CIC miscalculation

[persianguy]

Hi everyone,

2 months ago there has been an increase on my score.

CIC actually increased my score 2 months before I complete 1 year of work experience here in Canada. I think it's because they counted the HOURS (as I work 40 hours per week, I hit the required number of hours in 10 months) not the months.

Now I received the Invitation to Apply letter, What shall I do ? shall I go ahead and apply for my PR ? (actually I will hit 12 months of full time work experience by the time I send my application)

Are they going to reject me ?

I have a very graduate education at high ranking university + high paying job (100+ k) Even if they made a mistake, are they going to still reject me considering that I'm eligible at the day officer opens my application.

 

[anarsoul]

Hi everyone,

2 months ago there has been an increase on my score.

CIC actually increased my score 2 months before I complete 1 year of work experience here in Canada. I think it's because they counted the HOURS (as I work 40 hours per week, I hit the required number of hours in 10 months) not the months.

Now I received the Invitation to Apply letter, What shall I do ? shall I go ahead and apply for my PR ? (actually I will hit 12 months of full time work experience by the time I send my application)

Are they going to reject me ?

I have a very graduate education at high ranking university + high paying job (100+ k) Even if they made a mistake, are they going to still reject me considering that I'm eligible at the day officer opens my application.

Just make sure that you have 1 year of experience on a day when you submit your application. Otherwise you have a chance to be rejected.

 

[persianguy]

I will have it by then , but a friend told me that my application was freezed when I received the invitation and even though I have 1 year of work experience when the officer opens the application , they may still reject it because at the time it was freezed I didn't have the work experience. Is that true ?

 

[anarsoul]

I will have it by then , but a friend told me that my application was freezed when I received the invitation and even though I have 1 year of work experience when the officer opens the application , they may still reject it because at the time it was freezed I didn't have the work experience. Is that true ?

Your friend is wrong. Your points will be re-evaluated after submission, and you may even lose points if you had a birthday between ITA and AOR.

 

[jes_ON]

2 months ago there has been an increase on my score.
CIC actually increased my score 2 months before I complete 1 year of work experience here in Canada. I think it's because they counted the HOURS (as I work 40 hours per week, I hit the required number of hours in 10 months) not the months.

CIC does not add up hours. "40 hours per week" is simply "full-time" to CIC.

CIC's automated system gives credit based on Month and Year only, whereas actual eligibility is calculated on the full date. For example, if you are eligible on December 30, the system only sees "December 2015" and assumes the one year is met on December 1. Similarly, if you started on January 31, the system will credit you with the month of January on January 1. In that very paricular circumstance, the system could give you nearly 2 months of extra experience.

But it is YOUR responsibility to ensure that you meet the requirements at the time of the ITA.

I will have it by then , but a friend told me that my application was freezed when I received the invitation and even though I have 1 year of work experience when the officer opens the application , they may still reject it because at the time it was freezed I didn't have the work experience. Is that true ?

You MUST qualify at the time of the ITA AND at the time of application. If you are found to have not qualified at the time of the ITA, you will be refused.

Even if you qualify, your CRS score could be recalculated based on your actual information - if it is below the threshold for the ITA in your round, the ITA could be cancelled.

Is it possible you qualify based on foreign work eperience as well?

How sure are you that the increase was based on Canadian work experience? Is it possible that something else contributed to the point increase?

 

[JoacRy]

I'm in a similar position whereby the end of December I will have worked for 376 days. Not got an ITA, but are you saying that if I get an ITA on say 18 Dec, I should refuse it because my 365 days comes up on 20 Dec?

 

[Asivad Anac]

I'm in a similar position whereby the end of December I will have worked for 376 days. Not got an ITA, but are you saying that if I get an ITA on say 18 Dec, I should refuse it because my 365 days comes up on 20 Dec?

Grey area. Some members opine that you are safe if you submit after 20 Dec while others insist that eligibility should be met on the day you get the ITA. I agree with the latter opinion because it is safer.

 

[CanadaWeCome]

Grey area. Some members opine that you are safe if you submit after 20 Dec while others insist that eligibility should be met on the day you get the ITA. I agree with the latter opinion because it is safer.

Dear Asiavad,
May i have your thoughts on my case below?
http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/crs-score-suddenly-reduced-please-help-t385313.0.html

Thanks in advance...

 

[thanuxxi]

I assume you have to fulfill the eligibility criteria when receiving ITA and not when submitting.
I would recommend you to play on the safe side and wait.

 

[AM198]

Grey area. Some members opine that you are safe if you submit after 20 Dec while others insist that eligibility should be met on the day you get the ITA. I agree with the latter opinion because it is safer.

CIC counts the time worked by months, not days under express entry. If someone started working on any day of January 2015, then on the 1st of December, the system will count them as having completed 1 year of work. I started working on October 1st 2013 and on September 1st, 2015, they started counting my work as 2 years. Below is a copy of the email sent to me by CIC about this subject:

Dear Client,

At this time, the system counts by month and year and gives candidates the benefit of the whole month when calculating the qualifying period of skilled work experience. Candidates are expected to be truthful in their Express Entry profile and application for permanent residence. If later a candidate is invited to apply and accepts the invitation, they would submit proof of the work history to demonstrate meeting the eligibility requirements of the program. Applicants are expected to provide reference letters from employer(s) and other supporting documents as requested in the document checklist.

