Police certificate - what kind of offences are allowed?

[Frippy]

Hello dear All!

Finally I am waiting for the Express Entry draw and I am worrying about the information that Israeli police can put into the Police Certificate.

In 2012 I had a problem with my ex wife and finally I got a criminal record, But the case was closed with mark (translated from Hebrew) "Without conviction of all offenses". This case was about "family matters".
Another case - just investigation - was opened and closed because of lack of evidences.

So, I am clean but I have these two records.
Does anybody know what can Canadian government decide about this type of records?

Thank you all for the information and suggestions.

PS: I reviewed my "Certificate of good conduct", not a Police Certificate that will be send because in Israel we cannot review our Police Certificates - the Police sends them straight to the Canadian Embassy.

 

[zardoz]

Hello dear All!

Finally I am waiting for the Express Entry draw and I am worrying about the information that Israeli police can put into the Police Certificate.

In 2012 I had a problem with my ex wife and finally I got a criminal record, But the case was closed with mark (translated from Hebrew) "Without conviction of all offenses". This case was about "family matters".
Another case - just investigation - was opened and closed because of lack of evidences.

So, I am clean but I have these two records.
Does anybody know what can Canadian government decide about this type of records?

Thank you all for the information and suggestions.

PS: I reviewed my "Certificate of good conduct", not a Police Certificate that will be send because in Israel we cannot review our Police Certificates - the Police sends them straight to the Canadian Embassy.

IRCC will probably ask you to provide court or police records for the cases if they want more details.

 

[Frippy]

IRCC will probably ask you to provide court or police records for the cases if they want more details.

Thank you for the answer.
I do not think it can be a problem to get all documents/information, translate and provide. I would like to know it my "family matters" since 2012 can will not impact Canadian Government's decision. Can I find an info about cases that can be accepted by EE or rejected? Or just all of them are personal and there is no statistics?

 

[zardoz]

Thank you for the answer.
I do not think it can be a problem to get all documents/information, translate and provide. I would like to know it my "family matters" since 2012 can will not impact Canadian Government's decision. Can I find an info about cases that can be accepted by EE or rejected? Or just all of them are personal and there is no statistics?

It's case by case. There are no statistical records available as far as I know..

 

[LifeDreamer]

Were you given any kind of sentence/penalty for your offense in 2012? Did you reach an agreement with the prosecutor or the judge in which you fully or partially admit your guilt or responsibility in exchange for closing the case without conviction?

 

[Frippy]

Were you given any kind of sentence/penalty for your offense in 2012? Did you reach an agreement with the prosecutor or the judge in which you fully or partially admit your guilt or responsibility in exchange for closing the case without conviction?

Firstly, I am sorry because I mentioned 2012 instead of 2008.
Answering your question, I got nothing. In the internal (Israeli, not for Embassy) police certificate written:

Order of Obligation to Refrain from Transfer: NIS 5,000.
The contract period: 12 months.
Violations: Any offense of violence or threats in the family. Imprisonment: 30 days

So, I signed the document that IF something will happen I will pay 5000 ILS.
No prisons, no fines.

By the way, do I need to say YES answering the question "Has ROMAN ever committed, been arrested for, been charged with or convicted of any criminal offence in any country?: (required)"

I have been arrested but just for explanation of the situation, not as a criminal.

 

[LifeDreamer]

It looks like what you have is similar to a conditional discharge in Canada although I wouldn't say it is equivalent because your charges are supposed to go off your record after a few years.

It appears you have accepted a conditional order to avoid going to jail. I don't know how the officer will interpret it, but to me this order has an implicit assertion that you were guilty otherwise it would have stipulated that you go trial upon committing any violation. In the text you have, the sentence is automatic, so there must have been a guilty determination. I can't tell you for sure without examining the court documents.

However, the good news for you, since it is the only charge you have and it's been almost 10 years there is a good chance it'll qualify for an exception regardless of whether the case officer thinks you're guilty or not. In any case, worst case scenario if this charge would be a problem the case officer will just ask you to fill out the rehabilitation application along with your PR and call you in for an interview.

