ya... you are right. It's true... my daughter is making her own bad choices. I have spent countless hours talking to my daughter about her bad choices, which hasn't gotten me anywhere. I have been trying to talk up the immigration problems, headaches, and stress she is setting herself up for, and came here to get some facts. Only to learn that she probably won't have much of a problem getting this guy PR status through an inland spousal sponsorship... as long as he isn't caught before the wedding date.

But since CIC knows where he is, knows he had very, very limited funds when arriving and has to be working... there seems very little chance that he will be caught... as long as he doesn't commit a major crime between now and then.

I apologize if I am whining a little bit... just doing a bit of venting. Been a very, very frustrating week with this engagement announced on Valentine's Day.

BabyCat