 

[Asivad Anac]

CIC counts the time worked by months, not days under express entry. If someone started working on any day of January 2015, then on the 1st of December, the system will count them as having completed 1 year of work. I started working on October 1st 2013 and on September 1st, 2015, they started counting my work as 2 years. Below is a copy of the email sent to me by CIC about this subject:

Dear Client,

At this time, the system counts by month and year and gives candidates the benefit of the whole month when calculating the qualifying period of skilled work experience. Candidates are expected to be truthful in their Express Entry profile and application for permanent residence. If later a candidate is invited to apply and accepts the invitation, they would submit proof of the work history to demonstrate meeting the eligibility requirements of the program. Applicants are expected to provide reference letters from employer(s) and other supporting documents as requested in the document checklist.

Partly true. Nowhere does it state that having 1 year, 10 months and 2 days of experience (assuming the job started on Dec 31st 2013 and ended on 1st Nov 2015) would be treated the same as 24 months of experience. In such cases, applicants have to truthfully provide all information upfront and let CIC decide.

This also doesn't hold good for basic eligibility - one needs to prove 52 weeks of employment for that and not just 12 months granted by CIC application logic.

 

[CADparity]

you may even lose points if you had a birthday between ITA and AOR.

Not according to this (for the birthday only):

41.What happens to candidates who have a birthday after they receive an invitation to apply but before they submit their application for permanent residence?

An applicant may have a birthday after he or she receives an invitation to apply but before he or she submits an application for permanent residence. A change in age may lower his or her CRS score below the lowest score in the draw. It may also result in the applicant no longer meeting the minimum requirements. When a change in age results in the candidate no longer meeting the minimum entry criteria or lowering his or her CRS points score below the lowest points score in the draw, CIC officers are asked to apply the Public policy to exempt applicants for permanent residence from certain age-based requirements between invitation to apply and application. This public policy also grants an exemption to applicants who may be refused on FSW Class requirements for having a birthday between receiving an invitation to apply and submitting an application. In short, a candidate's age may be considered locked in once an invitation to apply has been issued.

http://www.canadavisa.com/express-entry-faq-candidates.html

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/department/laws-policy/exempt-applicants-pr.asp

 

[AM198]

Partly true. Nowhere does it state that having 1 year, 10 months and 2 days of experience (assuming the job started on Dec 31st 2013 and ended on 1st Nov 2015) would be treated the same as 24 months of experience. In such cases, applicants have to truthfully provide all information upfront and let CIC decide.

This also doesn't hold good for basic eligibility - one needs to prove 52 weeks of employment for that and not just 12 months granted by CIC application logic.

I'm just basing this on what the CIC written explanation says. I posted their email in my post above. They explicitly state that CIC gives benefit of the whole month even if you work one day in it. That doesn't leave much room for misinterpretation. According to that, there is definitely a certain scenario in which 1 year, 10 months and 2 days can be counted as two years of experience. If you start work on the last day of a certain month, the system will automatically consider you to have completed a year at the first day of the next preceding month (i.e. 30th Jan to 1st Dec is 1 year). I got an ITA in September based on this and my application has been approved and closed. I worked for 1 year, 11 months and 1 day and got the ITA based on 2 years work experience (about 466 points).

What they also explained to me is that you have to be absolutely truthful in what you enter into the system. The system specifically only asks for the year and month you start and end your employment. If they wanted to calculate it by day, they would have left an input for the day. They don't do that right now. CIC told me that it is our responsibility to ensure that we can prove what we filled in our profile. We will not be held responsible for the system making an incorrect calculation on its own.

 

[jes_ON]

I'm just basing this on what the CIC written explanation says. I posted their email in my post above. They explicitly state that CIC gives benefit of the whole month even if you work one day in it. That doesn't leave much room for misinterpretation.

Apparently, there IS room for misinterpretation/alternative interpretation. What the email says is that "at this time, the system gives credit..." which I take to mean the computerized EE system, and that it is not necessarily a good thing. It is not the same thing as saying "A visa officer will calculate it the same way when assessing your eligibility."

It is quite unfortunate that CIC cannot seem to explain things unambiguously (perhaps that's a learned skill).

If you are short 1-2 days out of 365, CIC has been known to accept that as 1 year. Short 1-2 weeks, however, those applications are usually refused.

 

[AM198]

Apparently, there IS room for misinterpretation/alternative interpretation. What the email says is that "at this time, the system gives credit..." which I take to mean the computerized EE system, and that it is not necessarily a good thing. It is not the same thing as saying "A visa officer will calculate it the same way when assessing your eligibility."

It is quite unfortunate that CIC cannot seem to explain things unambiguously (perhaps that's a learned skill).

If you are short 1-2 days out of 365, CIC has been known to accept that as 1 year. Short 1-2 weeks, however, those applications are usually refused.

I don't think you're understanding their email. If they change the system, they will make it obvious by requiring you to input the DAY as opposed to the month of your job start/finish. No one is saying that you can work for any 10 months and two days and get that counted as a year. What they are very explicitly stating is that under the current system, the system itself is giving you points for the whole month even if you work one day in it. That is NOT a misrepresentation on your part.

My point is that no one should be advising people to reject ITA's because of this issue when the applicant is clearly not in the wrong. Enter your dates correctly and let the system award you points. If people are still not sure, they can send a case specific inquiry to CIC and they will hear back before the 60 days are up.