 

[LifeDreamer]

By the way, do I need to say YES answering the question "Has ***** ever committed, been arrested for, been charged with or convicted of any criminal offence in any country?: (required)"

I have been arrested but just for explanation of the situation, not as a criminal.

Yes, without a doubt. You've been at least charged and that's more than enough to have the case disclosed.

If in Israel you were arrested it will be regarded as criminal unless you have a very convincing explanation, this is because Israel is a free democratic country and there should be protection against unlawful seizures or deprivation of liberty except for being suspected of committing a crime.

In any case, you would also check Yes for having been detained, incarcerated or put in jail if you were detained overnight and for that question it is irrelevant whether it is due to a crime or something else.

 

[Frippy]

Yes, without a doubt.

LifeDreamer, thank you very much for your help and answers.

Today Israel has a program of "cleaning up police records" in honor of 70 years since the country was established.
I've send a request to the government to cleared my history and now I am waiting for their answer.
Now I am going to ask them IF my records will be clean in Israel WILL THEY send my police records clear to the Canadian Government or not..

Interesting, if the process of "whitening" will impact to the police record too (not only internal Israeli records) will I need to mark "Has ***** ever committed, been arrested for, been charged with or convicted of any criminal offence in any country?" as YES or no..?

 

[Frippy]

Yes, without a doubt. You've been at least charged and that's more than enough to have the case disclosed.

I was not charged. According to the statement, "IF something will happen I will pay 5000 ILS."

And.. if I answer YES the system asks for explanation.
What exactly I need to tell? The situation? What was happen?

 

[LifeDreamer]

There is no doubt you were charged. People don't find themselves in court for no reason and you can't expect a random person to agree to sign a conditional discharge if they were not being accused of a crime. Fact is you've been in legal trouble before and that have had consequences for you, and for this reason you're considered to have been charged whether the Israeli legal definition applies in your case or not.

Today Israel has a program of "cleaning up police records" in honor of 70 years since the country was established.
I've send a request to the government to cleared my history and now I am waiting for their answer.
Now I am going to ask them IF my records will be clean in Israel WILL THEY send my police records clear to the Canadian Government or not..

Interesting, if the process of "whitening" will impact to the police record too (not only internal Israeli records) will I need to mark "Has ***** ever committed, been arrested for, been charged with or convicted of any criminal offence in any country?" as YES or no..?

This is good, but unfortunately it will not relieve you from the obligation to disclose the charge in your application. The reason is because the question uses the word "ever" and so it always applies no matter how the record changes. If you answer incorrectly and Canada learns about your case you will be refused and prohibited from applying. If you were already in Canada as a citizen your citizenship could be cancelled and then you could be deported back to Israel. In your case, it would be the smart thing to disclose even if the record is erased because it will not negatively affect your application anyways.

One last thought for you.. Be careful how you phrase your words to Canadian official about your record don't try to downplay the incident or claim it was not criminal or else it will negatively affect your rehabilitation outlook. If you are seen as someone who doesn't take this matter seriously, they will think you may commit such offense in the future.

 

[Frippy]

Thank you very much for the explanation.

The final sentence is "it's better to say more that to say less" - Am I right in this particular case?

 

[LifeDreamer]

Actually it's better to say less and be brief. You just have to tick Yes and then write a short description in the lines of "In 2008 I was charged with XXX and was given a court order to refrain from XXX. Charges were dismissed in 2009."
You will then attach court documents which will tell the officers the whole story, they don't believe your words they only believe in your papers and documents. If you have an explanation for something however and you think the officers should know you can add it.

For the rehabilitation application however, it is the opposite. In that case the matter has already been put behind and they are examining you rather than your case, and so you are expected to dwell on the issue and explain your circumstances and why they should believe you will not be in trouble again in the future and show how your life has been in the last 10 years ..etc. It is a lengthy application and hopefully you will not have to complete it.